Simviation Forum - New GPU *Help Needed*

May 24^th, 2011 at 9:16am

Flying Mouse Offline
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Flying FSX
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My graphics card is getting old & even though it did treat me well, it did not always like FSX especially clouds and dense autogen.

I am looking for some help on what is currently the best card available for FSX?

I am not planning to change anything else besides my GPU.

Specs in sig.

I also consider moving over to Nvidia but will consider the newer ATI cards. I understand the newer ATI cards works fine with FSX?

As for cost, I don't mind paying too much, I only replace GPU once every few years anyway, as long as it is a good card.

Any guidence & help will be appreciated

PS: I use my rig mostly for FSX and occasional RPG gaming.

Mouse.

Coolermaster Storm Enforcer Chassis/ Corsair TX750W PSU/ Gigabyte Ga-990fxa Mobo/ AMD Phenom X4 965 BE 3.4Ghz C3/Coolermaster V6GT CPU air cooler/ 8GB RAM Corsair DDR3 2000Mhz/ Gigabyte GTX570 Overclocked Edition GPU/ Windows 7 Prem 64bit/ 750Gb & 150Gb (FSX Dedicated) Sata's/ 23" Samsung BX2331 LED / Logitec S510 Wireless keyboard & Mouse. Logitec Force 3D Pro Joystick. Logitec Headset.

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Reply #1 - May 24^th, 2011 at 2:50pm

Speed of flight Offline
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than yesterday" goal.

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Oh buddy. If you don't mind paying too much, then take a look at the ATI 6990. You WILL need 1KW power supply to get the most from it, but it is the smokin-est, hot, fast, fire-breathing card to date. It is quite large, and MAX wants 400 W to run it, but wow. 4GB, all performance.
Sparing that $700 beast, there's the 6970. A great 2GB card, around $450-500. Same level of performance, just one card=one card. the 6990 is 2 6970s on one card.
I just got the 6870 by xfx. The black edition. it is all that one really needs. $240, and DX11. Maybe another one some day, but one for now is all that's needed. It's a 1GB card, and rox.

All ATI cards of the last 5 years, or more have been fine for autogen, clouds, whatever you throw at it. I've been using the ATI 4870 512MB card for 4+ years, until very recently. Quite a great one that was, even.
Both corners of the vid card ring have been fighting it out over who is better. ATI vs. NVidia. Either new one will provide you with blistering performance vs. the 3870 you're used to.

I like ATI, because they're unconventional. Typically, folks that go with NVidia do so because that's all there was to speak of for years. However, those days are long gone, as both can offer you very similar dollar-for-dollar performance. 1 year, ATI has the fastest card, then the next, NVidia crushes it. Every year, the power shifts to the other side. (Although, for the past 2 years, ATI has come ahead, offering the first DX11 compatible, then the fastest one, leaving NVidia to perfect their design, releasing theirs slightly behind. Either camp gets the consumer the best there is. One could make a great arguement for being the first, vs. being better.)

Besides. It's really about tune-ability and drivers, anyway. I can't say that any maker is better than the other. Both offer great power, great specs, and performance. You really can't go wrong.

Look for at least 1 GB, and one step down from the top. Maybe 2. Those are the rules I go by.
Good luck shopping.

Hope this helps...

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Reply #2 - May 24^th, 2011 at 10:21pm

NNNG Ex Member

Quote:

. I understand the newer ATI cards works fine with FSX?

Yes.

FSX usually doesn't take advantage of multiple graphics processors, so graphics cards with dual processors on them like the two fastest overall graphics cards, the 6990 and GTX 590, are not much faster, maybe even slightly slower than their single graphics processor counterparts in FSX. The fastest single GPU cards are the GTX 580 and Radeon 6970. The GTX 580 is slightly faster. In my opinion save your cash and get a GTX 570 or 6950.. maybe even 6870 or GTX 560 Ti. Some, especially the 2gb versions of the 6950 can also unlock to full 6970 spec if you flash the BIOS.

Some approximate graphs here:
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/HD_6790_IceQ_X_Turbo/27.html

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/HD_6790_IceQ_X_Turbo/29.html

But they are not for FSX so your mileage may vary (they just graph how on average the cards perform).

Since you're running a 3870x2 I am fairly sure that you will be able to run either the GTX 580 or 6970 just fine on your PSU.

