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FS-GS Service.. Seeing Is Believing (Read 554 times)
Apr 14th, 2006 at 6:26pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
This is for those who have not used the FS-GS service...


I decided to give FS-GS a whirl. My visual quality and performance was what I considered higher than satisfactory and to tell you the truth I was a bit sceptical and did not think I could do much better with FS9. It was not my goal to make a challenge to Michael, just see how his service may increase my experience. In any case Michael Greenblatt @ FS-GS proved I could do better with FS9.

Even with an electrical engineering background, I shut-up, listened and learned.

I am not going to give away any settings because EVERY SYSTEM is different so please do not PM me for information. I will however relay information which may help anyone who reads this understand how the service is not only beneficial to just about any level of computer tech, gamer or novice but to just about any level of system hardware.

Even though prior to his service I had made many of the OS and FS9 setup changes his service suggests, by the end of the session my FS9 performance increased 20% right out of the gate with 100% FS9 sliders and checkboxes enabled and my graphics card set to 100% quality… Shocked

That is a heck of an increase for a software title known for crushing CPU and GPU cycles.

In checking the effect the service had on other graphics applications, I found in 3DMark, (6xAA, 16xAF enabled), a consistant 300-500pt increase had resulted. That may not seem like much however the 300-500pt gain came from the OS resource to CPU/Memory performance of the benchmark, meaning, my system was now placing critical resources into FS9 I was not getting (at all) prior to the FS-GS service. That translates into CPU cycles which FS9 now has better access to and uses.

As I had always known, many of the WindowsXP reg hacks, FS9.cfg file and other tweaks posted around the net are really complete trash. There are minimal reg hacks and WindowsXP changes which Michael will walk you through setting up. Changes to the FS9.cfg file are based on YOUR system and YOUR video adapter which Michael spent years in development of establishing correct settings based on individual systems, hardware and add-ons. You will learn the REAL meaning of the important numbers in the FS9.cfg file and their relationship/ how they affect each other when changed.

A popular add-on which is typically installed and forgotten about is FSUIPC. It should not be ignored. With Michaels service you have the opportunity to learn about FSUIPC settings which can further enhance your experience without killing resources.

If Michael suggests to get rid of an add-on OR suggests you acquire an add-on, don't question, just DO IT. Michael does not own any financial stake in making add-on suggestions. Michael knows what works and what doesn’t, period.

You will learn about add-ons and how many developers (even the most expensive add-on planes and scenery) are clueless as to how to properly design textures for Flight Simulator. Learning what to watch out for when installing add-ons and what to do to correct textures yourself can convert aircraft and scenery which bring FS9 to its knees, into smooth running software with minimal FS9 performance hits.

You will learn about FS9 calibration… You heard right, there is a method of calibrating FS9 so the system is correctly balanced for the load FS9 applies to it. You will find no reference to FS9 calibration methods from anyone but a Microsoft graphics consultant.

In the follow up sessions the initial 20% gain was further increased. Usually I fly real world weather with 100% 3D clouds maxed out. During heavy cloud cover and overcast conditions the drain on the sim is enormous. I am sure you have heard about using reduced size freeware cloud textures and I have my own version of clouds which help but I never, ever expected to see and experience 100% cloud and weather conditions with realistic multilayer cloud FX and almost NO hit on the system. In calculating the load change, Michaels follow up settings and suggestions added a 40% gain to my FS9 performance.

I learned how freeware cloud fixes and even my own were actually causing more problems than they had solved. Amazing...

As I have always known, frame rate watching while the sim is running is not important. Whats important is smooth frames, not the number being displayed during flight. The only time frame rate counts are important is during calibration, otherwise the counter means practically nothing and actually causes a loss of 3 real frames when it is active on the screen.

Michael tests for ATI and Nvidia has connections to Microsoft itself. That experience alone is worth twice the service fee. Try and get a personal appointment with an ATI, Nvidia or Microsoft graphics engineer and see how far you get. If you manage to get an appointment, you won’t get hours of personalized services. Technical support in such cases would cost anywhere from $50 to $100USD + per hour and they WILL charge you even if their advice does not help, Michael doesn't.


Do the math… then do the FS-GS service. http://www.fs-gs.com/




...


...


« Last Edit: Apr 16th, 2006 at 2:40pm by N/A »  
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Reply #1 - Apr 15th, 2006 at 6:02am

Tom.   Offline
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Very nice i am currently saving up for this service
Could you please give more detailed infomation on your system specs and Framerates Before/After Grin
Last pic looks Great
 
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Reply #2 - Apr 15th, 2006 at 6:04am

Tom.   Offline
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Btw did you get

Interactive level I
OR
Interactive level II
 
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Reply #3 - Apr 15th, 2006 at 4:21pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
The level 2 service, which is 60 euros

A8V Deluxe
3700+ San Deigo
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I want it understood that the question "what were your frame rates before and after" will not provide you with any answers.

Also, Michael does not work with an overclocked system. Your hardware is set up to run at its stock speeds with the proper BIOS and driver settings.

Frame rates, outside of tuning FS9 for your hardware, are the most ridiculous way to judge Flight Simulator performance. Your video card and system determine the base frame rate you should be able to achieve, after that it about tuning for smooth consistant flight and finding the correct frame lock to achieve that goal.

FYI, I gained 5 frames to my frame lock after calibration but that is not what makes FS9 smooth. Smooth flight is based on a combination of settings working in a UNIFIED system which is customized for your setup. If you run the frame counter during flight you are removing 3 frames of performance from what you see on the screen. The frame counter itself puts a load on the system. The only time the frame counter should be on is during calibration, no other time.

In any case, even if I run the frame counter and the frame rate dips into the low 20’s or high teen’s during a high stress point in a flight, the visual screen is smooth and I cannot tell the difference between 33 displayed frames on the counter and 16.

