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Just bought a new computer (Read 21 times)
Sep 8th, 2006 at 10:26am

kick_Z   Offline
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I think this should be a good FSX rig as soon as it comes out. Smiley

I don't build my own computers, I don't know enough about it. So you computer experts, go easy on me.  Embarrassed   Grin

XPS 700 Pentium® D Processor 930 with Dual Core Technology (3.00GHz, 800FSB)
Operating System Genuine Windows® XP Media Center 2005 Edition with re-installation CD
Memory 4GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 667MHz - 4 DIMMs
Keyboard Dell USB Keyboard
Monitor 20 inch Ultrasharp™ 2007FP Digital Flat Panel
Video Card 512MB nVidia GeForce 7900 GTX
Hard Drive 250GB Serial ATA 3Gb/s Hard Drive (7200RPM) w/DataBurst Cache™
Floppy Drive and Media Reader 13 in 1 Media Card Reader
Mouse Dell Optical USB Mouse
Modem No Modem Requested
Adobe Software Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 7.0
Optical Drive Dual Drives: 16x DVD-ROM Drive + 16x DVD+/-RW w/ dbl layer write capable
Sound Cards Sound Blaster® X-Fi™ XtremeMusic (D), w/Dolby® Digital 5.1
Speakers Dell AS501 10W Flat Panel Attached Spkrs for UltraSharp™ Flat Panels
Office Software (not included in Windows XP) No Pre-installed software
Security Software PC-cillin Internet Security with AntiVirus and Spyware removal 15-months
Hardware Warranty 1Yr Ltd Warranty, 1Yr At-Home Service, and 1Yr HW Warranty Support
XPS Specialized Support XPS, Specialized Support
Internet Access Service No ISP requested
Future Operating Systems Windows Vista™ Capable
SYSTEM DETAILS 2.5MM aluminum thickness Chassis with front & back customizable LEDs
SYSTEM DETAILS 7-slot, BTX design motherboard
SYSTEM DETAILS 750-watt Power Supply
SYSTEM DETAILS Tower Six-heat pipe, Copper base Heat Sink with aluminum fans
SYSTEM DETAILS Two 120mm x 38mm front fans
Dell Digital Entertainment Starter pack- Basic and trial products from Corel and Yahoo
 
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Reply #1 - Sep 8th, 2006 at 10:44am

Katahu   Offline
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You should have waited until after FSX was released. I hope your new rig was worth the purchase though.
 
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Reply #2 - Sep 8th, 2006 at 10:50am

kick_Z   Offline
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Why's that? Do you mean so I could get a DX10 video card?

I needed a new computer anyway. I could have waited a while, but I've been suffering with what I've got right now.  Wink
 
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Reply #3 - Sep 8th, 2006 at 1:22pm

Mav_316   Offline
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This is a laptop isn't it!  Shocked PRETTY AWESOME!

can you actually use FSX on this machine? I mean in part the use of a flight controller like SAitek X52 with this laptop. Is it just the keyboard you would use to control FSX?
 

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Reply #4 - Sep 8th, 2006 at 3:26pm

kick_Z   Offline
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Oh no, it's actually a desktop. This would be a pretty damn sweet laptop to take around with me though!  Grin Grin

I should get one...  Cheesy
 
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Reply #5 - Sep 8th, 2006 at 7:36pm

Calb   Offline
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I'm a Beta team member and I've been running FSX on my AMD 64 4000+, 1 Gb RAM and 6800GT vid card. Most of my sliders are at 75% or better and I get anywhere from 15-60 FPS. I recently increased RAM to 2 Gb to help in my video editing and image processing capacity. The increase had very little effect on FSX.

Don't pay any attention to the dire predictions of the uniformed. Once you get FSX (be sure to get the Deluxe), you'll soon have it tweaked to your satisfaction. The claim by one member of this forum that FSX won't run even in 2 Gb RAM is completely wrong.....

My 6800GT fan failed 3 days ago and I'm running FSX on my old system which is an AMD 64 2800+ w/1 Gb RAM and an old FX5200 video card. Most sliders are at or below 50% which gives me 20 FPS most of time. Quite adquate to continue testing.