Also to get the most out of any of these cards but especially the faster ones in fsx, you will most likely need a faster processor.... try overclocking your 965 to 3.8ghz at least IMHO. Or get AMD FX series of chips (then overclock them) when they are released or a fast unlocked quad core version of the 2nd generation Core i5 or i7 (e.g. Core i5 2500K, Core i7 2600K, overclock them).

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Reply #3 - May 25^th, 2011 at 2:35am

Flying Mouse Offline
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Somewhere in a bushplane

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Thank you for the help! Much appreciated.

I will be going for a single processor card this time, learned my lesson with the duel processor (3870X2) since I mostly use the rig for FSX.
___________________________________________
I had a look at the ATI 6870
Asus Radeon Graphics Card HD6870 - 1GB 256Bit GDDR5 - PCI-E Model EAH6870DC/2DI2S/1GD5

The 6870 seems like a nice card, affordable and capable. I read some reviews on this card and some poster's comments.

It seems like the 6870 card is not a high level card (Mid Level) & that the ATI 5870 is a better card. The 5870 may be older but performs better?
_____________________________________________
I then looked at this card:

Asus Radeon Graphics Card HD5870 - 2GB 256bit GDDR5 - PCI-E 5870 Eyefinity 6/6S/2GD5

The card costs the same as the 6870 but has 2GB memory. Strange since the card does not have a HDMI port, only mini display ports but comes with a "Mini Display Port to HDMI adaptor".
__________________________________________

I also looked at this card:
Asus ATi Radeon Graphics Card HD5870 - GDDR5 1G 256 bit -PCI-E - Gaming Edition EAH5870/2DIS/1GD5/V2

This card costs the same as the 2 above.
__________________________________________

LoL what must I do, I am as confused as puke in a tumble dryer Undecided

Once again thanx for the help!!

« Last Edit: May 26^th, 2011 at 3:28am by Flying Mouse »

Coolermaster Storm Enforcer Chassis/ Corsair TX750W PSU/ Gigabyte Ga-990fxa Mobo/ AMD Phenom X4 965 BE 3.4Ghz C3/Coolermaster V6GT CPU air cooler/ 8GB RAM Corsair DDR3 2000Mhz/ Gigabyte GTX570 Overclocked Edition GPU/ Windows 7 Prem 64bit/ 750Gb & 150Gb (FSX Dedicated) Sata's/ 23" Samsung BX2331 LED / Logitec S510 Wireless keyboard & Mouse. Logitec Force 3D Pro Joystick. Logitec Headset.

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Reply #4 - May 26^th, 2011 at 8:52am

NNNG Ex Member

Quote:

It seems like the 6870 card is not a high level card (Mid Level) & that the ATI 5870 is a better card. The 5870 may be older but performs better?

Yes, the 6870 and 5870 are very similar cards... the 5870 is slightly faster though.

If you care about why this is the case... It's because the replacement to the 5870 was not the 6870 as you would expect, but the 6970. AMD changed (IMHO messed up) up their naming system. The 6870 was a lower high-end card at release whereas the 5870 was a upper high-end card at release. In any case, both have the same basic design and are built on the same manufacturing process, the only reason the 6870 was made is because it is somewhat cheaper to produce because each chip uses less silicon wafer for similar performance, saving cost.

Unlike the 5970, the 6970 is a single GPU card as is the 6950.

If they are the same price I would get the 5870, I don't know which one (since one is the eyefinity version) but make sure to look at the 6950 as well.

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Reply #5 - May 26^th, 2011 at 10:05am

Flying Mouse Offline
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Ok I had a good look at the ATI 6870 and nearly got myself the ASUS HD6870 but did some deeper digging.

I did pick up from many posters who own ATI cards that they still suffer lower FPS when entering clouds (especially with 2 or more layers).

I am also aware that this is also the case with Nvidia cards but not even close as bad as the ATI cards.

That included cards like the 5780's and 6780's.

Seems like I will change over to the Green team after all these many years.

As for the 580, that is possible but I did go big $ when the 3870X2 was released and suffered buyers remourse.

I am now looking at the GTX570 and will read some reviews and posts about the card.

Any ideads on the GTX570 for FSX below?

