Simviation Forum - The funniest cop video I ever seen

Reply #30 - Jan 20^th, 2005 at 5:20pm

Deputy Offline
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Hillsboro, Oregon

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You are correct about certain laws, however, there are many that I would consider a hinderance to the free state and to society.

You may whole heartedly disagree with me on this, but this one has a profound impact.

*** Most states require a permit to carry a concealed firearm.

I will state that Alaska used to have this law, but it was removed because it was deemed unconstitutional to our State Constitution (and is, according to the words of the 2nd amenment, unconstitutional to the U.S. Constitution). There is more, however. In Alaska, if I had a permit to carry a concealed firearm, and I got pulled over, when the Officer gets information via the license plate, it will read "Known to be armed." Now, this may seem O.K. to most people, but now the Officer is going to be/do one or more of the following:

1. A little nervous.
I don't want to be around any Officer who has a firearm and is nervous, it makes me afraid to go for my license and registration. (Happened to me already, even though I had no permit, and I did not have a firearm with me) I know this is mostly poor training, but it is also the nature of the job I guess.

2. Ask for the firearm during conversations with the Officer.
If the Officer does not trust me with my firearm, I do not trust him. If he askes me to hand my firearm to him, I will ask for his. He does not have the privilage to take my firearm unless he has reasonable cause. I will not tell him I have it unless he askes me directly.
3. Call for backup.
Even though nothing more than a tail light out, or 7 mph over the speed limit happened here, the Officer has already made the decision that you are guilty for some crime other than the one he witnessed due to the "Known to be armed" phrase on the computer. This has happend to a friend I know because there was a robbery reported a few miles away within the last 5 minutes of the incident.

I'll stop here, I could go on for hours, but I want to sleep sometime tonight.

Deputy, please let me know your views on this subject, I'm curious to hear them from an Officer's point of view.

#1. A little nervous? I'll tell you right now - we don't like reading "CWP" - (or Concealed Weapons Permit) on the MDT (Mobile Data Terminal - Basically an ultra-secure trunked radio system that allows us to communicate by both voice and text, over computers in our vehicles - Many jurisdictions only have text based MDT's as they are very expensive). A lot of times we don't get a list of warrants until well after the stop is underway - I.E. we are right next to the drivers window.

#2. Euh this one is touchy. A lot of departments, its not only a good idea, but its policy to unarm the person being questioned. By refusing to hand over you weapon, everything escalates. Yes, we're going to get backup - as this is considered an act of uncooperation. Normally, if you aren't cooperating, we would deal with you on our own - however you are armed, and, as you might be able to tell - we really don't like that. We don't like putting ourselves in any more danger than what we have to - Obviously, this is a dangerous profession as it is, adding a gun to the mix can sometimes make it not pretty. Unfourtionatly, a lot of times, we'll do a felony stop if we know you are armed - A felony stop means that we will be behind cover, guns out, and you will get out of your car, lay down on the ground, arms out to your side, and palms up. The reason we do this is not only for our safety, but also yours. Its basically done for the off chance, that for some reason, you decide to have a shooting match, we don't want any stray rounds flying around, hitting innocent civilians.

As for reasonable cause, no department will ever punish a peace officer for taking a weapon away until he or she is confident and sure the situation is safe.

3#. Read above.

Basically, what I'm saying is, don't try to argue with us - or hinder what we are trying to do. If you do, you will only make things worse for yourself. If you argue, you're almost gauranteed a ticket. If you are armed, tell the officer. Its a lot better than him or her finding out, pulling his/her gun out and having an accidental shooting. Just tell us where it is, LET US TAKE IT OFF YOU, and relax. We're not here to hurt you, we are here to keep you and everyone else safe.

