Search the archive:
YaBB - Yet another Bulletin Board
 
   
 
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5
Send Topic Print
Will you be buying? (Read 4359 times)
Reply #15 - Jul 12th, 2006 at 9:56pm

Katahu   Offline
Colonel

Gender: male
Posts: 6920
*****
 
Quote:
I won't be buying unless I can get my hands on a rig that will allow me to run it with full settings. And, considering that I will probably never have such a system, I'll just have to learn to live without FSX.


You don't have to learn it. You're living without it right now. Grin
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #16 - Jul 12th, 2006 at 11:02pm

Lazerbeak   Offline
Colonel
[ch1055][ch1091][ch1
089][ch1090][ch1100]
[ch1073][ch1077][ch1
075][ch1091][ch1090]
[ch1085][ch1077][ch1
091][ch1082][ch1083]
[ch1102][ch1078][ch1
077] [ch1087][ch1077][ch1
096][ch1077][ch1093]
[ch1086][ch1076][ch1
099] [ch1087][ch1086]
[ch1083][ch1091][ch1
078][ch1072][ch1084]
...
A house.

Gender: male
Posts: 712
*****
 
Quote:
You don't have to learn it. You're living without it right now. Grin

True. I guess I just have to keep up what I'm doing then. Grin
 

...&&&&
The proletarians of the world have nothing to lose but their chains. They have a world to win. WORKERS OF THE WORLD, UNITE!
IP Logged
 
Reply #17 - Jul 12th, 2006 at 11:09pm

Daube   Offline
Colonel
Alternative bloomer
Nice (FR)

Gender: male
Posts: 5833
*****
 
Quote:
The bulk of our community say 70~90% are what might be categorized as casual gamers. purists and aviation enthusiasts account for a small minority. MS is not going to deliver what a small minority wants, there simply is not enough return in it for them. Hence things like air dynamics etc are taylored for the masses who would find aerodynamic concepts and historical accuracy too challenging. In other words, getting it right results in either a poor seller or a long life span product - not good for business.

But they did it for 20 years, since the first Flight simulator. Fortunatelly they are going smarter, and they will soon stop the flight sim serie to begin a new Crismon Skies serie for the next 20 years, right ?  Roll Eyes

Quote:
An example is the fact that you hardly ever see anyone complain about the bull**** ground speed in any of these sims. Trust me on this, 200 feet altitude at 450 knots is very, very different from what you see in CFS1/2/3 FS9 etc. In the virtual world the average punter would fly straight into the side of a hill if MS sims were accurate in this respect. Although in my opinion they should at least get this one right as it would be a major selling point.

What do you mean there ? That what you see on your screen is not as you see it in real life ? LOL and then you proudly state that the sim is not precise ? Yeah most likely they have used some dumb math formula they took off from FeeSpace2, and applied it to FS to get less realism on purpose  Grin Grin  Roll Eyes

I have programmed some similar application. The fact is that you will never get the same speed feeling as in real life, until the ground gets as detailed as in real life, and your screen gets as big as it can. BUT the sim is currently accurate, and there's just nothing to complain about. If you flight 450 mph at 200 feet in the sim during X seconds, you will go exactely the same distance as if you would flight 450 mph at 200 feet during X seconds in real life. Your small screen, your small resolution and the actual visual level of detail in the sims just can't give you the same feelling for now.  Tongue

Quote:
Someone on this thread stated that FSX will have improved flight modelling, I don't think so.

Personally I would agree with the general concensus that MS are hedging toward gaming, i.e. xbox and it's offsprings.

Why ? Because they have adapted the interface so that you could pilot on a Joypad instead of a yoke ? Wow, do you know the first versions of the sim could be played with the mouse ? or even with the keyboard ? Sooooooo arcade, I tell you...  Grin
Does anybody there seriously think that FS could ever be played on a gaming Console ? No chance with the actual console players, and No chance either without a keyboard and a mouse.