Zotac GeForce Graphics Card GTX570 - 1280MB 320Bit GDDR5 - PCI-E

« Last Edit: May 30^th, 2011 at 7:12am by Flying Mouse »

Coolermaster Storm Enforcer Chassis/ Corsair TX750W PSU/ Gigabyte Ga-990fxa Mobo/ AMD Phenom X4 965 BE 3.4Ghz C3/Coolermaster V6GT CPU air cooler/ 8GB RAM Corsair DDR3 2000Mhz/ Gigabyte GTX570 Overclocked Edition GPU/ Windows 7 Prem 64bit/ 750Gb & 150Gb (FSX Dedicated) Sata's/ 23" Samsung BX2331 LED / Logitec S510 Wireless keyboard & Mouse. Logitec Force 3D Pro Joystick. Logitec Headset.

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Reply #6 - Jun 11^th, 2011 at 12:37am

Speed of flight Offline
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than yesterday" goal.

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Dude. I'll tell you. I got an ATI 6870, and it rox. The 6950 is about equal, the 6970 is a 2GB 6870, and the 6990=2 6970s. My card hasn't the slightest problem doing clouds of all kinds, and at however many layers you want. I'm running REX2, GEX, etc, buncha stuff all going, and this card doesn't mind it at all. Give it power, and it will do as good as anything the competitor has. Assuredly. However, one should go with what they trust, as they are both around the same price per level of power you want.
I'm tryikng for all it's worth, though, to squash any rumors of ATI being difficult. It's all I ever ran! Even the old X700 pro only had 512MB GDDR3, and that was in my computer for eons. Got plenty of screenshots, with their great, voluminous cloud effects. I'm sure, that if there ever were problems with cloud-rendering, or whatever, they were driver issues. I've not had the first problem with any of em.

I've run the X700 pro, the 2600 HD, HD 4870, and now the 6870. All winners. Let it be known.

Hope this helps...

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Reply #7 - Jun 11^th, 2011 at 2:28am

U4EA Ex Member

I second the 6870 commentary!

I recently upgraded from a 5750 (may have the exact model# wrong, but it was the 5700 series).

My first ever endeavor into the heart of any tower was when I upgraded from the "factory" card to the 5750. Turned out to be way easier than I had ever thought. Well within the talent range of a noobian DIYer like myself. After install was my first ever experience with their "Catalyst Control Center" which was very user-friendly.

Soooooo, twas a no-brainer to recently upgrade to the 6870! LOVE IT! Swap-out and start-up was remarkably trouble free.

Every setting in every area of FSX is set on max! The awesome little thing never breaks a sweat.

Had one minor dificulty with a downloaded driver upgrade but that was most efficiently dealt by their customer support department. Turned out it was a couple of steps I'd missed. They treated me very well, even after I'd shown my level of inexperience.

I am an ATI Radeon user for life!!! Cool

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Reply #8 - Jun 12^th, 2011 at 12:07am

NNNG Ex Member

GTX 560 / GTX 570 should run FSX well. If you can then try to get the MSI twin frozr or MSI HAWK version of the card... they look good, have extra cooling, are quieter and have better quality components so are more likely to last longer. Also if you're having trouble with autogen then you're best increasing the speed of your processor by overclocking.

Quote:

The 6950 is about equal, the 6970 is a 2GB 6870, and the 6990=2 6970s.

Not quiet. Wink

GPU CORE:
6870 has 1120 stream processors, 56 Texture mapping units, 32 Render Output units, all @ 900mhz.
6970 has 1536 stream processors, 96 Texture mapping units, 32 Render Output units, all @ 880 mhz.

MEMORY:
6870: 1gb, 134.4 gigabytes per second of bandwidth.
6970: 2gb, 176 gigabytes per second of bandwidth.

All in all, 6970 is around 30% faster, 6950 is 15% faster.

The 6950 and 6950 use a different GPU with a new architecture..:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4061/amds-radeon-hd-6970-radeon-hd-6950/4

Quote:

I did pick up from many posters who own ATI cards that they still suffer lower FPS when entering clouds (especially with 2 or more layers).

I noticed slowdowns on both my 5770 and my old 8800GT, however here's the thing. I didn't compare them side by side so I don't know if one had a bigger slowdown than the other. Do you have a link to these reports?

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Reply #9 - Jun 12^th, 2011 at 2:46am

F35LightningII Offline
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The best Graphics card on the planet right now is the GTX 590. However, the GTX 590 is a dual GPU, which FSX will not take full advantage of, so I recommend the GTX 580 for you.

