Search the archive:
YaBB - Yet another Bulletin Board
 
   
 
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print
Sunlight through canvas? (Read 567 times)
Aug 1st, 2006 at 9:04am

gryshnak   Offline
Colonel
Low flying is when you
have to dodge the trees
Hull. Yorkshire, UK

Gender: male
Posts: 1053
*****
 
Has anyone figured out how to make wings translucent?  Nothing compares to sunshine coming through a canvas wing, but translucent is not the same as transparent.  I'm not even sure it can be done in FS9, but I'd like to be proven wrong.

Gryshnak
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #1 - Aug 1st, 2006 at 9:11am

Fozzer   Offline
Colonel
An elderly FS 2004 addict!
Hereford. England. EGBS.

Posts: 24861
*****
 
I'm pretty sure my Flexwings and Microlights have translucent wings covered with Draclon.....
The light certainly shows through them, but not the scenery...in the Sim...!

Paul...Flexing his wings... 8)...!

P.S. Can you download one of the Microlights and have a peek at the wing material charactistics in Paint Shop Pro...?

The Thruster T-600N has translucent wings... Wink...!
 

Dell Dimension 5000 BTX Tower. Win7 Home Edition, 32 Bit. Intel Pentium 4, dual 2.8 GHz. 2.5GB RAM, nVidia GF 9500GT 1GB. SATA 500GB + 80GB. Philips 17" LCD Monitor. Micronet ADSL Modem only. Saitek Cyborg Evo Force. FS 2004 + FSX. Briggs and Stratton Petrol Lawn Mower...Motor Bikes. Gas Cooker... and lots of musical instruments!.... ...!
Yamaha MO6,MM6,DX7,DX11,DX21,DX100,MK100,EMT10,PSR400,PSS780,Roland GW-8L v2,TR505,Casio MT-205,Korg CX3v2 dual manual,+ Leslie 760,M-Audio Prokeys88,KeyRig,Cubase,Keyfax4,Guitars,Orchestral,Baroque,Renaissance,Medieval Instruments.
IP Logged
 
Reply #2 - Aug 1st, 2006 at 9:40am

Threadkiller   Offline
Colonel
gah!
London, Ontario

Gender: male
Posts: 2463
*****
 
Quote:
Can you download one of the Microlights and have a peek at the wing material charactistics in Paint Shop Pro...?

The Thruster T-600N has translucent wings... Wink...!


downloading it and getting th authors name and email might help, but not looking at it in paint shop pro, all because transparency/translucent properties are set by thematerial settings in the design program

i work with FSDS mainly, but i know that Max can generate a sort of translucent material...look for the stealth hurricane or something, a moel with all the interior pars\ts done and the skin is alsmot invisible, its available here at home....however, i am not sure if gmax can do this material trick, and im almost certain FSDS cant.

good luck!
 

...
IP Logged
 
Reply #3 - Aug 1st, 2006 at 4:04pm

gryshnak   Offline
Colonel
Low flying is when you
have to dodge the trees
Hull. Yorkshire, UK

Gender: male
Posts: 1053
*****
 
Downloading the Thruster now...

Edit: They don't look translucent to me.  Nice dynamic shine, but totally opaque.

Edit again: The flying surfaces on the Skyseeker are translucent, but only from underneath.  If you roll inverted Shocked it doesn't work.  But inverting a Skyseeker for more than a few seconds is cruel anyway.

Gryshnak
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #4 - Aug 1st, 2006 at 5:00pm

Fozzer   Offline
Colonel
An elderly FS 2004 addict!
Hereford. England. EGBS.

Posts: 24861
*****
 
Quote:
Downloading the Thruster now...

Edit: They don't look translucent to me.  Nice dynamic shine, but totally opaque.

Edit again: The flying surfaces on the Skyseeker are translucent, but only from underneath.  If you roll inverted Shocked it doesn't work.  But inverting a Skyseeker for more than a few seconds is cruel anyway.

Gryshnak


Try the Cosmos Ultralight Trike... Wink...!

Paul... 8)..!
 