Bad boys, bad boys, whatcha gonna do? Whatcha gonna do when I come for you?&&&&Iustita Omnibus&&Justice for All&&&&Women are: attractive, single, mentally stable. Pick two.&& &&Yes, we drive on the right-hand-side of the road. Yes, I parked on the left-hand-side of the road. Yes, I blocked traffic for a picture. &&&&&&

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Reply #31 - Jan 21^st, 2005 at 1:17am

the_autopilot Offline
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#1. A little nervous? I'll tell you right now - we don't like reading "CWP" - (or Concealed Weapons Permit) on the MDT (Mobile Data Terminal - Basically an ultra-secure trunked radio system that allows us to communicate by both voice and text, over computers in our vehicles - Many jurisdictions only have text based MDT's as they are very expensive). A lot of times we don't get a list of warrants until well after the stop is underway - I.E. we are right next to the drivers window.

#2. Euh this one is touchy. A lot of departments, its not only a good idea, but its policy to unarm the person being questioned. By refusing to hand over you weapon, everything escalates. Yes, we're going to get backup - as this is considered an act of uncooperation. Normally, if you aren't cooperating, we would deal with you on our own - however you are armed, and, as you might be able to tell - we really don't like that. We don't like putting ourselves in any more danger than what we have to - Obviously, this is a dangerous profession as it is, adding a gun to the mix can sometimes make it not pretty. Unfourtionatly, a lot of times, we'll do a felony stop if we know you are armed - A felony stop means that we will be behind cover, guns out, and you will get out of your car, lay down on the ground, arms out to your side, and palms up. The reason we do this is not only for our safety, but also yours. Its basically done for the off chance, that for some reason, you decide to have a shooting match, we don't want any stray rounds flying around, hitting innocent civilians.

As for reasonable cause, no department will ever punish a peace officer for taking a weapon away until he or she is confident and sure the situation is safe.

3#. Read above.

Basically, what I'm saying is, don't try to argue with us - or hinder what we are trying to do. If you do, you will only make things worse for yourself. If you argue, you're almost gauranteed a ticket. If you are armed, tell the officer. Its a lot better than him or her finding out, pulling his/her gun out and having an accidental shooting. Just tell us where it is, LET US TAKE IT OFF YOU, and relax. We're not here to hurt you, we are here to keep you and everyone else safe.

Forgive me, but I have my own opinion to add. Thats a lot of power a police officer is given. Though it is rare, officers can and do abuse this power, especially against women and minorities. The fact that they can take away your constitutional right without justification (at least none you know of) is scary. Carrying a gun does not make you a criminal. And what you now just posted scares me even more and that is: that any person carrying a gun legally fully within his or her right is automatically assumed dangerous and a suspect is highly alarming. Thats basically like saying that all african americans are dangerous or all teens are drug addicts.

I'm not accusing, but this is what I think and I'm interested in your response.

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Reply #32 - Jan 21^st, 2005 at 1:20pm

Mobius Offline
Colonel
Highest Point in the Lightning
Storm
Wisconsin

Posts: 4369

What do you need a concealed firearm for though? I mean it just seems to me that in the US you don't really need a concealed firearm. If you absolutly have to have a gun with you, why don't you carry it out in the open?

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Reply #33 - Jan 21^st, 2005 at 2:17pm

Deputy Offline
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Hillsboro, Oregon

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What do you need a concealed firearm for though? I mean it just seems to me that in the US you don't really need a concealed firearm. If you absolutly have to have a gun with you, why don't you carry it out in the open?

Thats why its scary - Why DO you need a concealed weapon? I'll admit - we don't always do things the best of ways - but we do try our best. We're only human, we're not some super-civilian. All we are - people out of the population.

Here's something else - Concealed scares me a lot more than if its in the open. A lot of times, if its in the open, I'll be more cautious, but, nothing comes of it. Concealed however, I take more steps to protect myself.

