Simviation Forum - A missing man

Reply #30 - Dec 11^th, 2010 at 10:13pm

glennokc Offline
Colonel
I Like Flight Simulation!
Perth Western Australia

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Posts: 971

Token Aussie here

We still think of americans as seppos

but its all good...

I love everyone!

Go Do That VooDoo That You Do So Well!!!

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Reply #31 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 2:22am

Triple_7 Ex Member

7 years and 3 months...SimV has pretty much been my main home when it comes to forums, always enjoyed this place, had many good laughs...seen these forums go through many ups and downs. I visit and read these forums more then I post in them, always could find something of interest. Most of my time here wasn't because of flight sim but just a place to relax and maybe get a good laugh, or just unload after a rough day.

Unfortunately over the last year or so I've noticed a rather drastic change in the atmosphere, one like I've never seen before, and not in a good way. The cafe, and general discussion have been dieing for some time now. More of a hostile environment...lets face it, everyone is bound to make comments from time to time that come off as rude, racist, etc. But in today's "politically correct" world just about anything you say offends someone. I'm not sure what Fozzer may have said, but I've never had any impression that he was a bigot or a racist. Just seems strange that one of his comments could have been so bad as to resort to banning. If long term members that have been a huge part of this site can be banned so unexpectedly then anyone else is game too. I know keeping this site running requires a lot of tough choices, but honestly the reigns need to be loosened a little bit, no ones perfect, a few off color remarks should not be grounds for banning, that's what made SimV what it was, there was rules but not downright policing where one topic gets out of hand and good members are lost...to me that has been the true downfall to these once great forums, new topics seem to be scarce anymore, everyone feels the need to carefully tip toe around subjects just because 5 out of thousands of members might be offended. There's only so much political correctness that people can stand, censorship is not all its cracked up to be. Roll Eyes

Every forum changes over time, the rules of no political/religious subjects are understandable as this is a world wide community, but when a mild joke or comment can get you banned, that is when I feel like the censorship line has been crossed and it no longer something I want to be a part of. Some people need to lighten up and not take offense to every little thing, the world doesn't work that way.

There are still a few great members around, and those of you that have helped not only myself but many other members here on a variety of topics, or just made a comment that brightened someones gloomy day...I feel a big thank you is in order Smiley

...You are the true souls of any forum.

But with that being said, I've spoke my peace, and bid farewell. Smiley

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Reply #32 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 3:10am

glennokc Offline
Colonel
I Like Flight Simulation!
Perth Western Australia

Gender:
Posts: 971

I read the thread in question, and didnt find anything offensive at all about it.

Go Do That VooDoo That You Do So Well!!!

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Reply #33 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 4:46am

BigTruck Offline
Global Moderator
Former Sergeant of Marines
Tuscaloosa, AL

Gender:
Posts: 7161

It wasn't a single post that got Fozz banned folks. It was years and years of his posts. Yes he was a big contribution to the threads in his own way, and we took that into consideration, but we also warned him over and over again about his outspoken nature.

Some of you might not have found his posts offensive, but other members did, and we heard it about it. There were quite a few that made my hair stand on end as a U.S. Marine. We had to act on behalf of all the members. Our goal is to keep SimV the friendliest forums on the net. If it means banning a long term member who can't keep his political beliefs to himself, then so be it. And if that means we lose a few more members because they can't see past that, then so be it.

This is a flight sim forum folks. You want to complain about country politics and such, go to another forum. We aren't here to Police anyone as mods or admins. We are here to help as much as we can and keep the flight sim community just that, a flight sim community.

If you feel the urge to bash someone's country or criticize their gov, there are plenty of forums out there for that. There is no room for that here.

SimV is here for the flightsim community, and some of our members seem to forget that. Overall we are still the friendliest forums and we intend to keep it that way.

We gave Fozz plenty of room, and he kept taking advantage of it. We warned him over and over, and he just turned a blind eye. If he wasn't bashing your country then he was bashing mine. We spoke to him over and over again about it, trying to remind him what we are as SimV. It didn't stick, and we had to ban him.

