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My first project (Read 606 times)
Dec 30th, 2008 at 3:05am

markag   Offline
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Hi,

A week or so ago I downloaded Gmax with the intent of creating planes for Flight Sim X. I've gone through several of the Gmax tutorials and have read/skimmed through some of the few online tutorials I could find, and decided that I was ready to start my model.

I started modeling a Cessna 404 a few days ago and see the image below for my progress so far. I've come to a point where I think I can start adding the props, canopy, and control surfaces. I'm sure I can figure out how to cut out and animate the control surfaces (I've seen tutorials on that), but I'm not sure how to approach the propellers.

Does anyone have any advice for me going on from here. Possibly a link to a tutorial for modeling and animating the propellers and prop disc? I haven't been able to dig up much information on this segment of the process.

...

As a side note, all of my modeling experience has been with 3D CAD systems (Catia to be specific). It's tough switching over in my mind from a precise constraint approach to free-form, looks about right, type of modeling. I'm enjoying Gmax so far, though, and I'm having fun with my first Gmax model.
« Last Edit: Jan 14th, 2009 at 5:09pm by markag »  

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Reply #1 - Dec 30th, 2008 at 7:51am

Alrot   Ex Member
I Love Simviation.

*
 

Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

Very well markag Remember its very important most of all its to export the plane into mdl (into the game as an mdl file) and make some of animation  work , I like very much this kind of thread ,I will show you my first plane ever made back in 2005 ,was an unshape model but I have in my mind one thing to make the engines landing gear , flaps , door to work inside FS2004 , I even paste a bitmap of a photo I found around

I even make a DVC and fully functional  Grin

...

...

of course this was makemdl9 the format for FS2004 ,now with FSX-SDK things are much easy and friendly

My idea first of all was to make a dummy airplane works
and learn
before to jump to make a real airplane ,It work for me

I couldn't learn without others ,
so Ask
what ever you need to know and keep on the good job on that plane


 
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Reply #2 - Dec 30th, 2008 at 12:39pm

markag   Offline
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Thanks for the encouragement.

My first question to all of you is: How do I go about modeling the propellers? All the pictures I've seen show individual propellers along with some sort of disc. What is the procedure to do this?
 

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Reply #3 - Dec 30th, 2008 at 1:05pm

Brett_Henderson   Offline
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There is no set way to do anything in Gmax  Cheesy   You just gotta feel your way through it.

What I do for propellers, is to model a single blade.. position it on the spinner.. set its axis point to match the center of the spinner.. and then clone the other blades (rotating them into position) (i.e..  90 degree spacing for four blades..  120 degrees for three blades.. and so on)..

Then of course you need to link them as children of the spinner..  then duplicate the whole thing (so you have a still and slow prop for animation).. and then take a third spinner (all by itself) and position a "flattened" one-segment cylinder for the "disk".. and of course child it to that third spiiner (it then becomes  the "blur" prop).

By a "flattened, one-segment" cylinder.. I mean.. Make a cylinder with one height segment, and one cap segment.. the radius of a prop blade (from its center)(or just eyeball it)... then make its height nearly zero.. weld all the pairs of vertices around the perimeter and then make it so that the two center vertices are about the width of a prop blade apart ...  it ends up looking like two, big cymbals, welded together at the rims..  The blades themselves are like modeling little, twisted wings..  I start with an 8-sided cylinder of many more height segments than I'll need (start with 20)(you'll prob end up with 8 or less).. flatten it.. taper it.. shape it and twist it..  Smiley


...
 
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Reply #4 - Dec 30th, 2008 at 3:40pm

markag   Offline
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Thanks! That should really help. I didn't realize I would need that many copies. This seems like a fairly complex step of the modeling, but also important. I'll be sure to keep you posted as I contue.
 

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Reply #5 - Dec 30th, 2008 at 4:59pm

Fr. Bill   Offline
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Another option for the "blurred" prop is to simply create a square polygon, then use the Alpha Channer to create the "prop's circle" with a transparency mask.
 

Bill
... Gauge Programming - 3d Modeling Eaglesoft Development Group Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600-4GB DDR2 Crucial PC6400-800 GB SATA-ATI Radeon HD2400 Pro 256MB DX10 NOTE: Unless explicitly stated in the post, everything written by my hand is MY opinion. I do NOT speak for any company, real or imagined...
...
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Reply #6 - Jan 14th, 2009 at 4:04pm

markag   Offline
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I've got another set of questions.

I'm in the process of modeling the landing gear now and am not sure how I should link the items together. I assume all the geometry in the gear need to be linked, but I'm not sure on the hierarchy. Also, after I get the gear modeled, I'll be working on gear doors. Do I link the gear doors to the gear as well, or do I want to keep them separate.

I will probably ask about animation later when I get to it, but do I need to create multiple wheels for stopped, slow, and blurred like I did for the props?