Bad boys, bad boys, whatcha gonna do? Whatcha gonna do when I come for you?&&&&Iustita Omnibus&&Justice for All&&&&Women are: attractive, single, mentally stable. Pick two.&& &&Yes, we drive on the right-hand-side of the road. Yes, I parked on the left-hand-side of the road. Yes, I blocked traffic for a picture. &&&&&&

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Reply #34 - Jan 22^nd, 2005 at 3:57am

the_autopilot Offline
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What do you need a concealed firearm for though? I mean it just seems to me that in the US you don't really need a concealed firearm. If you absolutly have to have a gun with you, why don't you carry it out in the open?

Some people have specific needs. Keep in mind you have to have a purpose when you ask for one of those. They don't just hand them out.

Personally though, I never conceal my weapons (its kinda hard to conceal an assualt rifle).

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Reply #35 - Jan 23^rd, 2005 at 8:50pm

Deputy Offline
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Hillsboro, Oregon

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Some people have specific needs. Keep in mind you have to have a purpose when you ask for one of those. They don't just hand them out.

Personally though, I never conceal my weapons (its kinda hard to conceal an assualt rifle).

Yes, there's a purpose for a CWP, however, its easier than you think to obtain one.

Bad boys, bad boys, whatcha gonna do? Whatcha gonna do when I come for you?&&&&Iustita Omnibus&&Justice for All&&&&Women are: attractive, single, mentally stable. Pick two.&& &&Yes, we drive on the right-hand-side of the road. Yes, I parked on the left-hand-side of the road. Yes, I blocked traffic for a picture. &&&&&&

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Reply #36 - Jan 25^th, 2005 at 10:51pm

beefhole Offline
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common' yigs!
Philadelphia

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Forgive me, but I have my own opinion to add. Thats a lot of power a police officer is given. Though it is rare, officers can and do abuse this power, especially against women and minorities. The fact that they can take away your constitutional right without justification (at least none you know of) is scary. Carrying a gun does not make you a criminal. And what you now just posted scares me even more and that is: that any person carrying a gun legally fully within his or her right is automatically assumed dangerous and a suspect is highly alarming. Thats basically like saying that all african americans are dangerous or all teens are drug addicts.

I'm not accusing, but this is what I think and I'm interested in your response.

Yo man, put yourself in their shoes. They don't know who the **** you are. You could be some crazy freakin psychopath that is going to snap right then and there. I don't see why people can't understand an officer's apprehension to be near a person with a concealed weapon, especially if that person happens to be the center of attention.

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Reply #37 - Jan 26^th, 2005 at 2:16am

the_autopilot Offline
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Yo man, put yourself in their shoes. They don't know who the **** you are. You could be some crazy freakin psychopath that is going to snap right then and there. I don't see why people can't understand an officer's apprehension to be near a person with a concealed weapon, especially if that person happens to be the center of attention.

Thats not a good reason to strip someone of their rights. Just because they fear you does not mean they can take away your rights.

Thats like saying lets put arabs through special heavy security checks at the airport. Fear of someone does not give the police the right to take away their rights especially considering they have no evidence to support that you are hostile (having a gun does not consititute as evidence of someone's hostility).

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Reply #38 - Jan 26^th, 2005 at 5:06am

Deputy Offline
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Hillsboro, Oregon

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Thats like saying lets put arabs through special heavy security checks at the airport.

We already do.

Quote:

Fear of someone does not give the police the right to take away their rights especially considering they have no evidence to support that you are hostile (having a gun does not consititute as evidence of someone's hostility).

But what about the "evidence" of the people who try to kill us? What about them? And those who point guns at us? Here's the little secret to law enforcement - Expect the unexpected - people who seem nice and calm one second, can INSTANTLY try to unholster our gun and shoot us right between the eyes. Oh, wait, thats just a few. Guess what, about 1/8 of the people I arrest - resist arrest in some way or another. Bet you didn't know that. I have personally had a suspect try to take my gun from me, and more than once.

You're absolutely right. But then we begin to wonder why you have a gun. Is it for protection, or the hunting of peace officers and civilians. Or do you have a gun because you just escaped a death row for triple homicides of police officers from a federal institution and you really don't want to go back? You may not think about these things, but believe me, we do. We do EVERYTHING in our power to go home to our families at night. If we consider you a risk to the community, then we will disarm you until we are sure you are not somebody placing others in risk of injury or death.