To answer your question.... your system will be just fine.

Cal
 
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Reply #6 - Sep 8th, 2006 at 7:54pm

Katahu   Offline
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Quote:
The claim by one member of this forum that FSX won't run even in 2 Gb RAM is completely wrong.....


There are a few people in this dumb world  who believe that when one's own computer can't handle a particular software, they immediately assume that everyone else's computer can't handle that software. This is particularly true of those who don't even consider the possibility that their hardware may not be compatible with certain features or that they have loads of other crap installed onto their system as well or that they may have forgotten to do a defrag recently. Roll Eyes

Luckily, we don't have too many of those people in this dumb world. But then again, this is a dumb world after all and I may have underestimated the number of such people. Grin
 
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Reply #7 - Sep 10th, 2006 at 6:23pm

MattNW   Offline
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Quote:
There are a few people in this dumb world  who believe that when one's own computer can't handle a particular software, they immediately assume that everyone else's computer can't handle that software. This is particularly true of those who don't even consider the possibility that their hardware may not be compatible with certain features or that they have loads of other crap installed onto their system as well or that they may have forgotten to do a defrag recently. Roll Eyes

Luckily, we don't have too many of those people in this dumb world. But then again, this is a dumb world after all and I may have underestimated the number of such people. Grin



Not to mention those who think that flyable FPS means 160 or better.  Grin



@Calb

Nice to hear a voice of reason. I may reconsider getting FSX when it comes out. Even if I have to turn things down at present I'll still have FSX. I'm about due to build a new machine by next spring anyway. Just have to save all my pennies till then.  Wink
 

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Reply #8 - Sep 10th, 2006 at 10:51pm

Katahu   Offline
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Not to mention those who think that flyable FPS means 160 or better.


Especially when our eyeballs can only perceive up to 30 of those frames per second. Grin
 
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Reply #9 - Sep 10th, 2006 at 11:34pm

Daube   Offline
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Quote:
Especially when our eyeballs can only perceive up to 30 of those frames per second. Grin


It was already discussed in another topic.
Your eyes can only see 25 images per second, but that doesn't mean that your eyes cannot make the difference between 25 and 50 FPS.

This is called "sampling", just like in audio.

If you want to do a good 25FPS sampling, the original "movie" shoud be at least 2x sampling rate, that is 50 FPS. The same occurs when you want to do sound sampling Smiley

After 50 FPS, the eyes will not notice any difference anymore. Before 50 FPS, it will. That doesn't mean that 25 FPS is not enough, of course it is enough, but 30, 40 or 50 FPS are even better Wink
 
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Reply #10 - Sep 10th, 2006 at 11:49pm

Katahu   Offline
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So let me guess, those who have eye capable of perceiving 50+ frames per second are capable of seeing any subliminal messege posted between the individual frames of a commercial? Grin
 
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Reply #11 - Sep 11th, 2006 at 12:48am
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
So let me guess, those who have eye capable of perceiving 50+ frames per second are capable of seeing any subliminal messege posted between the individual frames of a commercial? Grin


yes, Hail Pete

as for the fram issue...

*sigh*

If 3D rendering were the same as watching a video what Daube posted would be correct but 3D rendering is not a video.

24 frames can look and feel just as smooth as 50 and you would not know the difference if I put you in front of a PROPERLY designed and PROPERLY set up system and ran both side by side.

Were people notice the difference is in the frame TRANSITIONS.

I have seen 40 frames look out of sync and 22 perfectly smooth.

3D is not video or film.
 
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Reply #12 - Sep 11th, 2006 at 1:35am

Katahu   Offline
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From what I remember, the individual frames of a film are somewhat blurry as opposed to the individual frame of a sim [which is not blurry]. That could be the key factor in all this. I don't know, I'm just guessing.
 
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Reply #13 - Sep 11th, 2006 at 2:37am

Ashton Lawson   Offline
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Well, in FS the helicopter blades are made to strobe like real film.  If the blades didn't change, and were just spinning blades, then things wouldn't be that great.  It would be good if ACES could develope themselfes a dll which would blur anything which moved at a high rate of speed. Wink
 

...&&FS Water Configurator+ has new modifications in the works, plus DirectX 10, Service Pack&&1, and Radeon HD 3+ Series support.
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Reply #14 - Sep 11th, 2006 at 3:38am
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
From what I remember, the individual frames of a film are somewhat blurry as opposed to the individual frame of a sim [which is not blurry]. That could be the key factor in all this. I don't know, I'm just guessing.



