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someone to make an airport (Read 4191 times)
Mar 28th, 2011 at 1:01am

smeely   Offline
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my internet plan is horrible, and i don't know if i would be good enough to make an acuruite representation of the airport near me. so can anyone make it for me? i will send pictures of it i will get measurments such as the runway length and the hight of the mountains at each end.

 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #1 - Apr 28th, 2011 at 8:10am

Strategic Retreat   Offline
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Which airport is that? And have you tried finding it on the various freeware sites already? Unless is REALLY a small speck, it's not impossible that someone else has done it already.

If you give me the basic info (name of the airport, country, ICAO and most importantly latitude and longitude, to find it on Google Earth to get live measurements from it) in a month or so I might whip it up something with ADE9X. Smiley

I know, a month is a lot, but I don't quite have all day for myself there. Wink

By the way, for which sim should I build it for? 9 or X? Huh


PS
Post here and PM me the data at the same time, so I'll get it for sure. I may forget to control this message for a while, leading you into a lot of waiting. Wink
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #2 - May 3rd, 2011 at 10:53pm

smeely   Offline
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Strategic Retreat wrote on Apr 28th, 2011 at 8:10am:
Which airport is that? And have you tried finding it on the various freeware sites already? Unless is REALLY a small speck, it's not impossible that someone else has done it already.

If you give me the basic info (name of the airport [color=#ff0000]name=aiyura
, country
Papua New Guinea
, ICAO
What exactly is the ICAO? InterContinental aristocratic order? Cheesy i haven't come accross that yet.
and most importantly latitude and longitude
lat="-06.20004"         
lon="145.54002"
, to find it on Google Earth to get live measurements from it
) in a month or so I might whip it up something with ADE9X. Smiley

I know, a month is a lot
that dosen't matter... making an airport and the rest of the stuff for it would take a while.
, but I don't quite have all day for myself there. Wink

By the way, for which sim should I build it for? 9 or X? Huh


PS
Post here and PM me the data at the same time, so I'll get it for sure. I may forget to control this message for a while, leading you into a lot of waiting. Wink [/color]



thanx, i am not sure quite what google earth has on it... u can see, and i will try to get the measurments of it, and send them to u... i use fs9

 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #3 - May 3rd, 2011 at 11:34pm

Strategic Retreat   Offline
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Answering it here instead of the PM because other people may find it useful or maybe offer occasional help. Smiley


smeely wrote on May 3rd, 2011 at 10:53pm:
country=Papua New Guinea, ICAO= What exactly is the ICAO? InterContinental aristocratic order? Cheesy i haven't come accross that yet.


The ICAO code, told VERY simply, is the standard four letter name of the airport, as an example, John Fitzgerald Kennedy Airport in NY is KJFK. The biggest airport in Rome is LIRF, and so on... but seen you don't know what an ICAO is... let's go on. Smiley


smeely wrote on May 3rd, 2011 at 10:53pm:
lat="-06.20004"         
lon="145.54002"

Thanx, i am not sure quite what google earth has on it... u can see, and i will try to get the measurments of it, and send them to u... i use fs9


There's a lot you do not know, and I am telling you this without any form mocking, mind, if you do not know Google Earth. I am far from all-knowing, as there's a WHOLE LOT I do not know, yet if you browse the net I find it strange you don't know about this: http://www.google.com/earth/index.html the most amazing way to visit all the planet without moving from your couch nor paying a cent more than your ISP connection. Cheesy

Anyway, since is 05:30 in the morning here at the moment, I'll begin working on it tomorrow as soon I'll resuscitate. I'll keep in touch on this very thread. Wink
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #4 - May 4th, 2011 at 3:26am

smeely   Offline
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ok, i haden't heard the term icao... it is AYAY
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #5 - May 4th, 2011 at 10:02am

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BAD news. Sad

Tried to find this airport on Google Earth, but was unable to because the definition of that part of the earth is pretty BAD and covered in clouds. Pretty much impossible to see anything.

This at least if this airport is at about 216 nautical miles from Port Moresby on vector 333.52, like GE told me.