Secondly, we're not talking about carrying guns in the open (Which is what I'm trying to get at). I am MUCH more comfortable if I can see the gun on you - its if its concealed that I'm all edgy.

Edit : removed rude comment

« Last Edit: Jan 26^th, 2005 at 6:20am by Deputy »

Bad boys, bad boys, whatcha gonna do? Whatcha gonna do when I come for you?&&&&Iustita Omnibus&&Justice for All&&&&Women are: attractive, single, mentally stable. Pick two.&& &&Yes, we drive on the right-hand-side of the road. Yes, I parked on the left-hand-side of the road. Yes, I blocked traffic for a picture. &&&&&&

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Reply #39 - Jan 26^th, 2005 at 8:45am

Skligmund Offline
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Piper PA-31T3 T1040
Anchorage, Alaska

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Lets put some more information forth, which has been an influence on my decisions. I don't make uneducated decisions too often, I want to do what I feel is safest for ME.

My roomate used to work for (I wasn't gonna name it, but oh well) Anchorage Police Department (APD). I get my information from him, because he is one of the MOST reliable sources of information I have ever come across. APD was so corrupt (and still may be, he wouldn't work for them for any amount of money after what he saw) that it's own officer were running underage prostitution rings and other stuff I do not want to get into. This was proven, but because of the fact it was APD, officers would 'retire' and the media said nothing of the incidents. Basicly the ordinary average citezen does not know these facts.

In respect to that, I don;t want to be caught unarmed in any situation, ESPECIALLY with a peace officer. No disrespect on you specificly or anything, but my trust in the police force has dropped more and more as I see what really happens. I have been pulled over for a tail light out. During this encounter, I was genuinly afraid of the officer at my door. I was not armed, and at the time owned no handguns, yet his hand on his sidearm along with his OBVIOUS nervousness was really scaring me. I was afraid to go for my registration and drivers license in the fear he would think I was going to shoot him or soemthing! This is bad training, but it is was still the situation. Poorly trained officers WILL be on duty weather anybody thinks it or not. No, I wouldn't FEEL any safer if I had a firearm with me, but if I told this guy I was armed, I think he might have snapped. In this situation, I would not tell him I was armed, hoped he got the information he wanted and left (I got no ticket, I has a loose wire which I fixed after he left. He wouldn't let me out of my vehicle until he left).

Concealed arms. Why to have:

If I have my Ruger Bisley 45LC hanging off a belt in plain view, interaction from other people will be different as if I had a 1911 in my vest concealed. This is to keep the normal people of this country to feel secure about themselves, and not see people walking around with guns all the time. I'd say 80 percent of the people I know carry concealed firearms, but nobody walking downtown knows this, and life is good.

It is 4:45 AM, and I can't think of where I was going with this, I'll be back later to finfish. Time for bed.

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Reply #40 - Jan 26^th, 2005 at 10:35pm

the_autopilot Offline
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Secondly, we're not talking about carrying guns in the open (Which is what I'm trying to get at). I am MUCH more comfortable if I can see the gun on you - its if its concealed that I'm all edgy.

Edit : removed rude comment

Ok, I understand your point of view. Nobody wants their family to get called and told that some loved one won't make it home. I'm not trying to accuse you of antyhing. I highly respect officers as the amount of crap you guys have to deal with is simply amzaing.

Quote:

If we consider you a risk to the community, then we will disarm you until we are sure you are not somebody placing others in risk of injury or death.

I definitely agree. If a person is a risk to others, then he/she should be disarmed. My problems is with how you assess risk. Having a gun doesn't mean you will go shooting random people/officers. Unless he is pointing it at you or threatening to use it, you cannot assume it is a threat. And like you said, you don't know why the guy has a gun. Therefore, you just randomly strip people of their rights.