Fight Simulator is not CS or other games. It requires a load balance of settings based on the CPU and GPU being used. Watching and judging FS by frame rates is the biggest mistake most people make.

Your results with the service will be directly related to a combination of things. Your hardware, you OS setup, how you installed FS9 and its update and the add-ons you use along with how you set up FS9 for a flight.

Michael may suggest hardware upgrades to maximize your experience. You cannot expect 35fps with 100% slider enabled on an 800Mhz system running an MMX video card however the service is designed to maximize the hardware you have to work with.

What you learn in the session can be applied to future hardware changes or reinstalls and I would think  Michael can give some support in recommending settings to a future hardware purchase but that is something you would need to discuss with him. He does take care of his customers in follow ups.





« Last Edit: Apr 15th, 2006 at 5:52pm by N/A »  
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Reply #4 - Apr 16th, 2006 at 4:10pm

kipman725   Offline
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would you say this service is usefull for someone like me who is using litestep with a homemade theme and has good knowlage of what fs9.cfg tweeks do and what the registry does?  is he rearly rearly good is basicly what i'm asking Wink
 

5900xt/2800+/280GB/1GB PC3200/Cyborg Evo Force/ABIT NF7&&Gpu clock: 475mhz core, 800mhz mem&&CPU at: 12.5x175 = 2187.5 &&memory: 2.5, 3, 3, 8 Duel channel on &&Os: windows xp pro, ubuntu 5.10 breazy badger
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Reply #5 - Apr 16th, 2006 at 4:26pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
would you say this service is usefull for someone like me who is using litestep with a homemade theme and has good knowlage of what fs9.cfg tweeks do and what the registry does?  is he rearly rearly good is basicly what i'm asking Wink



Lets put it like this, if he can not make a difference, you dont pay. So what do you have to loose?

Also, you may understand the settings however do you understand how to put them all together to create a properly load balanced system for FS9 use?


To briefly touch base on your understand FS9.cfg file perhaps the following would be a good way of examining that question.

1.
Please list all the possible settings for the line listed below.

2.
Is a fractual numerical setting possible for that line?

TERRAIN_EXTENDED_LEVELS=XXXX

3.
How many zeros should be listed after a whole number -OR- (if applicable) a fractual numerical setting in that line?

4.
What must be installed into FS9 before the line above can be set to its maximum numerical value?


I will not provide correct answers if you are wrong. I will also not get into it any more discussion of settings than I posted above.

If you do not know or are unsure of the answers to any of the questions about that line, you are probably not running FS9 correctly.

Remember, even having the correct answers does not mean you are using your system and FS9 to it's full potential. FS9 depends on ALL OS and FS9 settings/tweaks being correct and balanced for the individual rig. Even duplicate towers may require different settings in calibration of the system for FS9 use.




« Last Edit: Apr 16th, 2006 at 6:50pm by N/A »  
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Reply #6 - Apr 17th, 2006 at 12:53am

congo   Offline
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The above tweek has been made publicly available before, though I won't dispel it's source ATM, indeed if I can even find it again...... but, as you say NickN, that's just one of many improvements FSGS can help with.

I haven't used the service, due more to financial constraints than anything else, I've always been curious however, and I was sceptical at first, but after reading MANY posts by satisfied customers over the years, and considering his guarantee, it looks great.
 

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Reply #7 - Apr 17th, 2006 at 1:09am

ctjoyce   Offline
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Well I have alawaies wanted to do FS-GS, however as you said every system is different, and with how much I change mine, its just not worth it I believe. Also I like ventureing into overclocking, and from the looks of it, it would seem that this is kinda an anti-overclocking service. So for now I dont plan to do it, however there may come a day.

Cheers
Cameron
 

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Reply #8 - Apr 17th, 2006 at 3:56am

eno   Offline
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Quote:
Well I have alawaies wanted to do FS-GS, however as you said every system is different, and with how much I change mine, its just not worth it I believe. Also I like ventureing into overclocking, and from the looks of it, it would seem that this is kinda an anti-overclocking service. So for now I dont plan to do it, however there may come a day.

Cheers
Cameron


Not so much anti overclock ........... you won't need to overclock after the service  Wink Wink Wink Grin Grin Grin
 

...
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Reply #9 - Apr 17th, 2006 at 1:31pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
Not so much anti overclock ........... you won't need to overclock after the service  Wink Wink Wink Grin Grin Grin



Exactly....


..but if you do overclock, and do it right, it can improve the improvement  Grin


...And Cameron, Micheal provides a method of calibrating which you can use with hardware changes. Once you learn the methods it is quite easy to tweak it yourself but I think Michael would be glad to provide base settings in the event of a hardware upgrade.


Quote:
Also I like ventureing into overclocking, and from the looks of it, it would seem that this is kinda an anti-overclocking service. So for now I dont plan to do it, however there may come a day.

Cheers
Cameron



Your BIOS is set up to your hardware (CPU Memory, Video) base, stock settings for a very good reason. Even though I do it too, I do believe overclocking is overrated - however- Michael must have your system set up in a base test framework which is not tainted by artificial performance settings so he can test your rig for issues. If you are overclocked his analysis cannot be complete and he could miss problems you may not be aware are happening.

What you do after the service is up to you. I kept my system at its base setup for over a week while going through the service, testing and having a few follow up sessions. Once everything was tweaked I cranked it back up.

I have tested systems for years. Currently I find that my 25% CPU overclock only adds 3-5% to the graphics system performance. The video card o/c adds approx. 10%. Thats graphic system performance, not FS9. FS9 relies on a balance or resources, not overclocking. In some cases overclocking can rob FS9 of resources due to heat and overdriving the electronics.

NOTE: My frame lock is not increased when O/c'ng the CPU and video card. All that provides is a minor boost in heavy load 3rd party airports when heavy traffic and cloud cover is present. I do use the words 'minor boost' because even when not overclocked the difference before and after the service in the same simulation circumstances is night and day.