Like I said, we aren't here to police and ban and be Bruce Almighty. But there is a place on the internets for political controversy, and SimV is not the place for that.

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Reply #34 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 5:27am

Layne. Offline
Colonel
Australia, Victoria, Melbourne

Gender:
Posts: 2654

I have to admit, i haven't been around much at all.
But from what I've read it seems like it was a very good action to ban Fozzer.
So he may have been help to some, i'm sure a LOT of people have been a help to you or anyone else but that does not warrant them to be able to break policies and rules within the forums.
If he was indeed a racist bigot, then i say good riddance. We do not need people such as that in these forums. If like some of you 'nay sayers' believe, that these are the friendliest forums around, that would not be true if racist bigots are posting their unfriendly comments here.
To the supporters who were also banned, or left, good riddance to you too. The less bad influence and nasty comments here the better.

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Reply #35 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 6:41am

ozzy72 Offline
Global Moderator
Pretty scary huh?
Madsville

Gender:
Posts: 37122

There have been many changes over the years here at SimV and every so often a Darwinian moment comes over.
I've been a mod here a looong time now (only Pete and Felix have been at it longer! I've been a mod for 8 of my 9 years here) and every now and again we have this happen, some member has an issue and things get hecked up and do or say things that are inappropriate (even I've done it a couple of times, once nearly got me kicked off the planet).
I think there are people taking the hobby and the forum far too seriously of late, I still treat this as my fun escape from reality, hence why I only post funny "news" stories and the like and try to compete with Rom for daft jokes (I'm still losing that battle of the giggles).
If we all lightened up a little and stopped to laugh at the ridiculousness of the world a little more I reckon the forums would be exactly like they were many moons ago. If you want to see a change, you have to make the change.
Meanwhile I'm going to go and clean my bike and go for a blat in the sunshine to remind me how awesome it is to be alive! Then tonight I'll be having another attempt at my maddest stunt EVER Shocked

Ozzy (still having fun after nearly a decade) Cool

There are two types of aeroplane, Spitfires and everything else that wishes it was a Spitfire!

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Reply #36 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 10:19am

patchz Offline
Colonel
What, me worry?
IN THE FUNNY PAPERS

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Posts: 10589

ozzy72 wrote on Dec 12^th, 2010 at 6:41am:

There have been many changes over the years here at SimV and every so often a Darwinian moment comes over.
I've been a mod here a looong time now (only Pete and Felix have been at it longer! I've been a mod for 8 of my 9 years here) and every now and again we have this happen, some member has an issue and things get hecked up and do or say things that are inappropriate (even I've done it a couple of times, once nearly got me kicked off the planet).
I think there are people taking the hobby and the forum far too seriously of late, I still treat this as my fun escape from reality, hence why I only post funny "news" stories and the like and try to compete with Rom for daft jokes (I'm still losing that battle of the giggles).
If we all lightened up a little and stopped to laugh at the ridiculousness of the world a little more I reckon the forums would be exactly like they were many moons ago. If you want to see a change, you have to make the change.
Meanwhile I'm going to go and clean my bike and go for a blat in the sunshine to remind me how awesome it is to be alive! Then tonight I'll be having another attempt at my maddest stunt EVER Shocked

Ozzy (still having fun after nearly a decade) Cool

Well said Mark.

As to the stunt, have you completely forgotten how to post screenshots? Roll Eyes

If God intended aircraft engines to have horizontally opposed engines, Pratt and Whitney would have made them that way.

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Reply #37 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 11:46am

B-Valvs Offline
Colonel
Jaggie Police
5B2

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Posts: 5949

DaveSims wrote on Dec 11^th, 2010 at 10:07pm:

As much time as I spend on this forum, I must have missed the tension between certain members. I have always thought of this as the nicest forum I have ever frequented.

Same here. That's why I'm so stunned by this thread. I've somehow avoided picking up on it over the last 3 years.