No.. video is sharp

Let me put this in a visual example:

VIDEO 40 FPS

______|______|______|______|______|______|______|______|______|______|

40 of these frames every second and exaclty ONE per .025 seconds without missing a beat

Its CONSTANT .. it never changes from one frame to the next. The video will always remain at its locked speed for every frame displayed.



3D GAME RENDER 40 FPS but does not seem smooth

_____|_______|__________|______|_______|___|___|_______|____|_______|

40 of these frames every second and BUT even though 40 frames get rendered in that 1 second time period they are not equal in transition time due to all sorts of different load changes on the system or a system that is not correctly set up. This is where tweaking and load balancing the computer with the sim is critical.




3D GAME RENDER 24 FPS and smooth as glass

_______|________|________|________|________|________|_______|________|

24 of these frames every second and even though rendering will never be EXACTLTY ONE per .041666 seconds, the difference is so small you dont see the changes.

The computer and the sim are in balance with each other. Loads do not cause severe transition changes, therefore the visual looks exactly the same as example #1


Thats the best I can do to make it clear with a forum post example


I ran an x800xt overclocked with it locked @ 22FPS for a year and I cant see the difference in smoothness and flight over my 7900GTX. The visual are cleaner and there is more to look at with the 7900GTX but with the exception of very, very heavy load situations there is absolutely no difference in how smooth my sim runs between 22 and 34 frames on two very different cards... nothing

I lock the 7900GTX @ 34 because lower it throws the sim out of balance with the computer and higher I get micro stutters in heavy traffic airports. @ 34 it is in perfect harmony with the loads being applied.

Flight sim is not couterstrike or other games... it is calculating a hell of a lot more in the background than a simple "shoot-em up" game. If a computer is not set up to FORCE the system to give FS9 all the resources it wants and at the same time the sim settings are not balanced for/with the available resources, the rendering will be choppy, stuttered and blurry no matter how high the frame lock is making it to on the counter.


Everybody makes the same mistake ... jack up the frame lock thinking since it will go that high they should set it that high. The fact of the matter is it should be set to about 35-45% LESS than what the card can do in FS9 so if the card can easily hit 50-60FPS with the sliders maxed @ 100%, cloudy day and 90% AI traffic, the frame lock should be between 24-35. The exact number requires testing and trial/error.




« Last Edit: Sep 11th, 2006 at 12:08pm by N/A »  
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Reply #15 - Sep 11th, 2006 at 8:23pm

Josquin   Offline
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XPS 700 Pentium® D Processor 930 with Dual Core Technology (3.00GHz, 800FSB)



I would change that for a new INTEL Core 2 Duo CPU... for a big hundred dollars more you'd get a E6600 which is twice more powerfull... but that's my 2 cents Smiley

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I've been FSGS'ed...
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Reply #16 - Sep 11th, 2006 at 8:35pm

Katahu   Offline
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I think SLI is supported more by FSX rather than dual core. But then again, I never tested a dual core before.
 
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Reply #17 - Sep 14th, 2006 at 1:04am

Daube   Offline
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Quote:
yes, Hail Pete

as for the fram issue...

*sigh*

If 3D rendering were the same as watching a video what Daube posted would be correct but 3D rendering is not a video.

24 frames can look and feel just as smooth as 50 and you would not know the difference if I put you in front of a PROPERLY designed and PROPERLY set up system and ran both side by side.

Were people notice the difference is in the frame TRANSITIONS.

I have seen 40 frames look out of sync and 22 perfectly smooth.

3D is not video or film.


Sure, but the frame rate variation that you describe in your other post can occur at 24 FPS as well.
I was just pointing the fact that YES, the human eyes CAN SEE the difference between something displayed (video or 3D) at 24 FPS and the same thing displayed at 48 FPS.