My system does unbelievably well now without O/c'ing, something I never thought was possible under nasty load condtions.

What is even more important is my visual experience (as in a realistic looking simulation) has dramatically increased.

You would not install Windows or install or run mission-critical programs while overclocked, you should not be overclocked until the service is complete, all follow up sessions are complete and you have established the unified settings for your sim.





« Last Edit: Apr 17th, 2006 at 3:45pm by N/A »  
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Reply #10 - Apr 17th, 2006 at 2:09pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
The above tweek has been made publicly available before, though I won't dispel it's source ATM, indeed if I can even find it again...... but, as you say NickN, that's just one of many improvements FSGS can help with.




I'm not giving anything away

But:

1.
Including the number zero, there are only 3 possible numbers that FS9 will recognize in that line. If any other number is used FS9 will default to zero automatically. In example, a popular myth value of: 1242456 will be ignored by the sim and default that line to zero. If a system is out of balance with FS9, a value of zero can make scenery appear visually sharper however that is nothing more than a placebo visual which robs the system from one end to give to another.

2.
Unlike other numbers in the FS9.cfg file, the number used as the setting in that line should never be followed by a decimal or any zeros.

3.
That number can NOT be a fractal value

4.
You must have the correct types of scenery mesh installed to set that line to its maximum value or both visual anomalies and performance stutter issues will occur.

What I posted does not give away anything but I do believe it shows allot of what is posted on the net is hogwash.

Micheal dispells the myths so you QUIT TWEAKING and enjoy flying. When the sim does act up you know from your education through Michael how to deal with it, track down the culprit and fix the problem which is usually a third party aircraft or scenery package.


The visual realisim is quite impressive. My gauged performance increased approximately 40% but my visuals and the entire experience has had a 100% boost. I thought my sim was smooth before... I did not realize what smooth flying really meant!


60 euros (73 USD) was well worth the money.

I could have dropped major cash on hardware and never achieved the same visual results. Because of FS-GS, when I do drop that cash, the purchases I make have become worth the investment and Michael's service increases their value to me as well.

When I do upgrade the next purchase will more than likely be an FX60 processor. As a matter of fact I will probably order that processor in a month or two in anticipation of a complete system upgrade to PCI-E by the end of the year. Michael confirmed my professional experience that pure horsepower always wins, especially with flight simulator.

 
« Last Edit: Apr 17th, 2006 at 3:37pm by N/A »  
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Reply #11 - Apr 17th, 2006 at 4:10pm

kipman725   Offline
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could definatly use his services if hes as good as he says he is.  I ethier can get very smooth fs experiance with hires testures a mid distance from the plane and an ugly join to medium res in the distance with good loading times for each texture or no rearly hires textures as each tile ocupies a larger area on the sim, no noticable tile joins but poor smoothness. 

I think I shall enlist his services when I get fsx  Grin
 

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Reply #12 - Apr 17th, 2006 at 6:54pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
could definatly use his services if hes as good as he says he is.  I ethier can get very smooth fs experiance with hires testures a mid distance from the plane and an ugly join to medium res in the distance with good loading times for each texture or no rearly hires textures as each tile ocupies a larger area on the sim, no noticable tile joins but poor smoothness.  

I think I shall enlist his services when I get fsx  Grin



I'm not sure if he will be FSX ready or not. If not I am sure it will not take him long to prepare with the experience he has with graphics. Michael is no just a Flight sim consultant. He consults on real world graphics and server systems.

 
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Reply #13 - Apr 18th, 2006 at 4:41pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 


...


 
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Reply #14 - Apr 19th, 2006 at 11:48am

Ashar   Ex Member
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I need an FS-GS treatment.. Shocked
 
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Reply #15 - Apr 19th, 2006 at 12:35pm

Fly2e   Offline
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Quote:
Posted by: Ashar Posted on: Today at 11:48am
I need an FS-GS treatment..   

Ashar, you've been saying that for a while now!  Grin
With all your Payware I am surprised you have not done it yet!  Wink

Dave
 

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...

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Reply #16 - Apr 22nd, 2006 at 3:01pm

Mees   Offline
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Quote:
Also, Michael does not work with an overclocked system



not true....



Dave has an OC'ed 6800 Wink
 

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Reply #17 - Apr 22nd, 2006 at 4:09pm

Ashar   Ex Member
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Quote:
Ashar, you've been saying that for a while now!  Grin
With all your Payware I am surprised you have not done it yet!  Wink

Dave


I don't know...I keep thinking to get it...and then drop the idea...then all of a sudden a mad urge comes...and then it drops out to...I want to know how long it usually takes...because I am not available on weekdays...(School)...

Weekends..I don't really like to ruin people's precious weekends... ???
 
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Reply #18 - Apr 22nd, 2006 at 8:05pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
not true....



Dave has an OC'ed 6800 Wink


Yes, but Michael does not set up and test your system while it is overclocked. He requests that the system be returned to its normal state for the hardware you are using. He also suggests/confirms BIOS settings. He sets Windows up and has you run the sim to his specifications and asks questions that tell him if something is wrong or not. If a system is overclocked while Michael is evaluating the tests, it would not tell him what he needs to know, therefore Michael does not work with an overclocked system. What one does do with their system after the service is up to them.  Wink


 
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Reply #19 - Apr 22nd, 2006 at 8:06pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
I don't know...I keep thinking to get it...and then drop the idea...then all of a sudden a mad urge comes...and then it drops out to...I want to know how long it usually takes...because I am not available on weekdays...(School)...

Weekends..I don't really like to ruin people's precious weekends... ???



He worked with me on a Saturday afternoon. You have to schedule an appointment to find out when he is available.
 
