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My latest experiment (Read 1170 times)
Jul 12th, 2004 at 7:45pm

congo   Offline
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I just found I could overclock my FSB quite a lot with my shiny new XP2800+ CPU by reducing my RAM timings. The CPU temperature seems no different at the overclock which is a good thing!

RAM timings are set to 7-3-3-2.5(cas) on my budget Kingston RAM, FSB is 364mhz DDR.

I'm trying to see how far I can stretch my new GF FX 5900XT in the frame rate war. It's getting better, but I suspect I'm getting very close to the limit.

...
 

...Mainboard: Asus P5K-Premium, CPU=Intel E6850 @ x8x450fsb 3.6ghz, RAM: 4gb PC8500 Team Dark, Video: NV8800GT, HDD: 2x1Tb Samsung F3 RAID-0 + 1Tb F3, PSU: Antec 550 Basiq, OS: Win7x64, Display: 24" WS LCD
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Reply #1 - Jul 13th, 2004 at 5:00am

Gixer   Offline
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Hehehe, cool  Grin  If you were planning on o-clocking you shoulda got the XP2500mobile.  I am very temted to do this they o-clock to silly speeds with little rise in temp due to the lower voltage required.  Nice o-clock though and a good gain in your scores.  I should put my back to stock and see how much a difference it makes with my raised FSB and tighter timings.

Maybe i should get rivatuner and have a bash at o-clocking my old GF4 ti4600 but i dont wanna blow it up b4 my new card arrives.
 

AMD64 3500+ @ 2200MHz 400FSB&&MSI K8N Neo 2 mobo nForce3 chipset&&1gig Corsair XMS PC3200 timings @ 10.2.2.2 &&XFX 6800 Ultra @ 450/1200&&80gig HDD&&Loadsa fans!!!
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Reply #2 - Jul 13th, 2004 at 5:02am

Gixer   Offline
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Just noticed you raised your AGP bus.  Was this set at 66MHz default?  Does it produce and unstabilities when u alter it?  Im guessing that is o-clocking your g/card a bit.
 

AMD64 3500+ @ 2200MHz 400FSB&&MSI K8N Neo 2 mobo nForce3 chipset&&1gig Corsair XMS PC3200 timings @ 10.2.2.2 &&XFX 6800 Ultra @ 450/1200&&80gig HDD&&Loadsa fans!!!
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Reply #3 - Jul 13th, 2004 at 7:30am

congo   Offline
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Make BIOS your Friend
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I don't really know what effect raising the AGP bus has on the Video Card clocks, only that Aida32 doesn't show it at all, it simply stays the same according to Aida's sensors. I edged it up very slowly in small increments to over 80 in the end with no instability, and only a small performance gain.
The info I read about it was outdated, so I got anxious and went for it.  Smiley

Oh! Now you tell me about the Mobile CPU's!

I was beginning to suspect this was why my favorite supplier started stocking them!

I only just found out my CPU multiplier is locked @ 12.5x the other day, and today found out that this condition is permanent.

------------

The CPU I bought is a Thorton core .... ie. a newer Athlon XP 2800+ "Barton" with the locked multiplier, I believe it is a week42, 2003 production model, but my data is not 100% accurate, and I'm not going to pull the heatsink off to get the ID. (I did this on my last cpu and it never ran as cool again!) I didn't bother to write down the ID as I had no idea they were locked at all when I installed it. The last unlocked Barton Desktop CPU's were made in week41 of 2003 according to my sources.

Ok, I could use some help now. Obviously I need to overclock the FSB. My current BIOS allows 1mhz increments on the FSB, but auto clocks the RAM. (not the RAM timings though, unless I allow it.)

Now, the RAM clocks along fine, the same as the FSB speed until it hits 183mhz, (hence my 364mhz DDR bus speed above) when a curious thing happens. The Ram clocks back to a percentage of it's original PC2700 rating or 166mhz bus speed.

In other words, if I set my FSB to 200mhz, my ram then clocks back at 166mhz and I can tighten up the timings again.
If I set the FSB to 190mhz, the RAM clocks back to 154mhz.

Is this controlled by my BIOS or is it the SPD module on my ram chip? Mind you, I was very surprised I could get my budget Kingston Ram up to 182mhz (364mhz DDR!) before it retro clocked on me!

I have some PC3200 RAM to play with out of the P4 in the other room, so that will be the next experiment I guess.

But, I digress.  I hit a wall as I closely approach 400mhz FSB speed, It appears as if WinXP doesn't like it and I only got the op sys up once at 400mhz. (I then ran SiSoftSandra's CPU benchmark and it gave me a "P" rating of 3500+  Grin ). Also, as with the RAM, above 182mhz FSB speed, my BIOS doesn't identify my CPU as an "XPxxxx+" anymore, but simply states Athlon and the clock speed (2.5ghz at 200mhz).