Cool

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Reply #38 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 11:46am

aussiewannabe Offline
Colonel
Directive!

Posts: 2541

glennokc wrote on Dec 11^th, 2010 at 10:13pm:

Token Aussie here

We still think of americans as seppos

but its all good...

I love everyone!

Strange, I was never called a seppo while living in Oz. Called "mate" several times though Wink

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Reply #39 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 12:36pm

alrot Offline
Colonel
Freeware Designers Above
All..

Posts: 10231

ozzy72 wrote on Dec 12^th, 2010 at 6:41am:

There have been many changes over the years here at SimV and every so often a Darwinian moment comes over.
I've been a mod here a looong time now (only Pete and Felix have been at it longer! I've been a mod for 8 of my 9 years here) and every now and again we have this happen, some member has an issue and things get hecked up and do or say things that are inappropriate (even I've done it a couple of times, once nearly got me kicked off the planet).
I think there are people taking the hobby and the forum far too seriously of late, I still treat this as my fun escape from reality
, hence why I only post funny "news" stories and the like and try to compete with Rom for daft jokes (I'm still losing that battle of the giggles).
If we all lightened up a little and stopped to laugh at the ridiculousness of the world a little more I reckon the forums would be exactly like they were many moons ago. If you want to see a change, you have to make the change.
Meanwhile I'm going to go and clean my bike and go for a blat in the sunshine to remind me how awesome it is to be alive! Then tonight I'll be having another attempt at my maddest stunt EVER Shocked

Ozzy (still having fun after nearly a decade) Cool

I must say ,well said Mark ,I'm so agree ,YES these types of things are meant to be fun , we can't take our hobbies too serious, I will confess myself, I have left Simv countless times , then came back with my tail between my legs ,I have become Mad I have cry and get full stress and more because of the airplane making .
this is a place to scape from the real words which have to be taken more serious , the reason the real reason why I do spend a lot of time ,eyes, and head in the making airplanes its because I really enjoy the making of them .

few days ago a pirate site took one plane ,and that was to me the end otf the world ,

when it doesn't supposed to be

I'm putting my self as and example

I try to told a guy which I though he was having the same addition to a forum in the best way to get his life back ,I was wrong I misunderstood the guy

I'll quote myself
alrot wrote on Oct 31^st, 2010 at 2:48pm:

I think you are letting this all MSFS become part of your life and that's when It becomes a life and death issue, you need to find another hobbies besides flying a Computer Game ,because this is what it is

A Game

and nothing more ,you must enjoy as what it is ,and don't make it part of your life .There is design with the FSX-SDK of FS9-SDK there are many other games, but above all I'll give you the best GAME of all, Turn off that PC and go nearest airport and watch real airplanes ,meet people ,meet girls , I'm telling you this because you are the same ME a year ago , by reading you I realize I was watching myself , For frustration with these GAMES I have left this forum 3 times ,with anger , the truth is this is not the life.

Sorry to be honest ,my apologies if this is not your case, but your post really touch me ,and what I'm trying to wake you up man ,there is a beutiful GAME outside your door ,sometimes its creepy ugly ,sometimes is nice and cool ,that depends of how good you play in that game .

we can't live a life in a website forum , we can have fun by following the rules , I have learn this and sometime I fail because i forgot that this is just 2 dimensions world (monitor screen) that the things are saying ,that if I post something and no one replys that doesn't mean that I beiing ignore and if does ,it doesn't matter I have a life in the real world

try to see my point , I feel that Crash and CD are good friends we've known for years ,Fozzer was the first guy I meet here ,with his jokes , but what ever Paul did and if he was banned why would I left ? I care a lot about him but no enough to remove my account again , also I have real problems around here in the real life to get really worried about , If some one tells me that Fozzer is sick THAT's when I really make my Personal problem ..

People Enjoy the this forums , don't make it as part of you real life ,IT can't disturb you , this isn't even a real club where you meet real people flesh and Bones , this is YABB a software of 20 mb
the forums is what we made of it and the smartest thing is not to take it too serious , if you do ,that's when it becomes a personal night mare

Venezuela

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Reply #40 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 2:07pm

Steve M Offline
Colonel
Cambridge On.