Quote:
For the enthusiast minority, I think it would be better to 'wait and see'. After all, plenty out there who are so eager to get the latest offering no matter what you tell em. This way there will be plenty of feedback, and at least FSX will have been given a chance.

true Smiley

Quote:
Alternatively, re-write all the airfiles, damage profiles, model scaling, and make accurate sound files. Then you have a half decent sim.

half-decent, you're even more pessimistic than I am  Grin
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #18 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 4:25am

x_jasper   Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 224
*****
 
Quote:
What do you mean there ? That what you see on your screen is not as you see it in real life ? LOL and then you proudly state that the sim is not precise ? Yeah most likely they have used some dumb math formula they took off from FeeSpace2, and applied it to FS to get less realism on purpose  Grin Grin  Roll Eyes

I have programmed some similar application. The fact is that you will never get the same speed feeling as in real life, until the ground gets as detailed as in real life, and your screen gets as big as it can. BUT the sim is currently accurate, and there's just nothing to complain about. If you flight 450 mph at 200 feet in the sim during X seconds, you will go exactely the same distance as if you would flight 450 mph at 200 feet during X seconds in real life. Your small screen, your small resolution and the actual visual level of detail in the sims just can't give you the same feelling for now.  :



Ground speed in MS sims is a scaling issue, CFS3 being a fine example of this.

If it was correct in the sim then probably the average graphic / CPU would not be able to keep up with rendering such a large amount of data in such a short space of time.

Another example is CFS3 fly-by, even at 500MPH the fly by aircraft appears as though it was doing ~150-200MPH. Again, if it were realistic your average comp would not be able to render the graphics quick enough.

Actually, now I think of it I'll go into the CFS3 fly-by XML and see what happens by changing this--food for thought.

**Later edit:- fly-by XML does precisely "nothing"

why oh why put an accessible config in the sim when it is hard coded and embeded anyway ??? Angry
About what you'd expect I suppose.

Jasper
« Last Edit: Jul 13th, 2006 at 4:21pm by x_jasper »  

P4 2.5. massive huge 10 foot display.
IP Logged
 
Reply #19 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 5:44am

Fozzer   Offline
Colonel
An elderly FS 2004 addict!
Hereford. England. EGBS.

Posts: 24861
*****
 
...Definitely...Grin...!

I just think that Uncle Bill and his designer crew try to give us what we wish for, within the bounds of cost, our capability, and sensibility.... Wink...!
As long as they are still interested in producing "reasonably good" flight Simulators for our "amusement", I will continue to support them by purchasing each version as it is released... Grin...!

Without our enthusiastic support, like everything else, the series will go down the pan, I'm sure... Cry...!

As I said before, it's only a flippin' "game" which we all enjoy, after all...
...like lots of my other enjoyable computer games which I play every day...Grin...!
LOL...!

Paul...I need to get out more...Wink...!

 

Dell Dimension 5000 BTX Tower. Win7 Home Edition, 32 Bit. Intel Pentium 4, dual 2.8 GHz. 2.5GB RAM, nVidia GF 9500GT 1GB. SATA 500GB + 80GB. Philips 17" LCD Monitor. Micronet ADSL Modem only. Saitek Cyborg Evo Force. FS 2004 + FSX. Briggs and Stratton Petrol Lawn Mower...Motor Bikes. Gas Cooker... and lots of musical instruments!.... ...!
Yamaha MO6,MM6,DX7,DX11,DX21,DX100,MK100,EMT10,PSR400,PSS780,Roland GW-8L v2,TR505,Casio MT-205,Korg CX3v2 dual manual,+ Leslie 760,M-Audio Prokeys88,KeyRig,Cubase,Keyfax4,Guitars,Orchestral,Baroque,Renaissance,Medieval Instruments.
IP Logged
 
Reply #20 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 6:24am

Ashton Lawson   Offline
Colonel
FS Water Configurator
Programmer
Phuket, Thailand

Gender: male
Posts: 1211
*****
 
Back to the subject of the forum.  Yes, I will buy FSX.  The only thing that'll change my mind about buying it, is if it costs $10,000,000, or if it looks worse than FS98 (which it doesn't).