I didn't see any significant CPU heat rise in either BIOS monitoring or Software monitoring in windows, Even while playing FS9. Nor is there any instability as long as my RAM timings are no tighter than 6-3-3-2.5(cas). I tried that timing and 7-3-3-2.5 in benchmarks and saw little or no difference in performance.

Just out of interest, At a stable 364mhz FSB speed, My CPU passes math and multimedia benchmarks well in excess of XP 3200+ levels, However, My overall memory bandwidth is very close to the XP3200+ mark.

I had to buy a CPU for my daughter, it was going to be a Barton XP 2500+, but I gave her my XP 2600+ and bought this 2800 for myself, It has exactly the same standard clocking as my old 2600+, but not as much heat or noise. I was hoping the extra L2 cache would improve FS9, and I secretly thought about the overclocking possibilities. I think I might like it.

I wonder how long before I actually blow something up......  Hope to be back soon   8) (those are safety goggles!)

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I made a new case out of some Acrylic scraps in the garage.

...

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...Mainboard: Asus P5K-Premium, CPU=Intel E6850 @ x8x450fsb 3.6ghz, RAM: 4gb PC8500 Team Dark, Video: NV8800GT, HDD: 2x1Tb Samsung F3 RAID-0 + 1Tb F3, PSU: Antec 550 Basiq, OS: Win7x64, Display: 24" WS LCD
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Reply #4 - Jul 13th, 2004 at 2:24pm

Gixer   Offline
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I dont think your going to blow anything up unless you start increasing voltages drastically.  Be warey of altering the AGP clock thing, the site I use to get my o-clock questions answered, most people say leave it at 66MHz and clock your card seperately.

My multiplyer only goes up to 12.5 too but you dont need any more.  12.5*200 = 2500MHz and I doubt you will get near that without some serious cooling (Water) and playing with the voltages a lot.

I dont like the way your ram is not running the same fsb as your CPU.  There will be a CPU/Ram ratio in BIOS somewhere ensure this is set to 1:1   Of course you will probably find you cant hold tight timings but nForce2 boards work better with the cpu and ram at the same FSB. 

On your ram timings try setting the Tras to 11   i.e. 11-3-3-2.5  Apparently (And i am only going by what I have read here) the nForce 2 like this  ???   I did bench better though with it set at 5.

The good thing you should be able to do with your PC3200 ram is set the timings the same as mine 5-2-2-2. Thats the main reason I brought good quality PC3200 stuff to get tight timings. 

200*11 is XP3200 speed which gives 2200MHz.  My cpu is at 2255MHz though my fsb is 360, but due to the tight ram timings I score the same as if I clock the CPU to XP3200 speeds and slacken the timings off, only thing is its more stable how I currently have it setup.  I was getting a few random crashes with it set as an XP3200.  I did alter voltages but though it be best to just revert to my old settings.

I will set my PC back to standard and run the bench test then clock it and see what my difference is.  Now do I go for o-clocking the GF4 ti4600??  The 4200 was a good clocker but no so sure about the 4600.
 

AMD64 3500+ @ 2200MHz 400FSB&&MSI K8N Neo 2 mobo nForce3 chipset&&1gig Corsair XMS PC3200 timings @ 10.2.2.2 &&XFX 6800 Ultra @ 450/1200&&80gig HDD&&Loadsa fans!!!
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Reply #5 - Jul 13th, 2004 at 5:27pm

Gixer   Offline
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Lets go fly a kite!!

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Had a go with Rivatuner but I dont think my g/card clocks well so set it back to normal.

I dont gain as much as you have from normal to o-clock system but maybe its down to my g/card???

Unclocked = 11940
O-clocked = 12732

Just wish I could hit 13000 as I am not that far away, just dont think its possible with my current components.
 

AMD64 3500+ @ 2200MHz 400FSB&&MSI K8N Neo 2 mobo nForce3 chipset&&1gig Corsair XMS PC3200 timings @ 10.2.2.2 &&XFX 6800 Ultra @ 450/1200&&80gig HDD&&Loadsa fans!!!
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Reply #6 - Jul 15th, 2004 at 10:40am

congo   Offline
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I finally got the proper versions of 3dmark, The latest builds of 3DMark2001se and 3DMark'03.

After some final tweaks, My rig scored 16339 in '01se and 6094 in '03.

I put the AGP bus back to 66mhz for the tests and that's where it will stay, as it doesn't seem to do anything to help performance.

