Simviation Forum - Plane crash in greece...

Reply #30 - Aug 15^th, 2005 at 2:54am

krylite Offline
Colonel
ftg VA LH584

Posts: 89

Just looks suspicious to me. 2c. A horrible way to go if many aboard were conscious.

&&Waiting for the Queen, PMDG!&&ega-GeForce FX5200 128mb DDR AGP8x

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #31 - Aug 15^th, 2005 at 5:58am

Sytse Offline
Colonel
Virtual Red Arrows
The Netherlands

Gender:
Posts: 3590

Only text message received: The pilot looks blue (from cold) goodbye, cousin.
So the guy saw the pilot. That explains that he was not in the cockpit.
Only pilot seen in cockpit was the FO. He was lying over his contolls.
As for the black boxes. I don't think he cockpit voice recorder wil be a great help, since it only records the last 30 minutes of flight. I think they all passed out long before that.
These are all facts. No speculation.

&&Virtual Red Arrows homepage

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #32 - Aug 15^th, 2005 at 6:22am

Nexus Offline
Colonel
The greater of two evils...

Gender:
Posts: 3282

What if the Oxygen masks failed to deliver oxygen?
AP disconnects because of forward force is applied to the control column by the unconciousness pilot, hence putting the 737 in a shallow descent.

I have read everything I have on the 737 pressurization and air condition systems, and all I can say is that I cant for the life of me understand how this tragic event was initialized. You'd have lotsa bells and alarms ringing if pressure is lost.

will be VERY interesting to see what the CVR reveals.

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #33 - Aug 15^th, 2005 at 1:08pm

Saitek Offline
Colonel
UK

Gender:
Posts: 7555

This is really worth a read. Read the write-ins at the bottom.
I found this one of interest (she lives where my Aunty lives btw)

Quote:

In 1987 a (Monarch Airlines) 737 I was on (bound for Chania in Crete) lost cabin pressure/underwent sudden and total decompression somewhere over (mountainous) north Greece, and (to cut a longer story short) after a terrifying 'rapid descent' of about 30,000ft made an emergency landing at Athens airport. We passengers didn't know what was going on at the time - I for one thought we had all had our chips. This news made me wonder whether the 737 in question was the same one I was on all those years ago (surely they don't keep them in service that long?), or whether 737s have a particular problem with the mechanics of pressurisation. It also made me realise that my fears (and others) on that 737 bound for Crete were well-founded.
Eileen Hunt, Abingdon, Oxfordshire

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4152806.stm#graphic

Windows 7 Pro 64bit
Intel Core 2 Duo E2180 2GHz
GA-P35-DS3L Intel P35
Kingston HyperX 4GB (2x2) DDR2 6400C4 800Mhz
GeForce 8800 GT 512MB
2 x 22" monitors
200GB Sata
Be Quiet! Straight Power 650W

Flying FSX with Saitek's pro flight range:
Radio
Switch panel
Auto-pilot
Yoke and throttle quad
Pedals

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #34 - Aug 15^th, 2005 at 1:15pm

C Offline
Colonel
Earth

Posts: 13144

Oh dear, not Joe/Joan public all becoming aviation safety experts again. She should be quite happy that they made an emergency descent - and the last thing on the pilot's mind on that flight would have been making the ride comfortable for the passengers. Obviously she never went to her infant school hypoxia lessons... Roll Eyes

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #35 - Aug 15^th, 2005 at 2:08pm

Saitek Offline
Colonel
UK

Gender:
Posts: 7555

Lol - but you are missing the point! Wink

j/k

That aside the 737 was brought out about 20 years ago I think which isn't so long ago.

Windows 7 Pro 64bit
Intel Core 2 Duo E2180 2GHz
GA-P35-DS3L Intel P35
Kingston HyperX 4GB (2x2) DDR2 6400C4 800Mhz
GeForce 8800 GT 512MB
2 x 22" monitors
200GB Sata
Be Quiet! Straight Power 650W

Flying FSX with Saitek's pro flight range:
Radio
Switch panel
Auto-pilot
Yoke and throttle quad
Pedals

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #36 - Aug 15^th, 2005 at 5:18pm

Whitey Offline
Colonel
Scotland

Gender:
Posts: 2697

I just learned that one of the footballers of the team my team (Glasgow Rangers) are playing in the Champions League Qualifiers lost his brother and sister-in-law and the children on the flight...apparently a lot of people in Cyprus know someone who's dead... Sad

...that little story brings it to earth for me anyway.