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Reply #20 - Apr 24th, 2006 at 2:51pm

Fly2e   Offline
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Quote:
Posted by: Buff Posted on: Apr 22nd, 2006, 3:01pm
Quote:Also, Michael does not work with an overclocked system
not true....
Dave has an OC'ed 6800


Buff, my GeForce 6800 is "overclocked" out of the box  Wink
Quote:
Based on the same great architecture as the BFG GeForce™ 6800 Ultra OC™, this card is overclocked out-of-the-box and features a powerful 16-pipe superscalar GPU with 256MB of GDDR3 memory for the mainstream enthusiast.

Above taken from http://www.bfgtech.com/6800GTOC.html

Dave
 

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Fire & SLI Supported, Mushkin Redline 6GB (3X2GB) Memory, eVGA NVIDIA GeForce GTX 285, Vista 64.

...

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Reply #21 - May 10th, 2006 at 9:00am

rootbeer   Offline
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For a lousy seventy-three bucks I can have graphics like the Southwest 747 screenshot?! My system is not overclocked or anything extraordinary. Would the FS-GS service be of any value to someone who doesn't know how to open Windows Explorer in two windows as is done when installing downloaded aircraft?
 

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Reply #22 - May 14th, 2006 at 3:18pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
For a lousy seventy-three bucks I can have graphics like the Southwest 747 screenshot?! My system is not overclocked or anything extraordinary. Would the FS-GS service be of any value to someone who doesn't know how to open Windows Explorer in two windows as is done when installing downloaded aircraft?



I can not vouch for what Michael can do for you... With your system he may suggest hardware upgrades but if that is not possible I would think he could help boost your expereince with what you have. His service also boosts your entire computer, not just FS9.

The payware PMDG 747 Southwest image comes from the FlyTampa payware airport San Francisco, Flight1 UT USA and Ground Environment textures, Flight Environment clouds and FSgenesis mesh and with my own personal water textures. Those packages along with my hardware and FS-GS service is what makes that image what it is.

Even with the service if you are not willing to spend money on the RIGHT add-ons your visuals will not look like that image although what you see even without those add-on installed should be much better and smoother.

 
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Reply #23 - May 31st, 2006 at 3:08pm
Jakemaster   Ex Member

 
That does it, first time I get enough money I am getting the FS-GS treatment
 
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Reply #24 - May 31st, 2006 at 4:47pm

FridayChild   Offline
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Quote:
1.
Including the number zero, there are only 3 possible numbers that FS9 will recognize in that line.
[...]
4.
You must have the correct types of scenery mesh installed to set that line to its maximum value or both visual anomalies and performance stutter issues will occur.  

I understand, and appreciate, your loyalty in not wanting to take the business away to the person who did you a good service. This is right.
But what are these two other values that FS2004 will accept, setting "0" aside?
Surely there's much more to FS-GS than this information, so you will not rip anyone off if you give this hint away.  Smiley
EDIT:
Also, and on second thought, other questions arise:
1) Every graphic engine is different. If I tweak my system for FS9, couldn't this possibly cause problems in other games? For example, I mainly play only two titles: FS9 and the venerable (but still great) Grand Prix Legends. I have found that certain driver tweaks that make FS9 smoother in turn cause problems in GPL.
2) By now, I have made up my mind about whose pictures are my favourite in this forum (Freeware and payware snapshots sections). I'd be curious to know if any of these users were FS-GS customers. So, FS-GS junkies, out of the closet, declare yourself!  Wink
« Last Edit: Jun 1st, 2006 at 4:14am by FridayChild »  

Founder of A.A.A.A.A.A.A. (Aircraft Amateurs' Association Against Absurd Aviation Acronyms) My system specifications: FLIGHT SIMULATOR 2004 - AMD Athlon 64 3200+ CPU - 3 GB PC-3200 DDR400 dual channel RAM - 500 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm SATA-II hard disk - Sapphire Radeon HD 5750 1 GB PCI-E graphic card - Logitech Wingman Force 3D joystick + Logitech Formula Force pedals My FS whereabouts: low and slow, small single engine prop GA, Italy airfields.
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Reply #25 - Jun 1st, 2006 at 11:05am
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
I understand, and appreciate, your loyalty in not wanting to take the business away to the person who did you a good service. This is right.
But what are these two other values that FS2004 will accept, setting "0" aside?
Surely there's much more to FS-GS than this information, so you will not rip anyone off if you give this hint away.  Smiley
EDIT:
Also, and on second thought, other questions arise:
1) Every graphic engine is different. If I tweak my system for FS9, couldn't this possibly cause problems in other games? For example, I mainly play only two titles: FS9 and the venerable (but still great) Grand Prix Legends. I have found that certain driver tweaks that make FS9 smoother in turn cause problems in GPL.
2) By now, I have made up my mind about whose pictures are my favourite in this forum (Freeware and payware snapshots sections). I'd be curious to know if any of these users were FS-GS customers. So, FS-GS junkies, out of the closet, declare yourself!  Wink


Granted, if there was another source, or several sources, on the internet for the correct setting information I would provide the answer to your question however as far as I have seen the only source for the correct answer is FSGS... therefore I will not discuss the settings for that line as it would break my agreement to not discuss proprietary information.

As for the questions about driver tweaks, FSGS will not work with an “overclocked” or “tweaked” video system. The service requires you return your system and your driver settings back to normal and FSGS will walk you though the settings for the drivers from there. FSGS does not tweak your drivers at all or use any special hack tools for settings.

The service deals with FS9, no other title. Once the service is complete you can make any changes you want to your drivers for other titles.

FSGS will contact you for an initial consultation at which point FSGS may request several things. Only if considered needed; Hardware upgrades, add-on removal, software removal or suggestions to obtain add-ons are made based on the consultation. Recommendations for drivers are made and you will be asked to obtain a few small utility programs for quick access to FS9 files. It is also possible FSGS may request FS9 be completely reinstalled if it is found you do not have it properly installed in its correct location and the FS9.1 patch was not installed correctly, and/or you have certain types of junk add-on software known for causing problems in FS9 which cannot be completely uninstalled because the author of the software is an idiot. Either way, if a reinstall is required or fixes to FS9 can be done without a reinstall, FSGS will walk you through the correct installation procedures.

