Simviation Forum - Carbon Fiber tips

Jan 26^th, 2013 at 8:53pm

wahubna Offline
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So recently I got this crazy idea...why not apply to Scaled Composites?

So far after talking with a guy there things are looking good, albeit they want me to try my hand at doing carbon fiber stuff (obviously).

Any tips on working with carbon fiber in particular aircraft related items?

I am going to be designing and building a high-endurance UAV with probably at least 8ft wing span. I am thinking of doing a lot of CF prototyping.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated!
Even suggested books or other materials to get would be helpful.

‎"At that time [1909] the chief engineer was almost always the chief test pilot as well. That had the fortunate result of eliminating poor engineering early in aviation."- Igor Sikorsky

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Reply #1 - Jan 27^th, 2013 at 2:16am

expat Offline
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wahubna wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 8:53pm:

Any tips on working with carbon fiber in particular aircraft related items?.

Yes, I have a tip....................safety, safety, safety, safety and SAFETY. Carbon fibre is not to be taken lightly, it is dangerous to the health.....very dangerous. If you get a splinter, it is not like a wood splinter that the body over time will push out, carbon fibre will worm it's way in. If you look at it under a microscope, it is has the appearance of a fir tree. Each branch is like a tiny hook. Once it is your skin, it is hard and painful to remove. If you do get a splinter and can't get it out and go to a doctor, and he says, don't worry, it will come out by itself, seek a second opinion until you find a doctor who knows about this sort of stuff. Then you have the dust from drilling and sanding. The dust is also in the same shape if you put it under a microscope. If you breath it in, it will NEVER come out. It will imbed into your lung tissue and there it will stay.

You need to take carbon fibre very seriously. It is great stuff, but can be quite a danger to your health. The correct filters to masks that are for carbon fibre is a must as are protective gloves too. As for the chemicals that are required for the resin, well you can read a label.

Lastly anyone who tells you that it is safe, no worries, the dust is fine, trust me I have been doing this for ages etc, etc.....run away from them......quickly!!

Matt

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Reply #2 - Jan 27^th, 2013 at 9:39am

wahubna Offline
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expat wrote on Jan 27^th, 2013 at 2:16am:

wahubna wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 8:53pm:

Any tips on working with carbon fiber in particular aircraft related items?.

Yes, I have a tip....................safety, safety, safety, safety and SAFETY. Carbon fibre is not to be taken lightly, it is dangerous to the health.....very dangerous. If you get a splinter, it is not like a wood splinter that the body over time will push out, carbon fibre will worm it's way in. If you look at it under a microscope, it is has the appearance of a fir tree. Each branch is like a tiny hook. Once it is your skin, it is hard and painful to remove. If you do get a splinter and can't get it out and go to a doctor, and he says, don't worry, it will come out by itself, seek a second opinion until you find a doctor who knows about this sort of stuff. Then you have the dust from drilling and sanding. The dust is also in the same shape if you put it under a microscope. If you breath it in, it will NEVER come out. It will imbed into your lung tissue and there it will stay.

You need to take carbon fibre very seriously. It is great stuff, but can be quite a danger to your health. The correct filters to masks that are for carbon fibre is a must as are protective gloves too. As for the chemicals that are required for the resin, well you can read a label.

Lastly anyone who tells you that it is safe, no worries, the dust is fine, trust me I have been doing this for ages etc, etc.....run away from them......quickly!!

Matt

Thanks Matt,

I figured it was not too good for one's health. Usually the cool and fun things are not Grin

But then again, my dad and I are so screwed and I already have a hole in my back Grin

(healed over but nasty non the less)

Besides the danger, how does CF compare with fiber glass? I do know fiber glass is cheaper and I am already familiar with that. I will probably experiment with fiber glass first.

Tailwinds,
Adam

‎"At that time [1909] the chief engineer was almost always the chief test pilot as well. That had the fortunate result of eliminating poor engineering early in aviation."- Igor Sikorsky

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Reply #3 - Jan 27^th, 2013 at 12:07pm

expat Offline
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The difference between glass fibre and carbon fibre, is like paper and iron. Glass fibre, very easy to work with, but relatively weak, carbon fibre, requires special tooling, but is stronger than steel. It will truly depend on what you want to do with it. Also with carbon fibre, you require some sort of vacuum to get the layers to bond properly together.

Matt

PETA People Eating Tasty Animals.

B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400

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Reply #4 - Jan 29^th, 2013 at 11:20pm

Jayhawk Jake Offline
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One big thing to remember is that a typical fiberglass layup doesn't care as much about direction of the fibers, whereas carbon fiber is very directional.

I've worked with Carbon Fiber before, it's not all that hard. You'll need to pull a vacuum to get a proper bond. One little tip I do have is to be careful when impregnating the fibers with resin, if you aren't, you'll spread the tows and weaken the whole thing.

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Reply #5 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 7:00am

wahubna Offline
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Jayhawk Jake wrote on Jan 29^th, 2013 at 11:20pm:

One big thing to remember is that a typical fiberglass layup doesn't care as much about direction of the fibers, whereas carbon fiber is very directional.

I've worked with Carbon Fiber before, it's not all that hard. You'll need to pull a vacuum to get a proper bond. One little tip I do have is to be careful when impregnating the fibers with resin, if you aren't, you'll spread the tows and weaken the whole thing.

That might be why a previous DBF team used THREE layers to make a flipping wing before. It ended up being terrible in just about every way imaginable.

‎"At that time [1909] the chief engineer was almost always the chief test pilot as well. That had the fortunate result of eliminating poor engineering early in aviation."- Igor Sikorsky

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