what airplanes will USA use in its war agains Iraq?
what bases is it gonna use?

I thought the Saudis' weren't going to let western aircraft land at their bases ??? And then theres the 6 carrier groups 5 USN and 1 RN.

[concience mode on].... & all for one man. An oppressor & dictator who has killed over 1 million of his own, already oppressed, people & who will - if the going gets tough, be off in one of his multitude of private jets. He is a multi billionaire with secret  properties & big time connections worldwide - including the US.
One thing that worries me is all this showing off of hardware........

The people of Iraq want him out. Why *bomb* the already oppressed citizens of Iraq?
B52's? Let's get real here!

I've never heard anyone defend Sadam. But please! Let's get real. This is an evil dictatorship of the worst kind. But .... The people of Iraq hate Sadam. The majority of them want him gone too!!
To want to bomb them is cretinous or downright racist in the most primative, brain dead, form.

We all know Sadam will be gone. Let's just hope it can be done without killing ordinary decent people like you & I. [concience mode off]

OK guys ... play away .... it's only a game

Blade

     Dont forget the B1Bs of the 28th Bomb Wing

I am not a hippy or anything but I disagree with the war. Saddam is an awful leader true but he has total control of his people becuase he opresses them with his secret police. I just believe that we should wait a get a clearer goal with better evidence. We will have soldiers that don't have any clear goal or really know who the're fighting. This could turn into another vietnam.  I for one am ashamed of my country for getting into this ridiculous situation. If it was really about saddam just send in some SAS or assasins. Its all about bloody oil. Yes saddam needs to be taken down but not the rest of his country. Its the point Francis Coppola was trying to make with his film "Apocolypse Now". We have a person who we thought that we had control of but the moment we feel we lose that control we go ballistic and will do anything to get him.

I am just ashamed of my government.

People get real. Saddam needs to be removed. He should have been removed in 1991 when we had the chance to. But did we? No. If saddam isn't a theat at the moment then he will be in the future. As our rediculos prime minister said "If I told you in August 2001 that there was a terrorist network called Al queda that is a potential threat that must be removed. You would all have disagreed then as you are doing now." The fact is that saddam needs to be removed. He rules a dictatorship and kills his own people. Gasses any who oppose him and uses civillians to protect his industries by forcing them to live there.

Please. If he isn't disposed of now then he will be in a few years after many many civillians have been killed.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for removing Sadam. But why do you need a few hundred fighters, 5 aircraft carriers and 120,000+ infantry to kill one man, if one sniper and one bullet can do the job?

This is a tricky one that seems to have polarised public opinion opinion here in the UK.  I am firmly on the fence.  The child in me that remembers round 1 back in '91 can't wait to see the patriots starting to fly - the best firework show I ever saw was footage from Bagdad when we hit it with some cruise missiles.

The adult in me who has accident and emergency experience as a registered nurse deplores the possibility of war and the pain and suffering that events like the "firework" show I mention above will cause.

Dictatorships like Hussains (I am not on 1st name terms with him) are evil and need to be stopped.  But the reasons seem to be more revenge based than anything else.  I cannot perceive that Iraq is a danger to anyone but Iraq.  The "Links" with Bin-Laden are a joke.  Time will tell as to whether these links are real, but as it is the victor who writes the history books I am sure we will see plenty of evidence in the next three months.

Will ???

Its true what craig says. Germany wasn't going to do anything after WWII. There country had been completely destroyed. We stayed there to help rebuild there economy and to prevent the ruskies from invading. Thats why just about all of the allied forces left europe for there own respective countries in 1990.

All we were saying is that we didn't stay in germany after the war to keep dictators from taking over.

We will have to keep men in Iraq after the up and comming war but it is somthing that has to be done. If it dosn't happen now then it will in 2/5/10 years so lets get it over with. You president seems to have his mind set to war so I doubt whether a few discontent flight sim enthusiasts are going to change his mind.