Gender:
Posts: 4097

My curiosity got the the best of me over the last couple of weeks. I wanted to know what happened, I asked and got no response untill this thread. It isn't any of my business anyway, but I was wondering about the well being of a member. If someone had taken a few seconds to explain the situation to me I would have never replied to this thread and I doubt so many others would have been taken by surprise. I respect the decisions of the Admin here and would like to continue on as a member. This thread has become so depressing I would love to see it locked and let it roll quietly off the page.
Best wishes for the future..

Flying with twins is a lot of fun..

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Reply #41 - Dec 12^th, 2010 at 3:30pm

ApplePie Offline
Colonel
North Carolina, USA

Gender:
Posts: 2143

I am astounded by this thread. Shocked

And while I am saddened from the loss of all of these members, I think people took/are taking this forum a little too seriously. Roll Eyes

Pax vobiscum!
Christian

MY SPECS= 5' 11" Slightly less than healthy male, 160 lbs., Brown eyes........Oh...you were wondering about my computers specs.....

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Reply #42 - Dec 14^th, 2010 at 11:55am

JBaymore Offline
Global Moderator
Under the curse of the
hombuilt cockpit!

Gender:
Posts: 10261

I wanted to add in my $0.02 here.

There were many aspects about Fozzer's postings that I also truly enjoyed. And I will really miss those aspects of his presence here. If many of his postings were in private email conversations between just the two of us, I would have little issue with many of them. Not that I would agree with all that he said, nor find all his jokes funny, nor agree with all his political and racial views, ...... but in that private setting... he could say what he wanted and I could decide if I wanted to continue the conversation if I wanted to.

What this came down to was looking at the balance between the positive aspects and the negative aspects of Fozzer's postings in a public venue. The negative finally won out.

Fozzer's posting issues here revolved around his constant and overt "bucking of the rules" over many, many years. And also after many, many discussions with him via PM/email. He knew exactly where he stood on this, and he chose to not comply with the site management's desires for the operation of the forums. He CHOSE to do that; we decided not to allow him to do it. It is that simple. But please remember, not following the forum rules and "culture" was his decision. He knew for a long time that he had 9 toes out the door.

This was not in any way a sudden and unconsidered decision. In the Moderators private forum section there were countless discussion about how to deal with many of his postings. I want to state here publically that Pete often was Fozzer's staunchest defender in these various discussions. If it was up to the rest of the moderators..... Fozzer would likely have been gone a long time ago.

Maybe our real mistake was not doing that a log time ago. By so doing, we sent the message to some others that what he was doing was OK. It was not.

The aspect of "political correctness" is important from a management point of view for a public venue. This is an international venue. We want it to be a comfortable place to be for people from all countries. We want it to be a comfortable place to be for people from different political views within the same country. The best way to assure this is to keep general content from deliberately veering too deeply into the known "hot button" areas like religion, politics, sexual orientation, and so on.

We even are pretty easygoing on this aspect here; sometimes we mods debate a long time before deciding a thread is heading into "dangerous ground" and making a posting in it that sends it back on track. Locking such threads happens only rarely. Fully deleting them is almost never the case.

We must keep in mind that this place is also frequented by CHILDREN as young as 13 years of age (or younger if they lie about their ages at signup). So the content here is being read by them and they are picking up ideas and impressions from what they find here. We take their "education" seriously too.

We are sorry if some people feel that Fozzer was treated unfairly. That is not the case. If I thought it was, I'd be outta' here too.

best,

..............john

Intel i7 960 quad 3.2G LGA 1366, Asus P6X58D Premium, 750W Corsair, 6 gig 1600 DDR3, Spinpoint 1TB 7200 HD, Caviar 500G 7200 HD, GTX275 1280M, Logitec Z640, Win7 Pro 64b, CH Products yoke, pedals + throttle quad, simpit

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