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Mixture vs Throttle vs Prop control (Read 2320 times)
Jul 15th, 2010 at 1:45pm

ShaneG   Offline
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I've noticed that these three levers result in a very fine ballet of sorts while flying to maintain speed & power.

Currently, I'm using a manual with a complete checklist from cold & dark back to park, for flying the Baron.

It says during each phase of flight, to get the RPM & MP set with the throttle & Prop control, and I do so as was discussed in my previous thread. 
It then also gives reference speeds for various altitudes while climbing, cruising, and decent, and although it doesn't say it or mention it, I have been adjusting the speed for each using the mixture.

Is that correct?  Undecided

If not, what is the correct method of controlling speed ?  Huh

The only time my manual really mentions the mixture lever is for start up, taxi, approach, and shut down.
Nothing is mentioned for climb-out, cruise, and decent.

Thanks for helping with yet another of my basic knowledge questions.   Embarrassed  Wink
 
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Reply #1 - Jul 15th, 2010 at 4:41pm

Fozzer   Offline
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How to...>>>>

http://www.ehow.com/how_4477902_use-mixture-control-airplane.html

Paul....G-BPLF...FS 2005...FS Nav...and a Mixture Knob... Cool...!
 

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Reply #2 - Jul 15th, 2010 at 6:22pm

DaveSims   Offline
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ShaneG wrote on Jul 15th, 2010 at 1:45pm:
I've noticed that these three levers result in a very fine ballet of sorts while flying to maintain speed & power.

Currently, I'm using a manual with a complete checklist from cold & dark back to park, for flying the Baron.

It says during each phase of flight, to get the RPM & MP set with the throttle & Prop control, and I do so as was discussed in my previous thread. 
It then also gives reference speeds for various altitudes while climbing, cruising, and decent, and although it doesn't say it or mention it, I have been adjusting the speed for each using the mixture.

Is that correct?  Undecided

If not, what is the correct method of controlling speed ?  Huh

The only time my manual really mentions the mixture lever is for start up, taxi, approach, and shut down.
Nothing is mentioned for climb-out, cruise, and decent.

Thanks for helping with yet another of my basic knowledge questions.   Embarrassed  Wink


You control speed with your power settings, MP and RPM if you will.  There are several schools of thought to leaning the mixture for cruise, usually in reference to peak EGT temperatures (Some say 50 degrees rich of peak, some say 50 degrees lean of peak, some say lean to peak).  The reason for leaning the mixture is because the higher you fly, the thinner the air gets.  Thus as you climb, the mixture gradually gets richer and richer.  In order for the engine to get maximum performance, you have to pull the mixture lever out slightly, to lean the mixture back to its best setting.

As for the reference speeds.  During climb, you control the speed using pitch, while usually (at least in light aircraft) remaining at full throttle and prop rpm.  Once you level off into cruise, you let the aircraft gain speed, then set your throttle, then your prop speed, and then leaning the mixture to its proper setting.  Now the aircraft may not be at the reference speeds in the book, and many things may alter that, including air temperature, air pressure, weight of the aircraft, etc.  You just set cruise power, and get whatever speed that gives you.
 
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Reply #3 - Jul 15th, 2010 at 7:27pm

Brett_Henderson   Offline
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That article describes what a mixture adjustment accomplishes, and that's about it..not a very good "lesson".

You'll have to take your lashings, for flying a complex twin, before fully understanding how a pilot controls mixture in a fixed-prop single  Tongue

First, to answer one question..  you control your airspeed by pitch. File that away as gospel truth, never to be questioned  Cool

Now.. for a fixed-prop single, leaning during the climb:  In a perfect world, you'd always have a perfectly functioning EGT. As fuel enters a combustion chamber, it actually acts as a coolant first,  and then combusts. As you lean a mixture (I start at 3000msl), the exhaust gasses will get hotter.. then peak, and then further leaning gets into scenario where exhaut gasses cool, because so much less energy being generated. Somewhere near that peak, is where the mixture is optimal, and the most HP is being produced. A long-time practice for the best compromise between; engine life, economy and power; is to run a tad on the rich side of that peak (ROP). So.. if you have a responsive, accurate EGT, you'd lean till the gauge peaked, and then richen a couple notches... remember that gauge indication (most have an adjustable reference line), and try to keep it there, throughout the climb.