  Just to get back to what this thread was about:  Aircraft that would be used if there was a war..........

  During the Gulf War, in 1991, there was much buzz about prototype stealth aircraft such as the "Aurora" and "Black Manta" being used for reconnaissance and target designation, yet during the Afgan War I haven't heard anything about these aircraft.
  If these aircraft do exist, certainly after ten years more progress has proceeded on them.  It'll be intersting to see if rumors of "super" or "unclassified" aircraft begin to spread.

"leaving a political void" has been done before (WW1 Germany, Iraq after the first gulf war, and Argentina after the falklands) yet politicians never learn so regardless of what is said beforehand, they will make a mess of it and the Iraqi people may still harbour a hatred for westerners.

As for Australia, our Air Force contribution has been one Sqdn of FA-18's and one in-air refueler. It's not much but we don't have much. But they are already there.

Our Prime Minister is having a bad time in respect of his "supposed" blind following of the U.S. But I think a majority of Australians agree with the action that is being prepared for.

Sixty odd years ago, how could anyone have thought then, that the "Never Again" or "The price of Freedom is Eternal Vigilance" slogans and warnings would actually turn out to be necessary. And then, AGAIN, not be heeded. I feel silly to be a member of the human race.
All this man needs is one chemical, biological or nuclear weapon and he can cause the deaths of tens, maybe even hundreds of thousands of people, any where he or his terrorist mates want in the world. And don't think for a moment he won't do it.

The United Nations, after 12 years of sanctions, resolutions and threats has acheived absolutely nothing but the suffering of the innocent Iraqi citizens by allowing Hussein to deny them the necessities, while he uses his "oil credits" to further arms development and stockpiling. The inspectors know they're there, so does the UN and so do we.

The UN has proven to be as effective as the League of Nations was. And every world leader except US, Britain and Australia have turned out to be a bunch of Nevil Chamberlains, Petains and Dukes of Windsor. How foolish to allow it to happen again. How utterly soul destroying.

The only question we will need to ask, if the US and it's allies don't move soon is "How long and how many millions..............this time).

It's not about oil. When the UN (not US) forces kicked him out of Kuwait, they didn't take over the oil. They kindly put out the fires and gave control of everything back to the Kuwaitis.
That also brings up another subject. The total and utter destruction of an ecological system and area of the world which no generation alive now, will ever see in it's original state.
The joke is that the people who protest against this proposed military action are the same ones who protest about any kind of ecological irresposibility.

I don't know. Sometimes the people of the world really dishearten me.  ???

 I'm Tired of Georges' Sabre rattling, it's time for him to put up or shut up. If bush doesn't debate Saddam he'll
look like a coward, and the rest of the U.S with him.
Unfortunately in war The innocent die too.  I don't want
war, any more than the rest of you. If bush can go in and do the job he stands to get  re-elected. if not
he'll face the same thing his father did. The terrorists
want us fighting each other that's what they're hoping for. a distraction so they can come right in. NOT ALL OF
AMERICA LIKES BUSH!

                                             


                                                         

Quote:


I don't think debating would have saved any of the jews who were murdured during the holocaust. I doubt debating with Hitler would have stopped him from taking over Europe. Remember when Japan tried to "talk things through"? It turned out they were just stalling for time to attack Pearl Harbour.

And I bet Hussein is elated that there are millions of people around the globe protesting for him!

Well, the UN inspectors found some banned missles that saddam claimed he didn't have. If he lied about not having those, i'm sure would like about other banned weapons.

What needs to be done, will be done, no matter how much foot-stomping and whining goes on.  The best-case scenario would have Iraq stalling right up the onset of war, and then falling over itself surrendering,, making "goofy" George look like a genius and France and Germany saying, "Oops, just kidding,,we were with-ya all along"    .

Anyway...noone mentioned A-10's  ???   Have they been grounded when I wasn't looking ?