FSGS walks you through a proper setup of WindowsXP for maximum memory and CPU cycle availability. FSGS will then work with you on proper driver installation and setup. FS9 is then booted and set up correctly for your video card and system. Assistance with FSUIPC and other software such as weather can be provided. I think those expensive weather programs are ridiculous because the FS9 weather engine works great if FSUIPC is set up right, but that is just my opinion.

So, that is the process. There are some changes and settings that are well known, others that are not. In any case, it is not a single setting that makes the system perform. It is a combination of all the settings applied to your individual computer setup after FS9 has been calibrated.



 
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Reply #26 - Jun 1st, 2006 at 11:31am

FridayChild   Offline
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Understood.  Smiley
Let me just (partly) disagree with you on the "proprietary information" bit. What do you mean by that? If you mean the information is proprietary to Microsoft (i.e. it's considered "industrial secret", like the infamous Windows APIs) then FS-GS would be violating it in the first place.
If on the other hand you mean - as I'm sure - that you had to or you voluntarily agreed to not disclose any detail about what you learned from FS-GS during the calibration process (which, I understand, lasts several hours and requires interaction between FS-GS and the user, meaning that FS-GS instruct the user to make changes with a brief explanation of the reason why, and the user executes them) then it's a different matter. Then those informations are not - strictly speaking - proprietary (to FS-GS), but rather they are the result of hard research work by FS-GS and so it's in FS-GS's interest that they remain confidential.
At this point let me ask you: was the "non disclosure policy" part of the contractual conditions, or did you voluntarily chose to agree to that? In the latter case, what would happen if a user didn't agree to that condition and, after being FS-GS'ed, publicly disclosed all the details on the web?
That said, once again I think that you are right in not wanting to step in FS-GS toes since it's obvious that they rock, but then again, surely there's much more to FS-GS than just the bare explanation of what the allowed values for a certain fs9.cfg parameter are. If revealing this simple information could spoil the business, then one would think that it's not that big deal, and we both know well that this isn't the case, right?  Wink
Let me know; as for FS-GS, I'll seriously consider it, but first I'll try all I'm capable of to better my FS9 world... it's a matter of pride, you see.  Grin
 

Founder of A.A.A.A.A.A.A. (Aircraft Amateurs' Association Against Absurd Aviation Acronyms) My system specifications: FLIGHT SIMULATOR 2004 - AMD Athlon 64 3200+ CPU - 3 GB PC-3200 DDR400 dual channel RAM - 500 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm SATA-II hard disk - Sapphire Radeon HD 5750 1 GB PCI-E graphic card - Logitech Wingman Force 3D joystick + Logitech Formula Force pedals My FS whereabouts: low and slow, small single engine prop GA, Italy airfields.
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Reply #27 - Jun 1st, 2006 at 11:28pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
I will not disclose information or techniques which are not available on the net and which someone worked very hard researching.

If I contracted Microsoft and paid them their rate for exclusive ONE ON ONE training there would be a contract involved which would include a NON DISCLOSURE AGREEMENT.  I am currently testing for MS right now and I know exactly how the system works.

It is typical in any business where intellectual property or technique is involved to establish a non disclosure agreement.

I am not legally bound by a signed contract with FSGS. My word is my bond. I could without any legal repercussions post the entire process in a thread. That may help allot of people but it could also make their systems worse simply because I do not know the correct FS9 and driver settings for every card on the market going back 3 years. Therefore posting such information would do nothing but violate an agreement which was made in trust.

What I paid for was a professional graphics consultant which is highly experienced with MSFS. This person has ties with Microsoft, ATI and Nvidia. The fee I paid was NOTHING compared to the hourly rate a Microsoft, ATI or Nvidia graphics engineer would charge for personal service. I was charged the equivalent of approximately ½ hour of time with a Microsoft, ATI or Nvidia graphics engineer and given at minimum 8-12 hours of service if you include the technical talks I had with Michael in which he disclosed quite a bit of information to me with respect to proper graphics development in MSFS. The session for the service went very fast because I am an engineer myself and the changes were very easy for me to comprehend and make.

To be quite honest, if you were to approach FS-GS with the attitude you tend to display in the post above, I doubt they would accept you as a client. I think it is a "big deal" to make a trust and break it by disclosing infomation even if the information is minute and would probably have no finacial impact, it's still breaking an agreement and more important, my word.
 
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Reply #28 - Jun 2nd, 2006 at 5:26am

FridayChild   Offline
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"To be quite honest, if you were to approach FS-GS with the attitude you tend to display in the post above, I doubt they would accept you as a client. I think it is a "big deal" to make a trust and break it by disclosing infomation even if the information is minute and would probably have no finacial impact, it's still breaking an agreement and more important, my word."
That's precisely why I asked you - out of interest and curiosity - if you actually gave your word about it. It's completely obvious that, if you did, you would be bound to keep it.
I think you misunderstood my last sentence: I said that *if* revealing the possible values for a single parameter would alone take business away from FSGS then one would think that calibrating FS9 is not that big deal. A paradox, because everybody knows that of course it *IS* a big deal... that's why I thought that revealing it would not damage FSGS because there are so many other tweakings to do that require extensive knowledge.
But you explained that you are bound to an agreement, no matter how tiny the information you are asked to reveal is; I respect this and will ask you no more.  Wink
 

Founder of A.A.A.A.A.A.A. (Aircraft Amateurs' Association Against Absurd Aviation Acronyms) My system specifications: FLIGHT SIMULATOR 2004 - AMD Athlon 64 3200+ CPU - 3 GB PC-3200 DDR400 dual channel RAM - 500 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm SATA-II hard disk - Sapphire Radeon HD 5750 1 GB PCI-E graphic card - Logitech Wingman Force 3D joystick + Logitech Formula Force pedals My FS whereabouts: low and slow, small single engine prop GA, Italy airfields.
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Reply #29 - Jun 2nd, 2006 at 11:03am
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
That's precisely why I asked you - out of interest and curiosity - if you actually gave your word about it. It's completely obvious that, if you did, you would be bound to keep it.
I think you misunderstood my last sentence: I said that *if* revealing the possible values for a single parameter would alone take business away from FSGS then one would think that calibrating FS9 is not that big deal. A paradox, because everybody knows that of course it *IS* a big deal... that's why I thought that revealing it would not damage FSGS because there are so many other tweakings to do that require extensive knowledge.
But you explained that you are bound to an agreement, no matter how tiny the information you are asked to reveal is; I respect this and will ask you no more.  Wink



Thank you for understanding my position.