The RAM Timings in the 2003 test below were actually 6-3-3-2.5

...

...

Everything is running smooth now after a huge effort trying to Flash the video cards BIOS with anything and everything trying to get it to work better.
I ended up using the one it came with and stuck with the supplied o/clock util as it seems as good as anything else I've tried.

Trying to flash the card into an "ultra" was a complete waste of time, I tried around 10 bios files from many recommended cards, only two other "XT" bioses would run, and the card didn't respond well to them. None of the "ultra" bios files worked, I even thought I lost my card on a couple of them. I don't know how the other people are doing this, I used 3 compatible flash utilities in my efforts....... and if I hadn't tried NVFLASH. I would not have gotten my card to work again as I lost the EEPROM using WWFLASH, the leadtek util !!!! 

The Default Leadtek Flash utility runs from windows, but it was having a hard time even with the supplied BIOS. NVFLASH said the supplied BIOS had a bad checksum error, but it still flashed it when I overode the protection with 3 switches.

Well, I had to try it  Grin
 

...Mainboard: Asus P5K-Premium, CPU=Intel E6850 @ x8x450fsb 3.6ghz, RAM: 4gb PC8500 Team Dark, Video: NV8800GT, HDD: 2x1Tb Samsung F3 RAID-0 + 1Tb F3, PSU: Antec 550 Basiq, OS: Win7x64, Display: 24" WS LCD
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Reply #7 - Jul 15th, 2004 at 11:29am

Gixer   Offline
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Still you got nice scores  Grin  after reading what you were doing and knowing that i got a 6800Ultra on order I thought I would try o-clock my g/card. 

Was risky as my card tends to run a smidge hot anyhow and like you I thought I had lost it  Embarrassed  Screen went crazy colours with lines shooting around everywhere looked quite pretty. My g/friend was like oh oh what u done  Cry

I did a reset and its was still like it, I was a little worried then but didn't let on to her and just calmly pushed the power button and said 'ah its just needs to cool down'  Left it 2mins turned it back on and it was workin, wuickly set it back to default clock speeds b4 it went crazy on me again hehehe.

Still its all good fun  Grin  If you can get better performance for free then its gotta be done  Grin

Cant wait till my new g/card arrives, wonder what my scores will be hehehe, 3dMark01 20000? I know 3dMark03 should be 12500-13000  Grin

FS9 with everything maxed out totally 1600x1200 4xAA and 16xAF 30fps no lower here I come, well least I hope  Grin
 

AMD64 3500+ @ 2200MHz 400FSB&&MSI K8N Neo 2 mobo nForce3 chipset&&1gig Corsair XMS PC3200 timings @ 10.2.2.2 &&XFX 6800 Ultra @ 450/1200&&80gig HDD&&Loadsa fans!!!
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Reply #8 - Jul 16th, 2004 at 4:33am

congo   Offline
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HeHe, you scared someone!  Grin

So, what you gonna do with the old card? Keep it for a spare?

I look forward to seeing what your new one performs like. Wow, a recent graphics card, you are moving up the ladder Gixer!  8)

I bet it will run FS9, er...  I take that back...  Tongue
 

...Mainboard: Asus P5K-Premium, CPU=Intel E6850 @ x8x450fsb 3.6ghz, RAM: 4gb PC8500 Team Dark, Video: NV8800GT, HDD: 2x1Tb Samsung F3 RAID-0 + 1Tb F3, PSU: Antec 550 Basiq, OS: Win7x64, Display: 24" WS LCD
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Reply #9 - Jul 16th, 2004 at 4:56am

Gixer   Offline
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Yes Congo will keep the ti4600 as a spare.  Its been a good card and still holds its own just.  But as the 6800Ultras are so new, and there have been a few probs with some of them, it would be silly to get shot of it.

It will probably end up in my g/friends pc as she has a GF3 ti200 64ddr in there at the moment.  The GF3 will be back up for either PC.  But I wont put the GF4 in hers until I am sure my 6800 is ok  Wink
 

AMD64 3500+ @ 2200MHz 400FSB&&MSI K8N Neo 2 mobo nForce3 chipset&&1gig Corsair XMS PC3200 timings @ 10.2.2.2 &&XFX 6800 Ultra @ 450/1200&&80gig HDD&&Loadsa fans!!!
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Reply #10 - Jul 22nd, 2004 at 6:18pm

4_Series_Scania   Offline
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Quote:
 But I wont put the GF4 in hers until I am sure my 6800 is ok  Wink



I'm getting perverse thoughts......  Grin


Great scores, alas, all this benchmarkin means we ain't flying.

Paul.
 

Posting drivel here since Jan 31st, 2002. - That long!
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