Very true Pete, free speech is a must for democracy but we must bare in mind what is appropriate to say. I'm sure you all heard the remarks made by Canadian MPs lately. Americans please keep in mind that these opinions do not reflect that of the vast majority of Canadians. Wanted to clear that up before CNN begins to pick us apart again. 
Of course political talk does not break people apart as long as it remains civilized. I'm right wing but have left wing friends, of course I rarely ever talk about politics with them anyway. Just my two cents worth.

Back on topic, the US will use it's standard group of carrier based planes as well as stealth from ground bases in Turkey and Saudi Arabia. Britiain will deploy the standard Tornados and Harriers and Canada will use the CF-18 while covering for the Americans in the Afghani theater. There was actually a news article on where bases will be located and what planes will be used in the Toronto Sunday Sun a while back. They don't keep back issues on the Net but there might be similar articles in other papers, try the library. Also there's an excellent book our from the Smithsonian called "Flight, 100 Years of Aviation" by RG Grant. Has detailed info on many modern military aircraft including the F117 and the B2 Spirit. Definately worth borrowing.  8)   

I agree with Pete.  If you want to talk politics there are plenty of other forums available.

If you want to talk about theoretical wars get a copy of Tom Clancy's AirCav and win Vietnam in 2 weeks (maybe 4, it's been a while since I read it.)

Iraq must be a great country. From what I can see on TV everyone seemed to be fanatically agreeable with what their president wants and does Everyone said they love their president  and I have not seen any dissenters. I even saw many kiss his hand and embraced him wherever he went. They all demonstrated in his support vowing they are willing to die for him. Now that's true patriotism and loyalty. Unlike here in the United States whereby we sometimes call our politicians, including our president , bunch of jerks. Whereby we go out in mass and demonstrate if we disagree with  what our government is doing. Whereby people in the streets bad mouth our leaders for their misdeeds. Whereby our editorials criticize our government officials and our comedians cut down our leaders with their corny jokes. Is'nt the United States a terrible country? But I think I'd rather stay here and  earn my freedom.

Zero Bubble

That's the biggest problem with this whole issue (and others).
The media is controlled so tightly and the press are so threatened and continually under scrutiny that the only things the "free" nations see is what Hussein wants them to.
I have seen interviews from former Iraqi soldiers, citizens and politicians, both male and female, that have escaped one kind of punishment or another, and they all sing the same tune.
"Life is terrible for the average family, there are shortages of almost everything and the systems and institutions are at breaking point. Everyone knows Hussein is responsible and blames him (silently). "

I will go so far as to make a prediction.

If the Coalition forces do attack and are not hindered in entering Iraq to physically oust Hussein, the people, by and large, will welcome them as liberators. Not out of fear or two-facedness but out of true releif. 

Will we be using F-15's?  I'd really like to dust off my old Jane's F-15, which wasn't released until long after Gulf War Part 1 was over.

And if Mr. Bush uses, as he calls them, "nucular" weapons I still have the Silver Bullet addon.

??? ??? ??? ??? ???

We've heard day in and day out about people demonstrating against the US and Britain for planning to wage war against Iraq. Has anyone heard of Asian countries such as Korea, Japan, China, Taiwan, Singapore, Thailand, Vietnam, and others openly demonstrating also. Has anyone also heard of South American countries from Panama all the way down to Brazil and Chile openly demonstrating against the war with Iraq? Seems to me like it's only the French and the Germans plus some factions in the US. Not even Russia have open demonstration. I wonder why.