Also, a quick question, why are you more nerverous if the gun is hidden. A gun is still a gun and still can be fired whether or not it can be seen.

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Reply #41 - Jan 27^th, 2005 at 4:05am

Deputy Offline
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Hillsboro, Oregon

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Ok, I understand your point of view. Nobody wants their family to get called and told that some loved one won't make it home. I'm not trying to accuse you of antyhing. I highly respect officers as the amount of crap you guys have to deal with is simply amzaing.

I definitely agree. If a person is a risk to others, then he/she should be disarmed. My problems is with how you assess risk. Having a gun doesn't mean you will go shooting random people/officers. Unless he is pointing it at you or threatening to use it, you cannot assume it is a threat. And like you said, you don't know why the guy has a gun. Therefore, you just randomly strip people of their rights.

Also, a quick question, why are you more nerverous if the gun is hidden. A gun is still a gun and still can be fired whether or not it can be seen.

Ahhh, this is not a hopeless runaway thread afterall...

Its not randomly stripping rights - Its maintaining safety of the community. I'll say this yet again, I will take your gun away if I feel threatened or I feel the community is threatened by you in any way - if you're answers don't quite make sense or match those of somebody else, if your fidgety, if you appear nervous, if you lie, if you say something that sounds threatening, if you match the description of somebody that is wanted, if you are suspicious to begin with, if you are intoxicated, if you appear out of place, if you are known to be dangerous, this list could easily go on and on. These are just a few of the many, many, many things we look for each and every time we talk to anyone.

As for your question - if we know you are armed, and we can see the gun, we are much more comfortable because we know where the gun is - Basically, if we see you quickly reaching for your gun, we know what you're about to do.... Whereas, if you quickly reach for your wallet in your sports jacket, we're gonna be a little nervous. Either way, we are still nervous about the entire situation - whether we can see a gun or not.

Bad boys, bad boys, whatcha gonna do? Whatcha gonna do when I come for you?&&&&Iustita Omnibus&&Justice for All&&&&Women are: attractive, single, mentally stable. Pick two.&& &&Yes, we drive on the right-hand-side of the road. Yes, I parked on the left-hand-side of the road. Yes, I blocked traffic for a picture. &&&&&&

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Reply #42 - Jan 28^th, 2005 at 1:36pm

Homer Simpson Ex Member
Forza Lazio!!

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If you think this is funny.......... Its not. Its actually pretty sad.

17,419 persons were killed in alcohol-related crashes in 2002, 15,019 of which involved a driver or non-occupant with blood alcohol content of 0.08 or greater.

Forty-one percent of fatal crashes involved alcohol. For fatal crashes occurring from midnight to 3 a.m., 76 percent involved alcohol.

In 2001, more than half a million people were injured in crashes where police reported that alcohol was present — an average of one person injured approximately every 2 minutes.

Alcohol is closely linked with violence. About 40 percent of all crimes (violent and non-violent) are committed under the influence of alcohol.

Drunk driving is the nation’s most frequently committed violent crime, killing someone every 20 minutes.

Motor vehicle crashes are the leading cause of death for people from 2 to 33 years old.

Approximately 1.5 million drivers were arrested in 2002 for driving under the influence of alcohol or narcotics. This is an arrest rate of 1 for every 130 licensed drivers in the United States

These statistics are hopefully eye-opening. I hope that none of you will ever drink and drive.

Oh My God Man that is so scary. If thats the result of Drinking and Driving, it would be alot worse if it was Drinking and Flying Undecided

&&SS Lazio Website

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Reply #43 - Jan 29^th, 2005 at 5:09pm

Squeek Offline
Colonel
Legacy the poor mans Learjet
United States of America

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that is funny

A poet, A virtual Pilot, and a member of Civil Air Patrol. Now if only.....&&&&Current ride, a 1972 Honda CT70 with a 3-speed transmition w/ and automatic clutch. So far i've gotten it to do 40mph.

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