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Thrust Vectoring (Read 2762 times)
Reply #15 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 9:12am
flymo   Ex Member

 
TV haha

a simmer can dream.... a simmer can dream....
 
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Reply #16 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 10:13am

machineman9   Offline
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overtaxed coders in M€$



aaaaaaaaaah just call it microsoft or MS!
 

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Reply #17 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 11:17am

Daube   Offline
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Quote:
TV haha

a FS simmer can dream.... a FS simmer can dream....

Just edited so that it makes more sense  Grin
 
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Reply #18 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 11:25am

Daube   Offline
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Well, no, no engine vector settings.  But in gMax, you make the entire model, and rotate so it faces straight down, or at a 45 degree angle down.  Then just set the contact points.

In FS, slew the harrier to an upright position, and takeoff.

Keep in mind, the harrier engine power, and lightest takeoff weights must be put in.

I don't see why it shouldn't work.  If it does, then ACES have got the easy job of rotating the model, and contact points around the model's center. It'll be like adding more concorde visor controls. Grin


I understand your idea, unfortunately this would not let you control the aircraft at low speeds. The result would alway look like those first missile tests during the war, you see ? When they get motor failure just  1 or two seconds after launch, and the rocket just fall horizontally to the ground  Tongue

Setting an additionnal helo motor would allow controlling the aircraft at low speeds and hover. Then, when pilot decrease the thrust angle, the power applyed to the helo rotor would decrease, and the power applyed to the jet engine would increase...

Yep, that would be great. AND it doesn't seem too complicated to implement, just a change like processing every types of motors at once, instead of processing only one of them depending on the aircraft type...

Damned, now I wish an ACES programmer would come here and discuss this topic with us, would be extremely interesting  Sad

HEY! Shut up ! Let me dream  Grin
 
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Reply #19 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 11:55am

Katahu   Offline
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Damned, now I wish an ACES programmer would come here and discuss this topic with us,


Developers don't normally visit any forums for good reasons.

1. There are internet trolls that tend to pop out of nowheresville and veir off topic with speculation and stuff like that just for the heck of it.

2. A topic can easily be flooded by a sea of other topics. As a result, other reader who aren't around at the time wouldn't have a chance to see the topic posted by the developer unless the reader is patient enought to sift through pages of topics all day. Because of this, the same developer would then have to post the same information over and over again for months at a time.

3. A blog is more useful as the information is never flooded like the forums therefore allowing the newcomers to read on the spot.

4. SimV is one of the biggest forums in the FS community. We're talking sections upon sections of discussions. A reader can spend a lifetime reading everything in this forum.

Why do you think I post my project's development on my own website rather than here? Besides, you can read the sim developers' progress through this link:

http://blogs.msdn.com/tdragger/default.aspx

This is just the blog of one such developer in the ACES team. Others' blogs can be found in the section where it says "FS Team Blogroll".
 
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Reply #20 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 12:16pm

Fr. Bill   Offline
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Well, that's not entirely accurate...

There are three ACES developers who quite frequently post at avsim.com and simflight.com...

Mike G. (aka tdragger)
Jason W. (aka pixelpoke)
Brian A. (aka brian@ms)

But it is most certainly true that they cannot be "everywhere" else they'd have no time for actual work... Wink
 

Bill
... Gauge Programming - 3d Modeling Eaglesoft Development Group Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600-4GB DDR2 Crucial PC6400-800 GB SATA-ATI Radeon HD2400 Pro 256MB DX10 NOTE: Unless explicitly stated in the post, everything written by my hand is MY opinion. I do NOT speak for any company, real or imagined...
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Reply #21 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 1:42pm

Katahu   Offline
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Well, that's not entirely accurate...

There are three ACES developers who quite frequently post at avsim.com and simflight.com...

Mike G. (aka tdragger)
Jason W. (aka pixelpoke)
Brian A. (aka brian@ms)



Well, I don't visit those forums so I couldn't have known. Wink
 
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Reply #22 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 2:41pm

x_jasper   Offline
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They may not 'appear' to have anything to do with this site and others like it, but actually they DO keep an eye on us.

Jasper
 

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Reply #23 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 8:09pm
cheesegrater   Ex Member

 
I rather have that FMC than thrust vectoring. Sad

Quote:
They may not 'appear' to have anything to do with this site and others like it, but actually they DO keep an eye on us.


That's what they want you to think. Grin
 
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Reply #24 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 9:00pm

Daube   Offline
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I rather have that FMC than thrust vectoring. Sad


FMC can be produced by third parties, just like it as ALREADY been done for the FREEWARE iFly 747.

Real thrust Vectoring cannot be added by third parties.

So I'd rather have thrust vectoring than FMC in the default game Wink
 
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Reply #25 - Aug 24th, 2006 at 9:35pm

Fr. Bill   Offline
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Well, I don't visit those forums so I couldn't have known. Wink


True enough... I visit 20 different forums and over 40 newsgroups on a daily basis.  Makes my morning cup of coffee last longer... Wink

Of course, this is part of my full-time job...

ACES used to post actively on flightsim.com, but quit after being horribly insulted my one of the management...  Roll Eyes
 

Bill
... Gauge Programming - 3d Modeling Eaglesoft Development Group Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600-4GB DDR2 Crucial PC6400-800 GB SATA-ATI Radeon HD2400 Pro 256MB DX10 NOTE: Unless explicitly stated in the post, everything written by my hand is MY opinion. I do NOT speak for any company, real or imagined...
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Reply #26 - Aug 26th, 2006 at 6:31pm
cheesegrater   Ex Member

 
Quote:
FMC can be produced by third parties, just like it as ALREADY been done for the FREEWARE iFly 747.

Real thrust Vectoring cannot be added by third parties.

So I'd rather have thrust vectoring than FMC in the default game Wink


The defualt FS airplanes have an FMC in real life, not thrust vectoring. Why would they leave holes in the defualt aircraft and model features that the defualt aircraft don't even use?

Without an FMC the defualt aircraft are not complete. This is why nobody flies the defualt planes. You have to install a billion add-ons to make FS any fun.

Thrust vectoring can be added by 3rd parties. You can have animated thrust vectors and tweak the airfile for more manouverability. How many people in the world know how a SU-37 is supposed to fly? Who cares if it not 100% accurate. Get X-Plane if it matters to you that much. X-Plane focuses more on flight dynamics and military jets. I want accurate systems simulation in civilian planes, that's why I like FS.
 
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Reply #27 - Aug 26th, 2006 at 10:16pm

Fr. Bill   Offline
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Quote:
The defualt FS airplanes have an FMC in real life, not thrust vectoring. Why would they leave holes in the defualt aircraft and model features that the defualt aircraft don't even use?

Without an FMC the defualt aircraft are not complete. This is why nobody flies the defualt planes. You have to install a billion add-ons to make FS any fun.


Every single ATP rated pilot I've ever spoken with has consistently told me that the single, most frequently used feature of an FMC is... the "Direct To" function.

What might 'float your boat' is programming a simulated computer to fly a simulated flightplan with a simulated aircraft to a simulated airport...

...but to many others that's about as exciting as watching paint dry...  Shocked

To me, the most challenging and enjoyable aspect of flightsimming is landing!  Manually! At dusk! In not-quite-IMC conditions!  8)

The second most enjoyable aspect is creating the models and gauge systems...  Grin

 

Bill
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Reply #28 - Aug 26th, 2006 at 11:24pm

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Quote:
The defualt FS airplanes have an FMC in real life, not thrust vectoring. Why would they leave holes in the defualt aircraft and model features that the defualt aircraft don't even use?

Without an FMC the defualt aircraft are not complete. This is why nobody flies the defualt planes. You have to install a billion add-ons to make FS any fun.

Thrust vectoring can be added by 3rd parties. You can have animated thrust vectors and tweak the airfile for more manouverability. How many people in the world know how a SU-37 is supposed to fly? Who cares if it not 100% accurate. Get X-Plane if it matters to you that much. X-Plane focuses more on flight dynamics and military jets. I want accurate systems simulation in civilian planes, that's why I like FS.


No, third parties cannot add thrust vectoring. Thrust vectoring has to be part of the main FS physics angine, and cannot be implemented externaly.

For the FMC, it's not the lack of FMC that prevented user to fly the default planes, else nobody would have ever used FS before the iFly 747 or the payware addons.

AND a LOT of people are flying the default planes, just because not everybody cares for the FMC, not everybody like liners, not everybody like fully automated stuff, etc...

Quote:
Thrust vectoring can be added by 3rd parties. You can have animated thrust vectors and tweak the airfile for more manouverability. How many people in the world know how a SU-37 is supposed to fly? Who cares if it not 100% accurate.

Who cares ? Everybody looking for realistic flight, that is a HUGE percentage of the simmers out there. If you don't care, go fly ace combat...

And the tweak of airfile for added manoeuvrability sucks !!! It just gives the world worst fly models of the sim !

Quote:
X-Plane focuses more on flight dynamics and military jets.

X-Plane is off-topic. We're talking about FSX here, and it's general lack of flight realism. You are only interestes in the gauges, I am interested in all the rest.

Quote:
The defualt FS airplanes have an FMC in real life, not thrust vectoring. Why would they leave holes in the defualt aircraft and model features that the defualt aircraft don't even use?

- because they have a lot of other things to implement as well to improve the flight environment
- because the FMC are already allowed by the sim, it can be fully implemented while thrust vectoring cannot.
- there will always be holes in the default aircraft. I think not every single button of any aircraft can be used, right ? PMDG makes you pay 35 euros just for ONE SINGLE PLANE. Knowing that FSX will have more than 20 planes, can you imagine how much it would cost to have real complete planes ?
 
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Reply #29 - Aug 26th, 2006 at 11:28pm

John_Murphy   Offline
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Does anyone remember the POGO tailstander X-plane of the 1950's?  That bird was one of the first VTOLs, and it transtioned from vertical to horizontal flight and back by using aileron/elevator/rudder input from propwash!  Tricky devil to land, but it did it using Nutonian Phisics!  Now, if somebody could figure out a guage which would "pivot" both thrust (propwash) and elevator/rudder functions to vertical mode while the aircraft "model" stayed horizontal.....
 
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