Simviation Forum - The wretched final turn...

Jul 23^rd, 2004 at 2:23pm

Dan Offline
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I can't remember the last time i got that finel turn onto approach 'just right'. I'm always turning in too early, and having to fly a diagonal into the runway. In stuff like the Baron 58, is there any good way to judge it?
Thanks, Dan

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Reply #1 - Jul 23^rd, 2004 at 4:29pm

monkeyboy726 Offline
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hmm i used to just force myself to wait longer before turning towards the runway heading. i found it easier to turn too late and then use small corrections to line up. but thats just me so yea. i'm not sure if there's a real way of judging when to turn tho. hope this helps a little

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Reply #2 - Aug 5^th, 2004 at 11:26am

Skittles Offline
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Most people don't want to hear solutions that cost money, but I have to say...

The TrackIR is wonderful. I have a TrackIR 2. TrackIR 3 is out now. If you're completely unfamiliar with it keep reading...

The Track IR is a tiny piece of USB equipment that easily fits in the palm of a child. Very light weight. It is placed on top of your monitor and sends out InfraRed (IR) energy which will reflect off most metalic surfaces within 2 feet. It comes with reflective stickers which amplify the returning "signals". I placed a sticker on one of my ballcaps.

It can be configured to control your mouse, or your point of view (POV). The sensitivity can be adjusted to your desire. Then all you do is turn your head, or lean left or right, and your POV mimics your movements.

After some practice, I can now conduct a nearly perfect final turn. My tendancy is to turn early, but with practice of coordinating your hands, feet and head... I believe anyone can master it.

There is no special settings to adjust in FS. Just run the NatrualPoint software included, switch modes and presto! I do recommend reserving two maybe three buttons for it. One or two for recentering There is the regular Eyepoint Reset FS has and another Recenter which TrackIR needs. As you shift around in your seat, you'll need to recenter the IR. I have a third which I use to turn on/off the IR. After turning to final, I want to scan my panel without moving my POV, so I turn of the IR. After touch down, I turn it back on.

OK, enough sales pitch.

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Reply #3 - Aug 5^th, 2004 at 3:13pm

chomp_rock Offline
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In real life you usually track the runway and adjust your turn rate as needed, the TrackIR device will certainly make that easier in FS.

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Reply #4 - Aug 9^th, 2004 at 1:55am

MattNW Offline
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That TrackIR looks like a great piece of equipment. I'd love to give it a try but at $100+ that'll have to wait for a while.

The way I do it is to use FSNavigator. I zoom in close in FSNav and then go back to my flight. As I approach the turn point I hit F9 to bring up FSNav and back quickly to the sim. From this I can judge when to start the turn. It takes some practice but eventually you can judge when to start a standard rate turn that will put you on the right heading. Also remember that the runway number is related to the heading. You can use that info to help you turn to the correct heading.

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Reply #5 - Aug 18^th, 2004 at 12:54pm

Meyekul Offline
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There's a software version of Track IR called Cam2Pan. It works in the same way, but uses your webcam instead of requiring a Track IR unit.

It works pretty well, but personally I prefer using the joystick views. It kinda defeats the purpose of turning your head to look at something when you have to keep your eyes focused on the screen to see it... but, whatever floats your boat, or flies your plane, or whatever

http://www.mousevision.com/game/index.htm

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Reply #6 - Aug 19^th, 2004 at 1:03am

Skittles Offline
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Quote:

It kinda defeats the purpose of turning your head to look at something when you have to keep your eyes focused on the screen to see it...

The sensitivity can be adjusted, but your right. Trying to look behind me is tough. You don't have to turn your head. My folks came for a visit and my dad couldn't figure out why I kept leaning left/right. It didn't dawn on him the view was changing as I leaned. We got a laugh out of it.

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They both will work perfectly, until you open windows.

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Reply #7 - Aug 31^st, 2004 at 11:43pm

Boss_BlueAngels Offline
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If you go in VC all you need is your POV hat to move your view around...zoom out to .50 so you have a somewehat realistic view. (The zoom at 1 is absolutly useless unless you're looking for a switch in the cockpit or something... but for VFR flying, go to .5 zoom) And as said, just modify the angle of bank to get aligned correctly. If you're noticing you have to keep steepening/shallowing it, adjust when you start the turn. Just like real pilots do... you never wanna have to sit there and do S-turns down final, it's dangerous, and it just looks terrible. :p

Oh, ya know what's fun though, circle-to-land approaches from an instrument approach, dang those are fun! It feels so great breaking through those clouds, seeing the airport environment and making a perfectly timed 180 degree turn onto final without changing your angle of bank once and lining up on final... Mmmm, that feels great! Cheesy

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Reply #8 - Sep 26^th, 2004 at 8:37pm

Silver1SWA Offline
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Quote:

I can't remember the last time i got that finel turn onto approach 'just right'. I'm always turning in too early, and having to fly a diagonal into the runway. In stuff like the Baron 58, is there any good way to judge it?
Thanks, Dan

This is one of the main reasons I feel it is actually easier to fly a plane in real life than in Flight Sim. Speaking with 35 hours of Cessna 172 training in real life, I honestly think it's easier to fly that plane in real life vs flight sim.

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Reply #9 - Sep 26^th, 2004 at 9:23pm

Nexus Offline
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It easier to fly a real airplane

You have more references, wider field of vision and better general "feel" of the aircraft, you can anticipate what will happen next, that's how I experience it.

And I don't know what Boss_blueangels talks about, but changing the zoom to 0.5 totally screws the realism.
You will lose the ability to judge the distance completely as the environment will be further stretched (it is already cramped at 1.0zoom)

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Reply #10 - Sep 27^th, 2004 at 8:02pm

Hawkeye313 Offline
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Georgia

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After reading this post late one night, I tried the Cam2Pan software and was very interested in the possibilities. After looking at the price of some nicer webcams, mine being antiquated, I decided to give the Track IR3 Pro a shot. I must say that I am very much pleased. I can now make that turn onto final and smoothly track the turn with my head. It does make things a little weird at times, but I haven't had it long, and everyone says you have to get used to it. I too was worrried about how I'd see the screen if I moved my head, but the rotation is minimal. Check out this site for some videos to see it in action. http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/games/msfs2004.html

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Reply #11 - Oct 2^nd, 2004 at 9:37pm

Boss_BlueAngels Offline
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I fly airplanes upside
down for fun.
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LOL Like you said though, in a real airplane you have a wider field of view. That's what you do by zooming out... I never noticed the depth difference though.

Just a difference of opinion. Cheesy

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Reply #12 - Oct 8^th, 2004 at 8:10pm

Ben_M_K Ex Member

That sounds interesting! A lot of money though. Shocked

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Reply #13 - Oct 9^th, 2004 at 6:31pm

jberger03 Offline
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Without taking winds into consideration, the rule of thumb is to be at pattern altitude untill flush with the end of the runway, then begin your desent, turn base when you are at a 45 degree angle with the end of the runway...... if you do this you will find that your turn on final will be easier. Make sure you know what the winds are though!! And yes, it is 100% easier doing the real thing!

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