The only reason I posted the information I did in this thread with respect to settings was to demonstrate all the bull being posted on the net and how out of whack most people have their systems, and don’t realize it because of lack of knowledge or more often than not, ego.

I, like many others, have searched the internet for solutions to FS9 performance issues and for tweaks. I would say that 80-90% of what FS-GS provides is available on the net. The problem with the internet posted information is that it also includes bad settings and advice which is mixed in with the good settings and advice which makes it impossible to know if one has obtained correct solutions. FS-GS removes the doubt and provides the correct answers. They also provide answers that are not available on the net, at all. The combination is what makes the service worth the investment.

FS9 is hyper-sensitive to all settings. All FS9 and driver setting must be in sync with the computer system they are being applied to for maximum performance and visual experience. Add to that, there are a large number of add-ons which are not properly designed which in turn cause FS9 issues. Knowing what to look for and how to correct it is an entire subject in itself. FS-GS explains and simplifies that process. A course in graphics engineering would be quite expensive and I am sure would not address issues for a specific game title.

At one point in time I spent more time looking for solutions and tweaks than I did enjoying the software. I like to solve problems myself, something an engineering ego has programmed into it. After coming to the conclusion that I had achieved the best results possible I went back to enjoying the software. I was very satisfied with the FS9 I was getting.

Over time I decided to throw down a few bucks and see if all the work I did actually achieved the best possible results. I have known about FS-GS for several years prior to using the service. There are days I spend more on lunch than I did with FS-GS. The money was never the issue.

What I discovered is that I did not need to waste the hours and days spent in tweaking and furthermore the time I spent did not provide maximum results. Quite simply FS-GS drastically improved my sim experience in one afternoon and provided all the information I needed to keep my sim in top condition when installing new add-ons, creating my own or when I may reinstall the setup into another system.

Knowing the technology field, and I do.. very well, I obtained what I would consider between $1000-$2000 in service and education for the price of a nice lunch, including drinks, at an upscale downtown Seattle restaurant.

I should have done it years ago


Grin






 
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Reply #30 - Jun 7th, 2006 at 3:07pm

FridayChild   Offline
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Now that we have wiped the slate clean, if there is someone here who is *not* a FS-GS customer and has figured out on his/her own what those values are, feel free to post them.  Wink
Also and on the other end, if some FS-GS user has some before/after screenies to share, to help see the difference, it'd be great.  Smiley
 

Founder of A.A.A.A.A.A.A. (Aircraft Amateurs' Association Against Absurd Aviation Acronyms) My system specifications: FLIGHT SIMULATOR 2004 - AMD Athlon 64 3200+ CPU - 3 GB PC-3200 DDR400 dual channel RAM - 500 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm SATA-II hard disk - Sapphire Radeon HD 5750 1 GB PCI-E graphic card - Logitech Wingman Force 3D joystick + Logitech Formula Force pedals My FS whereabouts: low and slow, small single engine prop GA, Italy airfields.
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Reply #31 - Jun 20th, 2006 at 6:01pm

Gunny04   Offline
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Maybe I am a bit dull in the head but..... for 73 USD Couldnt you just buy a decent GPU on Ebay if your computer had medium range specs and just crank up the settings as much as you want before lag? Seriously, even on a MX440 I could run 70% of the game without traffic etc but it looked ugly in screens because of jaggys, other than that, perfect..... I just dont understand this method of going, then again I am a do it myself type of person.... Can somebody clarify this too me or flame me out for being a bit idiodic? Cheers, Gunny
 

AMD athlon 3800 Venice Socket 939 64 bit at 2.4Ghz, 6100K8MA-RS Foxconn Motherboard, 1gb (2X512) OCZ Platinum PC3200 Ram, EVGA 8800GTS 640MB OC, 500 Watt NZXT psu, and Windows Vista Ultimate Total hard drive space 530gb
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Reply #32 - Jun 20th, 2006 at 11:09pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
Maybe I am a bit dull in the head but..... for 73 USD Couldnt you just buy a decent GPU on Ebay if your computer had medium range specs and just crank up the settings as much as you want before lag? Seriously, even on a MX440 I could run 70% of the game without traffic etc but it looked ugly in screens because of jaggys, other than that, perfect..... I just dont understand this method of going, then again I am a do it myself type of person.... Can somebody clarify this too me or flame me out for being a bit idiodic? Cheers, Gunny


Simple... I know hardware and currently own what would be considered a high end system. It’s not in SLI mode but SLI cannot be used with FS9 anyway.....

Its not about frame rates, it's about the visuals... how real they look and how smooth the simulation runs.

Even with a system running 300FSB on a 512mb 7900GTX my sim would NEVER look as good as it does OR work as smooth without the information I learned from FS-GS, it's that simple.

And NO, you WONT buy a GPU for 75 dollars on eBay and duplicate those results.

Lets take it a step further... what you are buying is a professional consultation with someone that will teach you how to set up your computer system for graphics performance -and- FS9 for the maximum experience your hardware will allow. Hardware upgrades are recommended by FS-GS if Michael thinks you would be better off spending money on hardware before the service. Your contracting a professional who has tested just about every video card and processor combination there is along with add-ons that enhance the sim... and knows for a fact what works and what doesn’t.