Many may disagree, but FS is a game, to me, probably to MS, and to other people, but nomatter what you may call it, its still a great expierience, especially when they don't let capable 14-year-olds fly even a Cessna. Tongue
 

...&&FS Water Configurator+ has new modifications in the works, plus DirectX 10, Service Pack&&1, and Radeon HD 3+ Series support.
IP Logged
 
Reply #21 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 11:19am

Daube   Offline
Colonel
Alternative bloomer
Nice (FR)

Gender: male
Posts: 5833
*****
 
Quote:
Ground speed in MS sims is a scaling issue, CFS3 being a fine example of this.

If it was correct in the sim then probably the average graphic / CPU would not be able to keep up with rendering such a large amount of data in such a short space of time.

Another example is CFS3 fly-by, even at 500MPH the fly by aircraft appears as though it was doing ~150-200MPH. Again, if it were realistic your average comp would not be able to render the graphics quick enough.

Actually, now I think of it I'll go into the CFS3 fly-by XML and see what happens by changing this--food for thought.

Jasper


You seem to be such an expert in simulation.  Cheesy
I'll give you an advise: don't talk about things you do not know ANYTHING about.

You are talking about visual feeling, and that all.
The plane in the sim has a correct speed. when its going 250 mph ground speed, it will just go 250 mile in one hour.
There is no scaling.
There is no fu**ing MS conspiracy.

It's just like that. See the same game, on a cinema screen and with a correctly set angle field of view, and you will think it's fast. See it on your small screen with small resolution and stupid angle field of view, and it will SEEM slow, but it's not. The speed in the sim is correct. There's just nothing there about the peformance of your CPU.

Want to test ? Just take any runway of precise lenght, 0 wind, and a chronometer.
Then take an aircraft on very low altitude and fix speed, and try to measure how much time it takes to go from one end of the runway to the other.
Then use a little formula to compute your real speed and see if it's different.

You surely have some programming skills, don't you ? Why don't you try to make a little test program to display a moving object in a 3D environment ? You would be very surprised...haem, dissapointed  Grin
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #22 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 11:48am

Daube   Offline
Colonel
Alternative bloomer
Nice (FR)

Gender: male
Posts: 5833
*****
 
I've just re-read my post and realized it looked a little bit violent. X-jasper, I hope you won't be offended, sorry for that, just trying to explain, you know Wink
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #23 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 12:17pm

Katahu   Offline
Colonel

Gender: male
Posts: 6920
*****
 
There are times [in real life] that I normally see airliners appear to nearly stall in the air while in fact, they are still flying at reasonable speeds. It has something to do with the laws of physics. The closer you are to the speed of light, the faster that time [outside the vehicle] goes by. So, to the outside observer the airliner would look like its near the stalling point while the passengers onboard would see the cars breaking all the speed limits. Grin

However, I don't know if the laws apply to the simulator. Grin
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #24 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 12:20pm
Heathaze   Ex Member

 
I'm waiting to see what others make of it before I decide purchase it. I'm happy with FS9 so I feel no need to rush out and get this latest upgrade the second it comes out.
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #25 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 1:00pm

Fozzer   Offline
Colonel
An elderly FS 2004 addict!
Hereford. England. EGBS.

Posts: 24861
*****
 
Quote:
I'm waiting to see what others make of it before I decide purchase it. I'm happy with FS9 so I feel no need to rush out and get this latest upgrade the second it comes out.


Aww....Go on... Wink...!
You know you wont be able to resist it... Wink...!

The nice new cardboard box with a picture of an aeroplane on the front, and a shiny jewel case inside containing some disks that reflect the wide smile on your face stretching from ear to ear.... Grin...!

It's going to happen, and you know it... Wink...!

LOL...!

Paul... 8)...!
 