And yes, I understand that 24 FPS is just enough for the sim, but I dont agree with what was said before, stating that more than 24 FPS was useless because of human eye limitation. That's just wrong.
 
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Reply #18 - Sep 15th, 2006 at 11:21am

eniranjanrao   Offline
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I have three with various sepcs to run win 98 to XP but will not get a new one till Vista is launched as i have ram required min 1gb so vista may need min 4 gb vdo card of 1 gb Hd of 250 X 2 sets as i have heard so you can run all types of high end games.  Grin
 

I've been banned for constantly ignoring the forum rules, spamming, being abusive to mods and making false accusations against them. They've modified this profile to show everyone what happens to obnoxious foul-mouthed little idiots!
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Reply #19 - Sep 15th, 2006 at 6:02pm
cheesegrater   Ex Member

 
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Sure, but the frame rate variation that you describe in your other post can occur at 24 FPS as well.
I was just pointing the fact that YES, the human eyes CAN SEE the difference between something displayed (video or 3D) at 24 FPS and the same thing displayed at 48 FPS.

And yes, I understand that 24 FPS is just enough for the sim, but I dont agree with what was said before, stating that more than 24 FPS was useless because of human eye limitation. That's just wrong.


That's true, I've played Quake 2 with a frame lock of 30 fps, and I could definately tell it wasn't as smooth. The game was released in 1997, so there is no problem with the computer not rendering in exact intervals.
 
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Reply #20 - Sep 15th, 2006 at 11:29pm

Katahu   Offline
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The difference between games like Quake 4 and Flight Simulator is that the sim has to render an entire globe and to consider the complex calculations involved with managing AI traffic, scenery object, etc. that populate an area that measures a good 300 square miles. In games like Quake 4 and Doom 3, the game only has to render an area of only about one square mile since you're only on foot most of the time which means that the game doesn't take much resources. Basically, it wouldn't matter how powerful the computer is. The sim's calculations alone would bring the system to its knees. So, I still think it was best to wait for the latest hardware to come out next year so that you could save a good $100 bucks on the current hardware when you buy them next year.
 
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Reply #21 - Sep 16th, 2006 at 9:38pm
cheesegrater   Ex Member

 
Quote:
The difference between games like Quake 4 and Flight Simulator is that the sim has to render an entire globe and to consider the complex calculations involved with managing AI traffic, scenery object, etc. that populate an area that measures a good 300 square miles. In games like Quake 4 and Doom 3, the game only has to render an area of only about one square mile since you're only on foot most of the time which means that the game doesn't take much resources. Basically, it wouldn't matter how powerful the computer is. The sim's calculations alone would bring the system to its knees. So, I still think it was best to wait for the latest hardware to come out next year so that you could save a good $100 bucks on the current hardware when you buy them next year.


I wasn't talking about the difference between Quake and FS. I was just pointing out you can tell the difference between 30 fps and 60 fps.

However, since you brought up the subject up, FS will render a large area, a FPS will render a smaller area, but the area in the FPS will be more detailed than in FS, so it is same thing. For example a building in a FPS will be much more detailed than in FS. It will have several times more polygons and more detailed textures.

Also, the physics in FPS's are getting complex too with destructable environments, damage modeling, and projectile physics. They no longer use simple hitboxes or skyboxes.

The point is games are developed to take full advantage of the current hardware, regardless of what type of game it is. It's not like FPS are 3 years behind simulators, they are on the same level.
 
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Reply #22 - Sep 17th, 2006 at 5:43am

Ashton Lawson   Offline
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Techinically,  Quake renders a scene creating and destroying polygons in the terrain, but not degrading them.  Degredation is done on characters and such.

In FS, degredation is done to everything to a point where the degredation completely takes away every polygon.  FS doesn't render the entire world, it renders as far as it can see, and degrades areas depending on distance...

If thats too technical for you, u shouldn't have read it... Grin
 

...&&FS Water Configurator+ has new modifications in the works, plus DirectX 10, Service Pack&&1, and Radeon HD 3+ Series support.
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Reply #23 - Sep 19th, 2006 at 11:29am

Mees   Offline
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You seriously just bought a PENTIUM CPU???????????????????????????????????????
 

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