Dell Dimension 5000 BTX Tower. Win7 Home Edition, 32 Bit. Intel Pentium 4, dual 2.8 GHz. 2.5GB RAM, nVidia GF 9500GT 1GB. SATA 500GB + 80GB. Philips 17" LCD Monitor. Micronet ADSL Modem only. Saitek Cyborg Evo Force. FS 2004 + FSX. Briggs and Stratton Petrol Lawn Mower...Motor Bikes. Gas Cooker... and lots of musical instruments!.... ...!
Yamaha MO6,MM6,DX7,DX11,DX21,DX100,MK100,EMT10,PSR400,PSS780,Roland GW-8L v2,TR505,Casio MT-205,Korg CX3v2 dual manual,+ Leslie 760,M-Audio Prokeys88,KeyRig,Cubase,Keyfax4,Guitars,Orchestral,Baroque,Renaissance,Medieval Instruments.
IP Logged
 
Reply #5 - Aug 1st, 2006 at 8:19pm
Jakemaster   Ex Member

 
Maybe if you paint them to be slightly translucent, using the black as transparent intead of shine, and giving it a dark tone?
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #6 - Aug 2nd, 2006 at 2:27am

gryshnak   Offline
Colonel
Low flying is when you
have to dodge the trees
Hull. Yorkshire, UK

Gender: male
Posts: 1053
*****
 
I had a look at the Skyseeker, the alpha channel for the wing is completely white so it's not a matter of transparency.  I've emailed the designer and asked how it was done, we'll see if I get a response.

The effect I'm trying to achieve is something like this:
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1070125/L/

Gryshnak
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #7 - Aug 2nd, 2006 at 4:53am

AuMaV   Offline
Colonel
Old Git
The Great Southern Land

Gender: male
Posts: 293
*****
 
Hi
There are 2 ways of doing it material or textures each has their own pros and cons
with material you need to build all the spars and cross sections in the wing and its always going to be transperent,also there is a lot more work involved Smiley where if you use transperent textures you can get away with minimal internal structure (you can paint in the spars ect and make them solid in the texture)if the end user wants to they can change the transperency to suit different models,paint jobs,coverings ect but you cant use the alpha channel for reflections.Rick Pipers Slingsby T21 Glider I think used the transperent texture for the wings ect give it a looksy as its pretty damn good Smiley
Cheers
Wozza
   
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #8 - Aug 2nd, 2006 at 12:36pm

gryshnak   Offline
Colonel
Low flying is when you
have to dodge the trees
Hull. Yorkshire, UK

Gender: male
Posts: 1053
*****
 
Okay, got a reply from Fern Marques who made the Skyseeker.  Apparently the wings look that way because they have a two-sided texture applied, and all double-sided materials in Gmax are slightly translucent.

Looks like I'll have to go back to Gmax for this one...

Gryshnak
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #9 - Aug 2nd, 2006 at 9:54pm

AuMaV   Offline
Colonel
Old Git
The Great Southern Land

Gender: male
Posts: 293
*****
 
Quote:
Okay, got a reply from Fern Marques who made the Skyseeker.  Apparently the wings look that way because they have a two-sided texture applied, and all double-sided materials in Gmax are slightly translucent.

Looks like I'll have to go back to Gmax for this one...

Gryshnak

Why You can do the same thing in FSDS3
call the material DS_whatever,when compiled it will draw the pollys double sided check the makemdl.doc file for more info
Wozza
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #10 - Aug 3rd, 2006 at 5:10pm

gryshnak   Offline
Colonel
Low flying is when you
have to dodge the trees
Hull. Yorkshire, UK

Gender: male
Posts: 1053
*****
 
Quote:
check the makemdl.doc file for more info

Where?  I printed the whole document out so I could read it thoroughly, and the only bit on textures I can find is near the end called "The Texture Folder" where it talks about mipmaps.  I can't find any reference to "ds_" any more than I could find mention of "_t" a month or two back.  Do I have a different version of makemdl or something?