So, I need from you the dimensions of the runway, its magnetic orientation and numeration of both ends, the airport's average height MSL, presence or not of navaids (ILS, VOR, NDB), kind of night-time illumination, if at all, kind of material runway and taxiway are made of, and if possible at all at least a general idea of the airport's layout from above with number and kind of parkings (if you know of online charts of your airport, link them here, they can help) or, if everything else fails try to draw a map of it yourself... and all the rest I can't remember right now. Undecided

For last, unless I need to call your attention immediately, or you need mine, let's for the moment write about this in the thread and not the PM. Wink
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #6 - May 5th, 2011 at 1:35am

smeely   Offline
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ok, i am getting the info... there is a mountain at one end, so we only take-off one way, and land the otherway... so i am not sure about the numeration at both ends bit... thanx so much for being willing to make the airport for me!!
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #7 - May 5th, 2011 at 4:49am

smeely   Offline
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I have some pics of the airport that will give a little bit of a clue of what it is like, but not much untill i get the other info...

C:\DocumentsandSettings\Administrator\Desktop\airport\tn_2009-09-25-12.04.39Daniel3067.jpg
C:\DocumentsandSettings\Administrator\Desktop\airport\tn_2009-09-25-12.04.48Daniel3068.jpg
C:\DocumentsandSettings\Administrator\Desktop\airport\m_2009-10-15-12.16.38-kmpj0834-K10.jpg
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #8 - May 5th, 2011 at 4:50am

smeely   Offline
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uurrggg they didn't upload, could i send them to ur skype?
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #9 - May 5th, 2011 at 8:06am

dave3cu   Offline
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Smeely,

Images must be uploaded to SimV using the 'Upload Images' link at the top of the forum page. Once they're uploaded, copy/paste the [img] tags into your post.

As mentioned, satellite images are obscured by clouds so another image that would help Strategic Retreat is an FS top-down screenshot marking the location relative to FS default roads and rivers and/or FS coordinates.

I've been following your topic and found a couple of Flickr sites with aerial pics of Aiyura airport. 

http://www.flickr.com/photos/13178416@N08/page4/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/kahunapulej/357461383/in/pool-78724820@N00/  (Several pics here via 'aiyura' tag)

Also, airport info I've found lists: Longitude : 145° 54’ 0” E Latitude : 6° 20’ 0” S
elevation=5100 ft and rwy length=4200 ft, but nothing on rwy heading or nav aids if present.

Dave
« Last Edit: May 5th, 2011 at 9:27am by dave3cu »  

At that time [1909] the chief engineer was almost always the chief test pilot as well. That had the fortunate result of eliminating poor engineering early in aviation.          Igor Sikorsky

I intend to live forever....so far, so good.         Steven Wright

You know....you can just rip up a to-do list.
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Reply #10 - May 5th, 2011 at 10:35am

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So, the things we know are:

1) Positioning

2) Runway length

3) Elevation


What we can glean after an educated guess looking at the photos is:

1) Runway pavement: dirt

2) No taxiway but a single grassy apron directly attached to the RWY

3) Probability of not there being ANY kind of navaids nor even glidescope light aids (VASI, PAPI, etc) VERY high.

4) Probability of absence of night time illumination very high as well, as it seems the kind of small airport for daytime traffic only

5) Absence of rwy number and horizontal markings, substituted by edge cones


What we still need to know:

1) Magnetic orientation of runway

2) Width of runway

3) Approximated position along the rwy and dimensions of parking apron

4) Confirmation it is an attached parking apron with no taxiways

5) Presence of a tower and its dimensions

6) ...whatever else may be useful, I guess... Tongue


As I have accurate mesh for all the world, any and every positioning problem will be manned by me BEFORE publishing, good to know it has a mountain looming on one RWY... but WHICH RWY is that?

Please let me know at least the mag orientation ASAP. The other I can improvise, in needed, but the orientation is quite... critical. Undecided
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #11 - May 5th, 2011 at 6:07pm

smeely   Offline
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this is the reply i got from one of the pilots, i need to ask one of the other pilots the width...
magnetic variation is 5.3 that is what i used for the waypoint that is there at the moment

Aiyura is 1280 meters long (sorry I don’t know the width), the runway orientation is 320 and 140 (land 14 take off 32), is at 5100 feet elevation,  no navaids, no lights, surface is packed earth,  near the 14 landing end there is one taxiway to the hangars with parking between the runway and hangars.  Sorry no on line charts available.
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #12 - May 6th, 2011 at 6:10am

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i don't know exactly what the rwy width is, but i am estimating 30-40ft... no tower, there is a radio there so we can direct planes a little...

i have asked for the specific information, but that could take a while... Wink
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #13 - May 6th, 2011 at 6:21am

smeely   Offline
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"As I have accurate mesh for all the world, any and every positioning problem will be manned by me BEFORE publishing, good to know it has a mountain looming on one RWY... but WHICH RWY is that?"

there is a mountain looming on both rwys as is said the takeoff is from one, and we land at the other.. that is as the mountain at the end of the landing one is smaller than the other one...

land 14 take off 32

so rwy 14 has a smaller mountain next to it, and 32 has a bigger mountain... when taking off the bigger mountain is behind us... also there is a mountain range on the east side about 400 meters away


because the mountains are there, the approach from the west, a clockwise turn until the last 100 meters or so
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #14 - May 6th, 2011 at 8:52am

dave3cu   Offline
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Some images that might help to visualize the airport layout.