I would rather drop 70 bucks on the education. That way whatever I spend on hardware is a much better investment. 






 
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Reply #33 - Jun 21st, 2006 at 3:10am

FridayChild   Offline
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Again, I think that a series of "before/after" screenies produced by the same system (w/o hardware changes) would be the ultimate seeing is believing tool,
Why is nobody answering the call?  ???
I'm sure that any one who is interested in making the best out of FS9 at the point of using the service would have half a ton of screenies taken before the treatment. Just fly on the same location, take the same shot and voila.
We have seen wonderful screenies by users here who are fs-gs customers, so half the work is done, but i think the "before/after" thingy would speak for itself (we could even make it sticky and send there people who ask about the service).  Smiley
 

Founder of A.A.A.A.A.A.A. (Aircraft Amateurs' Association Against Absurd Aviation Acronyms) My system specifications: FLIGHT SIMULATOR 2004 - AMD Athlon 64 3200+ CPU - 3 GB PC-3200 DDR400 dual channel RAM - 500 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm SATA-II hard disk - Sapphire Radeon HD 5750 1 GB PCI-E graphic card - Logitech Wingman Force 3D joystick + Logitech Formula Force pedals My FS whereabouts: low and slow, small single engine prop GA, Italy airfields.
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Reply #34 - Jun 21st, 2006 at 6:55am

Gunny04   Offline
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If you know how to look and are patient enough you can Get a good Graphics card for 70 USD.... But I just dont understand, How can something with an engine already in it and out for 2 years any bit better? I might be daft, but for some reason this doesnt register with me too well,  a good overclock, some decent cooling and a Medium Range computer with a few upgrades does it well enough from what I can tell. Cheers, The Daft Gunny
 

AMD athlon 3800 Venice Socket 939 64 bit at 2.4Ghz, 6100K8MA-RS Foxconn Motherboard, 1gb (2X512) OCZ Platinum PC3200 Ram, EVGA 8800GTS 640MB OC, 500 Watt NZXT psu, and Windows Vista Ultimate Total hard drive space 530gb
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Reply #35 - Jun 21st, 2006 at 8:47pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 


All I will say here is this… if I had known what I know now a year or more ago I would not have purchased certain hardware or add-ons, nor would I have spent hours on end searching the internet and testing different settings. The result of all my work in that area netted a good simulation experience, but the bottom line is I spent too much money on the wrong items and too much time screwing around trying to “do-it-myself”, and I did not net the best sim experience possible with all that.

For 70 dollars, the service is well worth the investment. There is nothing anyone can say to argue that, why?.. because if FS-GS cannot improve your sim experience, you don’t pay..

It’s a no brainer
 
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Reply #36 - Jun 22nd, 2006 at 3:24am

eno   Offline
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Quote:
If you know how to look and are patient enough you can Get a good Graphics card for 70 USD.... But I just dont understand, How can something with an engine already in it and out for 2 years any bit better? I might be daft, but for some reason this doesnt register with me too well,  a good overclock, some decent cooling and a Medium Range computer with a few upgrades does it well enough from what I can tell. Cheers, The Daft Gunny


For what you will pay for cooling a new graphics card extra memory and then shortening the life of the afore mentioned by overclocking....... you may as well pay for FS-GS and save the extra cash that the other option will cost to buy some decent addons for your sim.

Quote:
Also and on the other end, if some FS-GS user has some before/after screenies to share, to help see the difference, it'd be great.


Screenshots do not show the full benefits of FS-GS as they are static. However your wish is my command.

Before ...... note the ground textures are blurred right across the shot.
...

After.....  a similar shot note the clear ground textures right across the shot.
...

Ask yourself this ...... can you increase your view distance to infinity without the textures becomming blurred and flickering? Can you pan round your aircraft, in spot view, and have a completely smooth and clear picture as you do? If the answer is no then you would benefit from FSGS. However they are not the only things that improve. Instead of knocking it try it ..... you have absolutely NOTHING to loose, you either get a smooth running sim/computer or you don't pay. That is how confident Michael is about his service.

Here's the challenge ...... lets see you post screenshots that are of the same quality as Fly2e's. Without using FS-GS there's only one person on these forums who I think comes close.
 

...
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Reply #37 - Jun 22nd, 2006 at 4:14am

FridayChild   Offline
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I agree that static pictures only show half of the lot (the other half being smooth animation), but the do speak loud by themselves, so I'm glad that at last someone agreed to post a "before/after". I'm also confident that this will reduce the amount of time you'll have to spend describing why FS-GS is worth it. Just redirect the queries to this topic Wink
As for the challenge, I'm not willing to take it; I already know I couldn't win it... maybe some other daring folk will try?  Tongue
Final question: were the two screenies taken by the same system (i.e. did you do major hardware upgrades between the two shots or is the improvement purely due to optimization?)

PS: true, there's maybe a couple of persons here who produce FS-GS-like screenies w/o being FS-GS customers (unless they lied... LOL)  Grin
 

Founder of A.A.A.A.A.A.A. (Aircraft Amateurs' Association Against Absurd Aviation Acronyms) My system specifications: FLIGHT SIMULATOR 2004 - AMD Athlon 64 3200+ CPU - 3 GB PC-3200 DDR400 dual channel RAM - 500 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm SATA-II hard disk - Sapphire Radeon HD 5750 1 GB PCI-E graphic card - Logitech Wingman Force 3D joystick + Logitech Formula Force pedals My FS whereabouts: low and slow, small single engine prop GA, Italy airfields.
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Reply #38 - Jun 22nd, 2006 at 5:17am

eno   Offline
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The improvement was purely through FS-GS.
 

...
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Reply #39 - Jun 22nd, 2006 at 8:51am
PisTon   Ex Member

 
Quote:
Ask yourself this ...... can you increase your view distance to infinity without the textures becomming blurred and flickering? Can you pan round your aircraft, in spot view, and have a completely smooth and clear picture as you do?