Gryshnak
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #11 - Aug 3rd, 2006 at 11:01pm

AuMaV   Offline
Colonel
Old Git
The Great Southern Land

Gender: male
Posts: 293
*****
 
Hi Mate
here is the sections whilst small they are in the makemdl.doc file
LINE_      Lines are drawn instead of triangles.
ZBIAS_      A default z-bias is added to the polygons.
ZBIAS_##      A z-bias of ## is added to the polygons.
DS_      Polygons are drawn double sided.
BRIGHT_      The material is bright (emits light).
LIGHT_BEACON      A beacon point light is drawn, and the diffuse color is the light color.
LIGHT_STROBE      A strobe point light is drawn, and the diffuse color is the light color
LIGHT_RECO      A recognition point light is drawn, and the diffuse color is the light color
LIGHT_WING      A wing point light is drawn, and the diffuse color is the light color.
LIGHT_LOGO      A logo point light is drawn, and the diffuse color is the light color.
LIGHT_NAV      A navigation point light is drawn, and the diffuse color is the light color.
LIGHT_TAXI      A taxi spotlight is drawn, and the diffuse color is the light color.
LIGHT_LAND      A landing spotlight is drawn, and the diffuse color is the light color.
Animate_VCRainMoving_16_20_
     The physical geometry under the airspeed_effects_windshield node need a material name of animate_VCRainMoving_16_20_ and must mapped to texture VCRainMoving0000.bmp.  The material needs to be at 0 percent opacity.  See the Gmax_aircraft SDK for more details.
Animate_VCRainStopped_16_20_      The physical geometry under the airspeed_effects_windshield node need a material name of animate_VCRainStopped_16_20_ and must mapped to texture VCRainStopped0000.bmp.  The material needs to be at 0 percent opacity.  See the Gmax_aircraft SDK for more details.
Animate_ChainSegment_16_100_      The physical geometry under the engine0_turning node needs a material name of Animate_ChainSegment_16_100_ and must mapped to texture ChainSegment0000.bmp. See the Gmax_aircraft SDK for more details.
Texture Names
MakeMDL makes the following assumptions about texture names:
•      No matter what the texture extension is in the .x file, the output file references a texture with a .bmp extension. If you model with .tga files, the output file references a .bmp file.
•      If the texture name starts with “DECAL_” a z-bias is added automatically to all polygons drawn with this texture.
•      If the texture name is “DECAL_NNUMBER” then the texture is used for the NNumber of the aircraft.
•      If the texture name ends with “_T” then the texture is the undamaged version of the texture (the damaged version ends with “_D”).
•      If the texture name starts with “$” or “_panel_” then the texture is assumed to be a virtual cockpit (VC) gauge texture.


You do have the fs9 sdks/makemdl and not the fs2002 ones?
Wozza
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #12 - Aug 4th, 2006 at 3:05am

gryshnak   Offline
Colonel
Low flying is when you
have to dodge the trees
Hull. Yorkshire, UK

Gender: male
Posts: 1053
*****
 
Doh!  I've been looking in the Aircraft Container System documentation!  Right, looks like I've got a bit more reading to do...

Thanks Wozza!

Gryshnak
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #13 - Aug 5th, 2006 at 12:56pm

gryshnak   Offline
Colonel
Low flying is when you
have to dodge the trees
Hull. Yorkshire, UK

Gender: male
Posts: 1053
*****
 
I don't know, maybe I'm getting a bit slow in my old age...

I created a texture (a 1024x1024 bitmap with "This is a test" written all over it), named it ds_test.bmp and saved it.

Then I created a simple polygon in FSDSv3, and assigned the ds_test.bmp texture to it.

Then I exported it to FS9, to find it was only visible from the top.  From underneath there's nothing there.  It's not double sided.  I tried it again with a tube and got the same result, the texture was only visible from the outside.

This was so simple, any suggestions what's gone wrong this time?  Roll Eyes

Gryshnak
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #14 - Aug 5th, 2006 at 8:20pm

AuMaV   Offline
Colonel
Old Git
The Great Southern Land

Gender: male
Posts: 293
*****
 
No no no Smiley
you need to name the MATERIAL for the wing DS_wingcover
this will make the polys for the wing double side when compiled.So you make the wing brake away the polys for the transperent covering goto the material function in fsds3,add a material give it an alpha of say 200 and name it DS_wingcove.Apply the texture normally to the wing and when compiled makemdl will mirror all the pollys with DS_wingcover material applied to them ...In theroy Smiley
Wozza


edit just had a quick play and it works as advitised Cheesy
here is a VERY bad example fsc Smiley
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~au_mav/test.zip
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print