Video-Rwy 14, standard 'right-hand' approach-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4lf5H4us9E

Images from ' kahunapulej's' Aiyura tagged images.

Aerial of concrete apron and hangers-http://www.flickr.com/photos/kahunapulej/4026113272/

Aerial of 32 showing concrete pad-http://www.flickr.com/photos/kahunapulej/3716574190/

On final, 14, shows wind sock and segmented circle-http://www.flickr.com/photos/kahunapulej/357461383/

There are other images in the Aiyura tagged group-http://www.flickr.com/photos/kahunapulej/tags/aiyura/- including ground level shots of apron and hanger area. Larger, better quality images can be viewed by right clicking on an image.
 

At that time [1909] the chief engineer was almost always the chief test pilot as well. That had the fortunate result of eliminating poor engineering early in aviation.          Igor Sikorsky

I intend to live forever....so far, so good.         Steven Wright

You know....you can just rip up a to-do list.
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Reply #15 - May 6th, 2011 at 9:57am

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Got it. Have a fair idea of how the thing must be laid down. In the next days will get on it. Smiley

Getting on it today is impossible for me, have to go pay taxes and all that cheerful jazz, then, as every year after paying the useless government money they'll use only for their personal advantage, I'll have to get really, Really, REALLY smashed, because too much cheer is just too much and I'll need to forget. Sad

Will write with new developments ASAP. Smiley
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #16 - May 6th, 2011 at 4:12pm

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First working report: Inspection of the place


Deciding that getting too smashed to forget taxes was not really cool, I've decided to begin this project instead, to get my mind elsewhere.

And it was there that I've stumbled on a something. Undecided

Fact is that on FS9 at  LAT 6° 20’ 0” S - LON 145° 54’ 0” E, on the very spot these coordinates point... it's 5421 feet high (calculating the about 3 feet default C172 clearance from ground into it), and if I try to define there a 5100 feet MSL airport, this is put in a beautiful deep gorge surrounded by sheer ravines. Tongue

Before you even start, I've tried excluding the world mesh I use. No dice. The height MSL remained the very same on that very spot. Try yourself if you do not believe me. Tongue

And that is not even the worse of the problems... on that point (C172's nose to 140) the terrain is sloping. Gets lower in a declivity on the right while on the left gets higher and at 15 maybe less feet always on the left from there there's a ROAD... Shocked

Now, I can see from the photos that a road is there in reality too, but what concerns me are the STREETLAMPS the FS road sports at regular intervals... those are a pain to try and exclude and they could compromise the airport's usability. Sad

So I've decided to edge the runway a little on the right, not a lot... let's say another 30 feet, not more... LAT 06° 20' 01" S - LON 145° 54'. 00" E is the place the new center of the airport will be.

And this generates a problem with FS9's management of slopes... I fear the apron of this airport will be on a 30 or so feet tall platform, as I will try and keep the runway flush with the above spoken of road, at... well, 5433 feet above sea level, circa.

Better that than a precise airport at the bottom of a ravine, you'd admit. Tongue

IF everything decides to proceed smoothly from now on, expect better news for the next days. Smiley


PS
Not sure I'll be able to replicate the concrete pad on the 32... I will try, but it's not so easy. Undecided
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #17 - May 8th, 2011 at 6:42am

smeely   Offline
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thats ok, it dosen't have to be that realistic... the points that i gave you, unless they were in what i fowarded from the pilot, were actually of a old school right near the airport, so not exact... the cement block at 32 isn't needed... i just would like to have something there that i can land, and take-off from, so no worries about the realism bit...

that road in real life dosen't have light poles, so it is annoying that fs put light poles in there... i will only be using small aircraft on it, so i should be able to get above the light poles...

i don't mind if the airport is higher than in real-life, just as long as with the default scenery it isn't in the air or something stupid like that...

like i said i am not that fussy about the realism of it... u haven't been here to see it in real-life, so something even remotely similar would satisfy me
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #18 - May 8th, 2011 at 2:34pm