Zero Bubble

Quote:


very true, I come here to escape reality

      I recently decided to stay off the political fence here at the forums, but I need to express something to our freinds and neighbors accross the way who most likely only see what "The Media" sells them. America is behind our President and the Men and Women fighting for all of us at this very moment.
    If anyone in our domestic antiwar movement offered me a convincing alternative to a war to eliminate Saddam Hussein, I would be the first in line to sign up. But the protestors do not offer serious solutions to the threat of weapons of mass destruction or the agony of the Iraqi people. They merley shout well-intentioned slogans, bond briefly, pat themselves on the back, and go home to their insulated lives.
    If platitudes could change the world for the better, I would be out there myself, marching in favor of universal disarmament. I credit the anti-war movement within the United States with sincere emotion. But it is utterly lacking in intellectual integrity. An earnest, if vague, sense that war is bad may inspire the undergraduates of America, but it does not prevent massacres, depose tyrants or deter terrorists.
Consider the greatest lie that adorns those painted posters, as our fellow citizens march in the streets chanting: "War doesn't solve anything."
    On the contrary, war solves a great deal. Not always for the better, that I grant. But fortunatley, the good guys HAVE WON more often than not, for the past few hundred years. Do the protestors believe that our Civil War, which ended the institution of slavery in our country, failed to solve anything? Would we be better off had blacks remained in bondage on our soil? It was civil society, after the war, that failed african Americans.The SOLDIERS did their part and changed history all for the better!
    As a man with some remaining shreds of conscience, I wish the protesters were correct, that war was pointless and useless, and that we could abolish it. But humankind is not made so. It is easy for actors and actresses like Susan Sarandon or Sean Penn to look through their rose-colored sunglasses and say "No War". Singing songs, however lovely the voices, will not soften the killer's heart. If you leave these shores, where you can duck into a cozy Starbucks after an hour or two of protest marching and celebrate with a latte, the world rapidly takes on a different coloration. How would the protestors feel if they had to live under Saddam's regime for even a few months? Without a decaf or mocha latte in sight?
    I would feel much more sympathetic to the anti-war movement if they would offer me rigorous answers to a few straight foward questions:

    1. Do you honestly believe, after 12 years of failure, that U.N. Inspections can disarm Saddam Hussein? If your reply is "Yes", or if you refuse to believe the evidence that Saddam posseses weapons of mass destruction, wants more of them, and intends to use them, proceed to question #2.
    2. Should we simply turn our backs on the Iraqi people and allow Saddam to continue to torment and murder them? Should we, thereafter, allow one of his homocidal sons to succeed him? Don't the people of Iraq, who have been gassed, tortured, raped, shot and starved (while Saddam builds dozens of vast palaces for himself), deserve liberation? Or is freedom only for educated people and Hollywood activists?
    3. What would YOU do, in practical terms, to prevent the spread of weapons of mass destruction and their eventual use by terrorists against us?. NO generalities, please  -  specified answers are required.
    Until our anti-war activists, with their presumed monopoly on virtue, can answer those questions, I shall remain unconvinced that they know whereof they shout. It is not enough to oppose, if you cannot offer convincing alternatives. Progress and security demand a sense of responsibility. It is always satisfying to complain, but far harder to forge solutions. It is, above all, the dishonesty and the moral might of the anti-war movement that disappoints me.
    I wish the activists had better solutions  -  genuine alternatives to war. I wish they would engage the rest of us in intellectually. But behind the fashionable poses and quaint campus anger, the closed minds and indestructible prejudices of the anti-war movement are cause for dismay. How can we speak with those who are always shouting?
    I speak for the majority of Americans, we are behind our troops and the troops of the free world in this fight against terror. Now is the time to stand up against evil and show support for the good people, the everyday people, OUR People who are out there, on the front lines for all of us, so you don't have to worry about relaxing at Starbucks and being blown up while you sit there and drink your Double Dipped Mocha Decaf Latte!


I Just wanted to let the world know we are behind Our President, Our Free Country and Our Soldiers who are about to Change the World for the good of all man-kind.

In the words of George Bush, " We are a peaceful nation,..... but angry when stirred "


     

Well said, Fly2E. As much as everyone hates war, it is sometimes necessary for good to triumph over evil nomatter the costs