Once leveled and trimmed.. you can lean for cruise. It's OK (and desirable) to go lean of peak (LOP) for a cruise. Just remember to go back to a climb EGT indication, if you end up climbing again. Descents will be at lower power settings, so you kinda best guess per your altitude, and re-lean for cruise at your new altitude. If it's a descent for landing, just go full rich at 3000msl.

In the real world, I don't trust EGT gauges on rental aircraft, so I "wing it". Start leaning carefully at 3000msl, giving yourself margin for error on the rich side. After enough flying, you'll feel a sweet-spot for a climb. For cruise, lean slowly until the engine "complains", and then richen a tad. That's usually a bit LOP.

During all of this, you control your airspeed by pitching for a desried climb-speed  (Vy at first, and then cruise-climb airspeed)  Wink

Now.. for a constant-speed prop, it's a bit different. The article mentions using RPM for reference, but for that to even be considered, you would have had to let the mixture get way out of whack. An attentive pilot will never have to make mixture adjustments that will effect RPM, because sans substantial power changes (via poor mixture), a constant-speed prop won't LET the RPMs change. And manifold pressure is a function of RPMs and throtle position, so it shouldn't change either. You have to hope that an EGT in a high-performance airplane is in good working order. That would be your primary reference for leaning. Also, you'll know what fuel consumption numbers will occur for different power settings, at different altitudes..so you can incorporate the fuel-flow gauges. Between those two references, you should be able to properly manage mixture.

And again, you'll be managing your airspeed by pitch  Wink

Side note: Many fixed-prop, fuel-injected singles have fuel-flow gauges.. you can reference them too.

The MSFS dilema:  MSFS EGT gauges are slow to react, and don't react enough to be useful. And there's a quirk in the MSFS engine algorithm that makes fuel-flow gauges behave oddly. MSFS's method for punishing poor mixture (reduce power), is to restrict fuel-flow proportionally to "wrongness", either side of optimal. This weird twist gives you the world's best mixture indicator. Just lean to keep fuel-flow at a peak.. and then go slight less than peak for cruise.

You can witness this bizarre-ness by climbing to 6000msl without touching the mixture. Your initial leaning will actual cause fuel-flow to INCREASE.. then peak, and then decrease. It kinda acts like an EGT.

I've even re-bitmapped a fuel-flow gauge and used it as an EGT ...  Grin
 
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Reply #4 - Jul 15th, 2010 at 7:55pm

ShaneG   Offline
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Thanks once again for filling me in on the basics fellas.
Even though it sounds a hell of lot more complicated than it probably is.   Shocked

If I wasn't spending so much time in the Baron, I'd probably learn a lot more, correctly.  Embarrassed  Wink

I've been watching the EGT & Flow gauges, but for the wrong reasons!  Lips Sealed
It may be time for me to switch to the 172 for the Alaska tour, and learn as I fly.  Wink 

I did see a manual for it, made by the same person who did the Baron manual I'm using.
It probably wouldn't hurt me to go back and do the lessons again,
it has been quite a few years since I messed with those.
(It got real old failing them without ever knowing why or how  Embarrassed)

 
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Reply #5 - Jul 15th, 2010 at 10:23pm

olderndirt   Offline
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One little technique that works a charm.  Switch to a single mag, lean to max rpm on that one.  When you switch back to both, it'll be just right.  Of course, if you have a panel full of exotic stuff, might as well use it  Smiley.
 

... 

                            
THIS IS NOT A PANAM CLIPPER

                                                            
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Reply #6 - Jul 16th, 2010 at 7:27am

Fozzer   Offline
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Posts: 24861
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olderndirt wrote on Jul 15th, 2010 at 10:23pm:
One little technique that works a charm.  Switch to a single mag, lean to max rpm on that one.  When you switch back to both, it'll be just right.  Of course, if you have a panel full of exotic stuff, might as well use it  Smiley.


Lovely trick...Wink...!

Simplicity is wonderful... Kiss...!

The Beech Baron 58 Twin is an excellent Sim Aircraft for getting used to the Throttle, Prop, and Mixture controls.
Its fitted with a full set of very useful gauges!

(Including Radio Nav/Com).

Paul....Knob Twiddler Extraordinaire!... Cool...!

.... Grin...!
 

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