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Nope. Not going to "that'll do" it. And anyway, I think something good has come out of it already... not quite payware level... more default-like style... but it's there already, and I'm not going to roll back to a lesser thing. Tongue

Especially after that I had a fight to the death with ADE9X, that did not display the scenery objects anymore after saving, leading to overlap of different objects that were, at one moment, an eyesore... Angry

Anyway, a fully usable version is ready. Want to try it? Mind you, it may still be quite rough, so it may be considered a beta. Just tell me what doesn't work and I'll try to put a patch to it.

first and foremost, gave the airport the ICAO name of AYAY, as you specified, then, due to FS limitation the hill on the 14 pretty much disappeared, but on the 34 is VERY marked (St Barth style, almost). Was able, with a small trick, to make the concrete pad appear, put a fuel switch with petrol pump, tried to shape the connection between apron and runway a little like in reality (with mixed results), though I was lead to understand that the airport's traffic is managed only by unicom decided to put a small eye candy tower, a hangar and a terminal. Five predetermined parkings only for GA. No VASI nor PAPI lights nor any other bauble... here's what it's came out from my struggle:

...

In the pic, for frame width reasons, is not visible the pretty much incumbent hill on the tarmac end of the 34, but it's there, while you can easily see that on the 14 there's no hill at all... send your complaints at Bill.Gates@Microsoft.Com ...I did what I could. Grin Wink

Send me a mail add and I'll send it to you ASAP. Smiley
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #19 - May 9th, 2011 at 1:40am

smeely   Offline
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thanx for making this...

if you were talking email, then send it to wadsered@gmail.com

otherwise you could upload it to one of the sites that share files like that... and give me a link
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #20 - May 9th, 2011 at 7:18am

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The unzipped .BGL file being less than 4Kb, and zipped doesn't reach even 2Kb, would be a waste of time to upload on a file sharing file. Wink

File sent. Unzip and copy the .BGL file into your FS9\Addon Scenery\Scenery\ folder and fire up the sim. Have fun and let me know if it works for you. Smiley
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #21 - May 10th, 2011 at 3:04am

smeely   Offline
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i haven't used the airport very much, but i like it...

i made about 5 missed approaches, as i couldn't see out of my plane very well... i have to get the stupid co-pilot out of the plane somehow... it might be built into the vc, though... annoying... or i could use another plane... will do a lot more flying in and out of it to find something that dosen't work... if any exist...
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #22 - May 10th, 2011 at 4:55pm

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Copilot? Inbuilt in the cockpit? What kind of plane are you using? I know NONE having a virtual copilot embedded in the panel. Huh

If you can't see out of the plane in landing maybe your Vref is too low and your plane is flying the final too nose-up for its good. Only big irons reach landing speeds in a nose-up attitude. Try dropping a notch of flaps more and/or take the plunge a little faster. Cool

Seen the kind of airport, the biggest plane to use among the [civil] contemporaries would be an ATR 72. Everything below that is legal and I can't see why you should deprive yourself of it. Wink
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #23 - May 11th, 2011 at 6:03am

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YUP, a co-pilot built into the model of the plane... i am using a cessna 402... yea, i got the landing, but not the vertical decent... i landed 1/2 way down the runway...  Roll Eyes

i am adding ai traffic now... will keep testing the airport...

as far as i can see, everything is working right
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #24 - May 11th, 2011 at 9:43am

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smeely wrote on May 11th, 2011 at 6:03am:
YUP, a co-pilot built into the model of the plane... i am using a cessna 402... yea, i got the landing, but not the vertical decent... i landed 1/2 way down the runway...  Roll Eyes


Practice, practice, practice... since the real thing doesn't have glideslope lights, nor these were implemented in the virtual one, things are harder, but not impossible.
Wink


smeely wrote on May 11th, 2011 at 6:03am:
I am adding ai traffic now... will keep testing the airport...