I can Smiley
Quote:
Here's the challenge ...... lets see you post screenshots that are of the same quality as Fly2e's. Without using FS-GS there's only one person on these forums who I think comes close.

Hmmmmmm.
I'll try Tongue Also is that person who comes close Ramsa329 himself?
 
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Reply #40 - Jun 22nd, 2006 at 11:33am

eno   Offline
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Quote:
I can Smiley
Hmmmmmm.
I'll try Tongue Also is that person who comes close Ramsa329 himself?


FS-GS ...... is Ramsa329's  baby so you would expect his screenies to be a shining example.  Grin
 

...
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Reply #41 - Jun 22nd, 2006 at 12:29pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
FS-GS ...... is Ramsa329's  baby so you would expect his screenies to be a shining example.  Grin



I did not post any before and after screenshots because my sim already took excellent still images. What dramatically improved for me was the weather, clouds and the ability to fly a PMDG 747 running FS Passengers through socked in conditions @ a Fly Tampa airport and not see a staggering hic-up's it the smoothness for frame transitions.

Unless your not running good add-on's, frame rates and still images will not demonstrate what FS-GS does.


Nuff-said  Grin
 
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Reply #42 - Jul 9th, 2006 at 5:24am

ubntfp   Offline
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I am about to upgrade / build a new system so will not pay for FS-GS yet but...  I did go to the website and download the free tweak.  I could average 20 maybe 23 on a nice day but would drop to 3 - 4 fps when hitting with FRAPS.  After using this tweak and omega drivers I was seeing 40fps, I actually got 20 at one point with FRAPS recording  Shocked. and for the first time ever was able to have graphics maxed , go into spot mode and just spin around the plane with out freezing and with smoth lines. 

Also the ground scenery has vastly improved as has the clouds.

For me I am sold, can't wait to get mine tweaked by Michael.

Bit confused, I just read that aparently FS doesn't support sli??? was going to build new system around FS using sli  Sad  Can anyone explain why this cannot be done?

Trying to find the link for omega drivers as they do Nvidia aswell as ATI but have lost it, will post when I find it.

Can't find the link here on FS, as I read about them here, but here is the website... http://www.omegadrivers.net/
 
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Reply #43 - Jul 9th, 2006 at 8:03am

FridayChild   Offline
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What is the free tweak you're talking about?  ???
Most of all, where is it?
 

Founder of A.A.A.A.A.A.A. (Aircraft Amateurs' Association Against Absurd Aviation Acronyms) My system specifications: FLIGHT SIMULATOR 2004 - AMD Athlon 64 3200+ CPU - 3 GB PC-3200 DDR400 dual channel RAM - 500 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm SATA-II hard disk - Sapphire Radeon HD 5750 1 GB PCI-E graphic card - Logitech Wingman Force 3D joystick + Logitech Formula Force pedals My FS whereabouts: low and slow, small single engine prop GA, Italy airfields.
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Reply #44 - Jul 9th, 2006 at 9:08am

ubntfp   Offline
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Sorry completely forgot to put the link in  Embarrassed
http://www.fs-gs.com/downloads.htm

Took a while to figure out but it shuts down progs before FS starts and re-activates them after so that FS has more CPU resourses.

I think thats a very basic description but it does do more.
 
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Reply #45 - Jul 9th, 2006 at 10:16am

FridayChild   Offline
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OK, that is the well known FSAutoStart program, which is not a FS-GS product.
 

Founder of A.A.A.A.A.A.A. (Aircraft Amateurs' Association Against Absurd Aviation Acronyms) My system specifications: FLIGHT SIMULATOR 2004 - AMD Athlon 64 3200+ CPU - 3 GB PC-3200 DDR400 dual channel RAM - 500 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm SATA-II hard disk - Sapphire Radeon HD 5750 1 GB PCI-E graphic card - Logitech Wingman Force 3D joystick + Logitech Formula Force pedals My FS whereabouts: low and slow, small single engine prop GA, Italy airfields.
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Reply #46 - Jul 9th, 2006 at 10:43pm
Nick N   Ex Member

 
Quote:
I am about to upgrade / build a new system so will not pay for FS-GS yet but...  I did go to the website and download the free tweak.  I could average 20 maybe 23 on a nice day but would drop to 3 - 4 fps when hitting with FRAPS.  After using this tweak and omega drivers I was seeing 40fps, I actually got 20 at one point with FRAPS recording  Shocked. and for the first time ever was able to have graphics maxed , go into spot mode and just spin around the plane with out freezing and with smoth lines.  

Also the ground scenery has vastly improved as has the clouds.

For me I am sold, can't wait to get mine tweaked by Michael.

Bit confused, I just read that aparently FS doesn't support sli??? was going to build new system around FS using sli  Sad  Can anyone explain why this cannot be done?

Trying to find the link for omega drivers as they do Nvidia aswell as ATI but have lost it, will post when I find it.

Can't find the link here on FS, as I read about them here, but here is the website... http://www.omegadrivers.net/


FSautostart is a well known program. Although I did use it during my FS-GS service, I do not use it now. (in my opinion) It is designed for older systems that do not run 2GB+ of memory and are not considered high end systems. It is NOT designed to shut down services 100% correctly but it will release memory and CPU cycles on systems that cannot handle all the background activity and the 3D application at the same time. The only thing I use FSautostart for now is a diagnostic tool if I think someting in the background is causing trouble.

If omega drivers work for you, use them... I do not use them and when I have tested them in the past I found my image quality was reduced in order to increase frames, which I do not like. I also found no true performance gain over the factory drivers.

FS-GS will not tweak a system on anything but factory drivers. 

 
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Reply #47 - Sep 2nd, 2006 at 11:26am

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i can't afford so much as 73 usd, i'm to young to work!
 

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