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Reply #10 - Jun 12^th, 2011 at 3:08pm

Speed of flight Offline
Colonel
Chasing the elusive "faster
than yesterday" goal.

Gender:
Posts: 150

Quote:

GTX 560 / GTX 570 should run FSX well. If you can then try to get the MSI twin frozr or MSI HAWK version of the card... they look good, have extra cooling, are quieter and have better quality components so are more likely to last longer. Also if you're having trouble with autogen then you're best increasing the speed of your processor by overclocking.

Quote:

The 6950 is about equal, the 6970 is a 2GB 6870, and the 6990=2 6970s.

Not quiet. Wink

GPU CORE:
6870 has 1120 stream processors, 56 Texture mapping units, 32 Render Output units, all @ 900mhz.
6970 has 1536 stream processors, 96 Texture mapping units, 32 Render Output units, all @ 880 mhz.

MEMORY:
6870: 1gb, 134.4 gigabytes per second of bandwidth.
6970: 2gb, 176 gigabytes per second of bandwidth.

All in all, 6970 is around 30% faster, 6950 is 15% faster.

The 6950 and 6950 use a different GPU with a new architecture..:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4061/amds-radeon-hd-6970-radeon-hd-6950/4

Quote:

I did pick up from many posters who own ATI cards that they still suffer lower FPS when entering clouds (especially with 2 or more layers).

I noticed slowdowns on both my 5770 and my old 8800GT, however here's the thing. I didn't compare them side by side so I don't know if one had a bigger slowdown than the other. Do you have a link to these reports?

Copy that, I was thinking for purposes of relating, but that is quite a difference. I do stand corrected.
So, I really should have guilted the wife into letting me get the 6970 instead...

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500 GB and 200 GB HDDs
Windows 7x64
VRS F/A-18E Superbug, PMDG 747-400 & -8 and MD-11, Captainsim 777, Iris F-14A&B and A-10, Area 51 C-5M Super Galaxy and C-17, loads of others.

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Reply #11 - Jun 15^th, 2011 at 8:47am

Flying Mouse Offline
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Thank you for the much appreciated input.

I stopped looking @ the ATI completely. I have scanned various reports of ATI users still complaining about cloud slow-downs in multiple cloud layers.

I won't be buying a new GPU soon so I do not want to take any chances.

I looked at the Gigabyte Superclocked 1000Mhz GTX560 TI but seen many players having to downscale the clock speeds to avoid shut-downs etc.

I looked at the GTX580, nice card but a little too expensive.

Final choice. I will be buying the GTX570. I am still thinking which I should buy between the Gigabyte Overclock edition (the one with 3 fans) which is stable or the EVGA GTX570 Overclocked.

I think it may be the EVGA with the AR in model number to ensure life long warrenty and step up program.

Choices & choices but thanx to you guys things are getting to a point.

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Reply #12 - Jun 15^th, 2011 at 12:44pm

The Snake 87 Offline
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In Tippett We trust.
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I have an EVGA GTX 460 SE and play 100% max settings at 30+fps... so anything at the same or higher level and you're set for a while. My 2 cents.

Phoenix Coyotes fan in Michigan. Yeeeaah booii.

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Reply #13 - Jun 28^th, 2011 at 9:48am

Flying Mouse Offline
Colonel
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Thanx for the help everyone.

Just one last question before I purchase.

Which one of the 2 following will be the better card?

http://www.takealot.com/electronics/asus-nvidia-gefore-graphics-card-gtx570-1280...

OR

http://www.takealot.com/electronics/gigabyte-geforce-graphics-card-gtx570-1280mb...

Thanx!

Coolermaster Storm Enforcer Chassis/ Corsair TX750W PSU/ Gigabyte Ga-990fxa Mobo/ AMD Phenom X4 965 BE 3.4Ghz C3/Coolermaster V6GT CPU air cooler/ 8GB RAM Corsair DDR3 2000Mhz/ Gigabyte GTX570 Overclocked Edition GPU/ Windows 7 Prem 64bit/ 750Gb & 150Gb (FSX Dedicated) Sata's/ 23" Samsung BX2331 LED / Logitec S510 Wireless keyboard & Mouse. Logitec Force 3D Pro Joystick. Logitec Headset.

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Reply #14 - Jun 28^th, 2011 at 12:07pm

NNNG Ex Member

The Gigabyte.

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