Keep me updated, then. In the unfortunate happenstance something with the AI doesn't work as it should, some variables may need to be ironed out in the airfield makeup.
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #25 - May 11th, 2011 at 10:38pm

smeely   Offline
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ai works, haven't actually seen one land, yet... but i have seen them leave, and seen one them after they had parked...
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #26 - May 12th, 2011 at 7:34am

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AI landing may be... not so easy to obtain on some runways. It all depends on the AI plane used. Even some (badly programmed) STOL AI planes sometimes find a runway like the one I did for you too short for a comfortable land and stop. In a case like this one you may see a lot of go-around and then, when the allotted time for the AI will end, they'll do a magical teleport from air on to a full stop on the runway or even directly on a parking spot. Undecided

Of course YOU or I may be even able to successfully land a full weight A380 on it, but I'm talking about AI here... Artificial Idiocy, you know... Wink

Content yourself with seeing them park and take off regularly... only the Lord knows all the times I tried to make AI land on short strips work, but failed every time. Roll Eyes


PS
To make your AI watching easier, if you haven't it already, download form a free add-on site the Traffic View Board with all the updates. It's quite the nice add-on for AI spotting. Smiley
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #27 - May 15th, 2011 at 4:01am

smeely   Offline
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lol, that was funny, i watched one land... it landed on rwy 32, the mountain at the end wasen't there for it or something, as it went straight through the mountain... Cheesy

 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #28 - May 15th, 2011 at 2:25pm

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smeely wrote on May 15th, 2011 at 4:01am:
lol, that was funny, i watched one land... it landed on rwy 32, the mountain at the end wasen't there for it or something, as it went straight through the mountain... Cheesy


Yeah... even more insane things do the AI do to stupidly follow the general rules... Roll Eyes

The are just too stoopid to understand that the rules were made to find exceptions to them. Wink

Sometimes I'd like to find a little time to put together a small AI traffic file for Lukla, then set the wind appropriately and virtually seat there enjoying underground flight capable planes burst out of the mountain to try and land downhill. One of these days, I will. Grin
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #29 - May 16th, 2011 at 1:36am

smeely   Offline
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yea, and they don't decend right, they fly straight down for a while, untill they are at the right altitude... Roll Eyes
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #30 - May 18th, 2011 at 4:37am

smeely   Offline
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how much effort would it take to convert it to something that works with fsx?

i am getting ade9x in june or something(one of my friends is bringing it), so if it is a complete remake of the airport then you don't have to do it...
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #31 - May 19th, 2011 at 2:33pm

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smeely wrote on May 18th, 2011 at 4:37am:
how much effort would it take to convert it to something that works with fsx?

i am getting ade9x in june or something(one of my friends is bringing it), so if it is a complete remake of the airport then you don't have to do it...


The conversion requires actually a half a dozen... mouse clicks. Quite the hard work, you'll have to admit. Grin

You need it for FSX? Send me a mail add (your choice if here or on a PM for privacy), and in a pair of hours (included final working check on the kid's installation) I'll send it to you. Smiley

PS
ADE9X is free for download, no reason to wait for your buddy. Search for it on Google, download it, install it, learn to use it. Wink
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #32 - May 20th, 2011 at 3:29am

smeely   Offline
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i am only waiting for my buddy, as the download would cost more than what we are willing to pay per month on internet...
it is 0.10c per mb, and $20 charge for the account, and we are only willing to pay something like $100-$160 per month for the three of us... Roll Eyes

send the fsx version to wadsered@gmail.com
i want it as i am not sure how many other people that would be interested in it have fsx, so i want them both to be sure... that is also why i am not urgent about needing it, as i don't know how much it will be used until i get fsx in 2-4 yrs or so when i return to Australia...
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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Reply #33 - May 20th, 2011 at 9:40am

Strategic Retreat   Offline
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Don't know where you're writing from, but to find a net situation like the one you described I must go back two years for a netbook/laptop account via USB wireless GSM connection and more than 12 years via landline analogical 56.4 Kbps telephone connection... and I thought we in Italy were behind. Grin Wink

Aaaanyway, could not understand if you wanted the airport ONLY for FSX or both for it and FS9, so I sent you both airports in different mails, with different installation instructions. Use what you want and feel free to discard the unwanted. Smiley

The FSX airport has an advantage and a disadvantage, compared to the one for FS9. The disadvantage is that I could NOT believably replicate the concrete pad on the 32, so the runway is totally dirt (sorry... not my fault), while the advantage is that the smaller hill on the 16 is there (while in FS9 isn't).

Have fun and let me know. Smiley
 

There is no such a thing as overkill. Only unworthy targets.
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Reply #34 - May 20th, 2011 at 7:13pm

smeely   Offline
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thanx, i am wrighting from the aiyura valley... (that is why i wanted the airport in the first place) Wink but anyway we are using a satellite connection to hongkong or somewhere there, so yea expensive Roll Eyes

runway being totally dirt doesn't matter.
thank-you for making this airport!
 

You never know what other places/countries are like untill you travel there. More people should get out of their home contries, just so they can understand/know more of/about the world
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