Dell Dimension 5000 BTX Tower. Win7 Home Edition, 32 Bit. Intel Pentium 4, dual 2.8 GHz. 2.5GB RAM, nVidia GF 9500GT 1GB. SATA 500GB + 80GB. Philips 17" LCD Monitor. Micronet ADSL Modem only. Saitek Cyborg Evo Force. FS 2004 + FSX. Briggs and Stratton Petrol Lawn Mower...Motor Bikes. Gas Cooker... and lots of musical instruments!.... ...!
Yamaha MO6,MM6,DX7,DX11,DX21,DX100,MK100,EMT10,PSR400,PSS780,Roland GW-8L v2,TR505,Casio MT-205,Korg CX3v2 dual manual,+ Leslie 760,M-Audio Prokeys88,KeyRig,Cubase,Keyfax4,Guitars,Orchestral,Baroque,Renaissance,Medieval Instruments.
IP Logged
 
Reply #26 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 1:49pm

vololiberista   Offline
Colonel
Vieni in Italia

Posts: 1042
*****
 
Quote:
Aww....Go on... Wink...!
You know you wont be able to resist it... Wink...!

The nice new cardboard box with a picture of an aeroplane on the front, and a shiny jewel case inside containing some disks that reflect the wide smile on your face stretching from ear to ear.... Grin...!

It's going to happen, and you know it... Wink...!
LOL...!
Paul... 8)...!



Some of obviously don't have ANY self control!!!  Grin
Vololiberista
 

Andiamo in Italia&&...
IP Logged
 
Reply #27 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 4:36pm

x_jasper   Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 224
*****
 
Daube,

Ask yourself this: did I at any time say there was an error with aircraft speed at low level.

Do you really believe that if you were in an aircraft doing ~450+ Kts at 200' and you looked out to port at say a church or other building that it would gently pass you by as you merely poodled along at a mere 500MPH?

If you do then I can only think you must be one of those rare individuals who thinks Aircrew headgear is designed to withstand crash impact.


Close objects whizz past at those speeds and altitudes---fact. You also have to remember 500MPH is in the realms of average bullet speed.


KMA

Jasper

 

P4 2.5. massive huge 10 foot display.
IP Logged
 
Reply #28 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 6:36pm

ashaman   Offline
Colonel
I'm from Italy, errors
in my text are a given.
LIRN

Gender: male
Posts: 1752
*****
 
Not buying.

Actually not even taking it for free. If someone wanted to make me a present of it, I would ask for an exchange with something else and better (not a difficult task nor a long stretch at all).
 

There's but one real cure for human stupidity. It's called DEATH.&&&&At the moment mourning the assassination of sarcasm and irony for the good of the "higher".&&&&Proud FSIX user. Active user of FS98, X-plane and novice of Orbiter.&&&&Seen the GREAT service pack for FSX and its usefulness, really awaiting for FS11 to upgrade.&&&&AMD Athlon Xp 2400@2700&&MB Asus A7V8XX&&1Gb ram DDR 400 @ 333&&ASL Nvidia Geforce 6600gt 128Mb DDR3 AGP&&Creative Sound Blaster Live&&Windows XP Professional Sp2&&2 HD Maxtor 40Gb - 1 HD Maxtor 80Gb
IP Logged
 
Reply #29 - Jul 13th, 2006 at 8:35pm

cavity   Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 388
*****
 
I remember when FS9 came out and I was running 2002.  I said no, dont get it.   It wont run well, let them work the bugs out.  Ill have to patch it.  Got it the next day.  Still have everything that came with it, tin box and all the cards.  It really is becoming  something to collect, although I cant find anything from 2002!  I say Ill wait, then Ill see a screenshot of an Airbus approaching ahead of a thunderstorm, and Ill buy it.  It is getting rather tedious building them up over two years and then starting all over again.  It has taken me those two years just to get a stable system, and I still have issues at times.  It almost like the challenge of trying to make it perfect keeps ya going.  Either that or I need a sledge to the head to straighten me out.  Todd
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5
Send Topic Print