One more general question. Which pieces should I use the mirror modifier for and which should I use a copy? For example, As my model is set right now, I've mirrored the wing, cowls, and horizontal stab. I've created copies of the Spinner & Props. I did read that I'm not supposed to use the Mirror tool at the top, but instead use the one in the drop down box on the right. That is what I did.

I appreciate everyone's help and support thus far.

Mark
 

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Reply #7 - Jan 14th, 2009 at 11:00pm

MeekRN   Offline
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i dont know if this can be done, or is even appropirate, but cant you just steal or copy one from an existing plane and modify it to be spacific to your plane?
 
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Reply #8 - Jan 14th, 2009 at 11:23pm

markag   Offline
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MeekRN wrote on Jan 14th, 2009 at 11:00pm:
i dont know if this can be done, or is even appropirate, but cant you just steal or copy one from an existing plane and modify it to be spacific to your plane?


I have modeled or am currently modeling the components. I was just wondering what the appropriate way to get them on the other side of the plane was.
 

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Reply #9 - Jan 15th, 2009 at 7:18am

Brett_Henderson   Offline
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Quote:
i dont know if this can be done, or is even appropirate, but cant you just steal or copy one from an existing plane and modify it to be spacific to your plane?


Aside from the fact that you'd have to have the source code; it would be just as difficult to modify someone else's work, as it would be to do it yourself. Even if they're near identical gear.. you still have sizing, animation and texturing issues.


ANYway .. Gear hierarchy and animation can be as personal as modeling itself. There is no set way to do it.

The logic however, is the same. It's top-down, like you'd imagine, but the actual parenting is done bottom-up. With past MakeMdl versions, part naming was critical; as that's how base animations were applied. Now you can name to suit your method and then use the animation manager.

What get's parented, and where, and why, and to what; is part of the modeling process. It will seem daunting at first, but it will fall into place.

Here's a  "scissor"....

...

The bottom "scissor" is a child to the lower gear strut (piston), and that's where its pivot is set.  THe upper "scissor" is a child to the lower scissor, and where they "meet" is its pivot.

Where the upper scissor meets the upper strut (cylinder), ther is no link or pivot at all. As you animate gear compression, you'll animate a pivoting of both scissors so that it appears that upper scissor and upper strut are indeed linked at a pivot

Example.. As the gear compress; you animate the lower strut to pivot clock-wise. Since its child (upper scissor) will go along for the ride.. you animate a counter-clock-wise pivot for it... and with some geometry lessons and some trial and error.. you'll get it to where it looks like the upper scissor and upper strut never lose contact with each other.

Granted.. this is MY method, and might not work for you.. but i hope it gives you a visual on how to attack this.

As for the gear doors. They aren't linked to any part of the gear itself.. but they ARE assigned the same animation.. so that they will open/close as the gear are raised/lowered. This is where you'll get handy using key-frames.

With this type of nose gear.. you don't want the wheel coming down through the gear door, until the door has opened enough to allow it to pass by. SO..... for the first several frames, the gear is animated, but no motion initiates until the door has opened (it started it's motion from frame one and has stopped moving well before the gear is fully extended (or it might even re-close after the gear clears it)).

It's a combination of math and art .. (and a LOT of fun )   Cheesy

 
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Reply #10 - Jan 15th, 2009 at 11:14am

Fr. Bill   Offline
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markag wrote on Jan 14th, 2009 at 4:04pm:
One more general question. Which pieces should I use the mirror modifier for and which should I use a copy? For example, As my model is set right now, I've mirrored the wing, cowls, and horizontal stab. I've created copies of the Spinner & Props. I did read that I'm not supposed to use the Mirror tool at the top, but instead use the one in the drop down box on the right. That is what I did.

I appreciate everyone's help and support thus far.

Mark


If you haven't already done so, I highly recommend reading my mini-tutorial on "Mirroring Parts in Max/GMax Perfectly!"
http://www.aerodynamika.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?num=1183676822

(also available as a d/l PDF file: http://www.aerodynamika.com/gallery/Mirroring_in_Max.pdf

What is important to note is that it's really a trivial matter to perfectly clone/mirror animated parts.  The hardest part is changing the sign of the animated axis, typically from a minus to a plus...  Grin
 

Bill
... Gauge Programming - 3d Modeling Eaglesoft Development Group Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600-4GB DDR2 Crucial PC6400-800 GB SATA-ATI Radeon HD2400 Pro 256MB DX10 NOTE: Unless explicitly stated in the post, everything written by my hand is MY opinion. I do NOT speak for any company, real or imagined...
...
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Reply #11 - Jan 15th, 2009 at 9:23pm

markag   Offline
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Thanks guys

I'll have to take some time to process and try applying these techniques. I'm back at school now so my modeling progress has slowed down drastically. Thanks for the continued help.

Mark
 

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