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #37 - Aug 15^th, 2005 at 5:26pm

Hagar Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159

Not sure I get the point Ben. Monarch Airlines was operating the Boeing 737-200 in 1983. http://airlines.afriqonline.com/airlines/797.htm

I don't know the registration of the one involved in this incident but according to their website Helios operate the B737-800. The first two were delivered brand-new from Boeing in May 2001. http://www.flyhelios.com/about_fleet.php

PS. 5B-DBY (previously D-ADBQ) B737-31S. Ex-Deutsche BA/Fly-DBA. Delivered new 15/01/1998.
http://www.airfleets.net/ficheapp/plane-b737-29099.htm

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #38 - Aug 16^th, 2005 at 4:18am

Ex-RoNiN Offline
Colonel

Posts: 60

Quote:

I just learned that one of the footballers of the team my team (Glasgow Rangers) are playing in the Champions League Qualifiers lost his brother and sister-in-law and the children on the flight...apparently a lot of people in Cyprus know someone who's dead... Sad

...that little story brings it to earth for me anyway.

Terrible

Unfortunately, with Cyprus being so small and such a huge accident happening its not about "did I know someone on that flight" but more like "who did I know on that flight?"

I think the lad should be given a round of applause if he turns out at Ibrox...would take a lot of courage after such a traumatising event Sad

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #39 - Aug 16^th, 2005 at 6:14am

Whitey Offline
Colonel
Scotland

Gender:
Posts: 2697

There's talk of a minute's silence before the match. I hope that happens. Cry

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #40 - Aug 16^th, 2005 at 2:40pm

Ex-RoNiN Offline
Colonel

Posts: 60

http://www.uefa.com/competitions/UCL/news/Kind=1/newsId=326740.html

In regards to Nikolaou's family members. Sad

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #41 - Aug 16^th, 2005 at 7:59pm

Ex-RoNiN Offline
Colonel

Posts: 60

Fake pictures are starting to appear Angry

http://www.dunningmarketing.com/helios_photos.htm

Apparently these were leaked by the Greek airforce, taken a few minutes before the Helios airliner went down.

Obviously, they are fake. The dead giveaway are the double emergency doors above the wing, that's a feature of a 737-800, the 737-300 (suchas the one that crashed) has single doors above the wings.

Furthermore, in the first pic you can see how the Y at the end of the registration was photoshopped, it looks totally different than the other letters.

Finally, the Helios jet was intercepted by F-16s from Crete - which are Block 52. Yet the picture shows Block 50 F-16s.

These pics are of a 737-800 that was intercepted by Greek F-16 Block 50 - it is not Sunday's flight.

Why would anyone fake such pictures? Angry

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #42 - Aug 16^th, 2005 at 8:54pm

Nexus Offline
Colonel
The greater of two evils...

Gender:
Posts: 3282

It's an -800 allright. But double emergency doors are also found on the -400.

However, those are double slotted flaps on those pics. The NG series have double slotted flaps, whereas the Classics (300/400/500) sports triple slotted. Also the pitot statics corresponds to the position of an NG.

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #43 - Aug 22^nd, 2005 at 9:48am

Saitek Offline
Colonel
UK

Gender:
Posts: 7555

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4172740.stm

More info. That is interesting - lack of fuel? Seems rather an unusual problem - hardly as if it was a really long flight.

Sad that a flight attendant tried to take over... makes our recent thread in the General forum seem rather arrogant in a way.

Windows 7 Pro 64bit
Intel Core 2 Duo E2180 2GHz
GA-P35-DS3L Intel P35
Kingston HyperX 4GB (2x2) DDR2 6400C4 800Mhz
GeForce 8800 GT 512MB
2 x 22" monitors
200GB Sata
Be Quiet! Straight Power 650W

Flying FSX with Saitek's pro flight range:
Radio
Switch panel
Auto-pilot
Yoke and throttle quad
Pedals

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #44 - Aug 22^nd, 2005 at 9:59am

Hagar Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159

Quote:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4172740.stm

More info. That is interesting - lack of fuel? Seems rather an unusual problem - hardly as if it was a really long flight.

I think this is confirmation of what most of us assumed. With everyone on board unconcious from lack of oxygen the aircraft continued flying on autopilot until the fuel ran out. A similar incident happened in the US some years ago. As usual, the media "experts" cannot get their heads round that. Roll Eyes

Quote:

Sad that a flight attendant tried to take over...

This is a new twist. I heard that one of the flight attendants was a qualified pilot. Even so, he/she would be suffering in the same way as everyone else on board. This is still only speculation. Much better to wait until the full results of the investigation are published. This might take some time.

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery

Back to top

IP Logged

	Search the archive: