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Did they land on the Moon? (Read 4289 times)
Reply #15 - Dec 21st, 2005 at 4:58pm

C   Offline
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Well, if Neil Armstrong didn't do it, Wallace and Gromit did, and personally I'd be happy to find the moon was made of cheese.

I think it probably did... Smiley
 
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Reply #16 - Dec 21st, 2005 at 7:06pm

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Yes, we Americans landed on the moon.  More than once.  Why would NASA fake several landings??  Why would NASA fake an entire space program only to produce "fake" photos and related news, etc.??  We lost 3 astronauts in a tragic space capsule fire in January 1967.  Was that faked?  Are all the probes that have been sent to Mars also fake??  I don't think so.  The next time you see an aircraft fly by or even fly in one, remember: "They said it couldn't be done."  Well, "They" were wrong.  We did it more than once, and someone will do it again. . . Mars awaits.  
 
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Reply #17 - Dec 21st, 2005 at 7:26pm

Hagar   Offline
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Quote:
Yes, we Americans landed on the moon.  More than once.  Why would NASA fake several landings??  Why would NASA fake an entire space program only to produce "fake" photos and related news, etc.??  We lost 3 astronauts in a tragic space capsule fire in January 1967.  Was that faked?  Are all the probes that have been sent to Mars also fake??

Nobody is suggesting that the whole program was faked. The circumstances of the time made it vitally important that America beat the USSR to the Moon on behalf of the whole Western world. This was literally a matter of life & death & the result could have changed the history of everything that has happened since. Now, all I'm asking you to consider is this. If by any chance & despite all their efforts the people at NASA realised that they could not succeed that they would not have a Plan B ready to go. There is always a Plan B. I believe that it's more than likely that Neil Armstrong did walk on the Moon in 1969. If he didn't & it was faked then it was the biggest propaganda coup in history.
 

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Reply #18 - Dec 21st, 2005 at 7:35pm

RichieB16   Offline
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I would imagine that Hagar is probably right, there probably was a backup plan to fake the landings if it did become neccessary.  Because, there is always a backup plan.

What I would expect it is never went any farther than being known only by a select few if it was infact a backup plan.

At the time of the landings in 1969 (or "suspected" landings  Wink), we had pretty much known that the Soviets were way behind in the race to put a man on the moon (they had yet to have a successiful test launch on the only rocket they had large enough for the task-and in the end they never did).  So, even if Apollo 11 had failed, it was very unlikely they were going to beat us-we could have taken our time.  But, Kennedy has promised the moon by the end of the decade and that was also an important goal.

I don't think for a second that the landings were faked, I believe that all 6 were real.  I am willing to believe that there was probably some kind of contingency plan to fake it if it was absolutely neccessary though.
 
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Reply #19 - Dec 21st, 2005 at 7:52pm

Hagar   Offline
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Thanks Richie. Despite what some people seem to think I was never anti-American, nor do I have communist sympathies. If I was a communist I would come right out & say so as I've always been honest (some say too honest) & have nothing to hide. I've been accused of many things in my time but this one's a first. Roll Eyes

I seem to recall that Wernher von Braun had some doubts about actually landing a man on the Moon. His objective had always been a flip round it & return to Earth. I think he would have preferred that for the first attempt at least. I also remember you mentioning that the Russians faked their first space walk. Not the actual walk but the film of it that was released afterwards. Maybe this could explain some of the conspiracy theories about that first Moon landing. People seem to forget that was the important one & any that might have happened afterwards are irrelevant.
 

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Reply #20 - Dec 21st, 2005 at 8:04pm

RichieB16   Offline
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There was never a video made during Alexei Leonov's Voskhod 2 spacewalk in March of 1965 (the first space walk).  The Soviet government released a video on Moscow TV of Leonov during spacewalk training and said it was the spacewalk video.  So, I'm not sure how planned that was, but the video of him performing his spacewalk is "faked" because it was actually a film of him training.

One interesting thing about von Braun is he presented two ways to put a man on the moon to NASA.  One was called "Earth-Orbit Rendezvous" in which a bunch of small launches were conducted and they would rendezvous in orbit and assemble a large spacecraft that once completed would be flown to the moon.  His other idea (the one he favored) was called "Direct Accent."  The idea here was simply build a huge rocket with large capsule and fly to the moon.  The capsule would have a module below it with legs and the whole thing would land on the moon.  Then, the whole capsule would lift off and return.  So, no rendezvous was needed during the mission at all.

He believed these were the only ways to successifully and safely get to the moon.  In the end, both of these plans were rejected by NASA in favor of a different plan (Lunar-Orbit Rendezvous-which was what was done during the Apollo program).  So, I wonder if his comments maybe in part due to this.
 
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Reply #21 - Dec 22nd, 2005 at 4:26am

H   Offline
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Quote:
Do you think the americans landed on the moon? If you dont, please state why.

Quote:
No, it would have sank into the cheese!

Quote:
Just let me make one thing quite clear. This was as important to me as it was to you or anyone in the Western world.
And how important it was! Remember my early days (er, nights) in these posts, Hagar, when you admitted to having been the Man in the Moon Grin ? I was so concerned and relieved to learn that our lunar mission had successfully rescued you from starvation -- after you'd left the moon devoid of its cheese. Wink 8)
 
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Reply #22 - Dec 22nd, 2005 at 6:48am

masmith   Offline
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Check this out-

Covers all the points a proves that the hoax is wrong
and that the americans did land on the moon.

http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/tv/foxapollo.html
 

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Reply #23 - Dec 22nd, 2005 at 7:07am

Hagar   Offline
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Quote:
Check this out-

Covers all the points a proves that the hoax is wrong
and that the americans did land on the moon.

http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/tv/foxapollo.html

I don't think that proves anything one way or the other. Fox TV does not have the best reputation for factual reporting. The only actual proof would be for someone to go there & find out.
 

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Reply #24 - Dec 22nd, 2005 at 1:23pm

RichieB16   Offline
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Quote:
The only actual proof would be for someone to go there & find out.

I'll do it!  Now, only if I could find someone to send me there...
 
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Reply #25 - Dec 22nd, 2005 at 1:44pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
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After reading though some of the link supplied by masmith I find myself wanting the moon landing to be a hoax simply to proove the nit who wrote it wrong.

So to me it's obious that it was faked at Area 51 with Lee Harvey Oswald as it's director, writer, actors and rocket. Smiley
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
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Reply #26 - Dec 22nd, 2005 at 1:59pm

RichieB16   Offline
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Quote:
So to me it's obious that it was faked at Area 51 with Lee Harvey Oswald as it's director, writer, actors and rocket. Smiley

Of all the moon hoax theories I have ever read, I think this one is the most valid.  Woody, you have swayed me.   Wink Grin
 
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Reply #27 - Dec 22nd, 2005 at 2:56pm

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In order to assign any level of plausability to a notion that the moon landings were fake, consider the very large number of conspirators to such a fake landing would have to be.  Also consider that large number of  conspirators would have to remain silent for all of over 30 years, with not 1 participant even uttering a peep.  No death-bed concience clearing, not second thoughts by the guilty minded, no "brave souls" going on the talk circuit promoting their tell-all books, there's none of any of this that we see all the time in this day and age.  It's tremendously inpalusable.

We have news reporters, who by nature would be very keen to win that pulitzer by exposing a faked moon landing.

We have technicians, astronauts, their family, support personnel, mainanence workers, controllers, personnel who orchastrated and constructed the props for the fakery, etc.  The number of conspirators to such an event that had such a world wide audience would number in the hundereds if not thousands.  Is this possible?  yes  Is this plausable?  Nope.
 

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Reply #28 - Dec 22nd, 2005 at 3:22pm

Hagar   Offline
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Quote:
In order to assign any level of plausability to a notion that the moon landings were fake, consider the very large number of conspirators to such a fake landing would have to be.  Also consider that large number of  conspirators would have to remain silent for all of over 30 years, with not 1 participant even uttering a peep.  No death-bed concience clearing, not second thoughts by the guilty minded, no "brave souls" going on the talk circuit promoting their tell-all books, there's none of any of this that we see all the time in this day and age.  It's tremendously inpalusable.

We have news reporters, who by nature would be very keen to win that pulitzer by exposing a faked moon landing.

We have technicians, astronauts, their family, support personnel, mainanence workers, controllers, personnel who orchastrated and constructed the props for the fakery, etc.  The number of conspirators to such an event that had such a world wide audience would number in the hundereds if not thousands.  Is this possible?  yes  Is this plausable?  Nope.

I have a good example of where that actually happened. Remember we were discussing Bletchley Park recently? This was a top secret establishment where security was of the utmost national importance. Despite this, 10,000 people from all walks of life & including many young girls, worked there towards the end of WWII. There was not room for them to be based there permanently so many lodged with local people in the surrounding area. Although there was strict security in the establishment itself there was no restriction on any of these people entering or leaving at will providing they had the necessary security screening. If it had become known what was actually done there & the Germans had got word of it the whole thing would have been a complete failure. Not one of these people ever talked about what they did there even to their loved ones & many took their secrets to the grave. The establishment was run on a "need to know" basis so although they knew it was vitally important many of them never knew the complete picture.

Secondly, it's been openly admitted that some of the video footage was not actually what it was supposed to be. This could have been a mistake or intentional but after seeing the first Moon landing shown continually on TV programs for many days afterwards I suspected even then that all was not what it appeared to be. I'm not saying that the whole operation was faked or that Neil Armstrong did not actually walk on the Moon but it's perfectly possible the pictures we saw of him doing it might not have been all they seemed. The Russians had done the same thing with their first space walk several years before as Richie confirmed. Please don't dismiss this out of hand as even today some people take their loyalty to their country seriously enough to keep quiet, for ever if necessary.
 

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Reply #29 - Dec 22nd, 2005 at 3:35pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
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Quote:
In order to assign any level of plausability to a notion that the moon landings were fake, consider the very large number of conspirators to such a fake landing would have to be.  Also consider that large number of  conspirators would have to remain silent for all of over 30 years, with not 1 participant even uttering a peep.  No death-bed concience clearing, not second thoughts by the guilty minded, no "brave souls" going on the talk circuit promoting their tell-all books, there's none of any of this that we see all the time in this day and age.  It's tremendously inpalusable.

We have news reporters, who by nature would be very keen to win that pulitzer by exposing a faked moon landing.

We have technicians, astronauts, their family, support personnel, mainanence workers, controllers, personnel who orchastrated and constructed the props for the fakery, etc.  The number of conspirators to such an event that had such a world wide audience would number in the hundereds if not thousands.  Is this possible?  yes  Is this plausable?  Nope.

From what your saying you make it sound as if the entire space programme was said to be fake.

As Astronauts have undeniably been going into space it would be relatively simple for a moon landing to be faked with no-one but those directly involved ever knowing. Think about it, the only people who would know for sure were the astronauts in the shuttle sent into space, the people controlling that mission, the people in the space suits in the films/pictures, anyone who had to be in the studio at the time and the person who ordered it. All said and done that would probably amount to less than 200 people if done well.
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
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