Search the archive:
Simviation Main Site
|
Site Search
|
Upload Images
Simviation Forum
›
Real World
›
Real Aviation
› Kid directs traffic at JFK
(Moderators: Mitch., Fly2e, ozzy72, beaky, Clipper, JBaymore, Bob70, BigTruck)
‹
Previous Topic
|
Next Topic
›
Pages:
1
2
Kid directs traffic at JFK (Read 2400 times)
Mar 3
rd
, 2010 at 2:40pm
specter177
Offline
Colonel
Check out the Maverick
Flying Car!
I-TEC - X35
Gender:
Posts: 1406
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,587801,00.html
Discuss.
Personally, I think taking his kid there was fine, but actually letting him talk to planes was crossing the line.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #1 -
Mar 3
rd
, 2010 at 2:45pm
SeanTK
Ex Member
Based on what they actually let the kid do, I don't really see a problem with it, as long as it doesn't become a common occurrence. He was not giving aircraft movement instructions, and besides that, he had a professional controller (the father) AND a supervisor there to make sure everything went smoothly. It was a very, very controlled situation, with what I believe to be ZERO chance of risk.
Again, I wouldn't want them to make a habit out of bringing the kid in, but for a one or two time occasional thing, it didn't seem to harm anything. Adding to that, everyone involved in the moment (pilots, controllers, etc.) seemed to really enjoy it, and to specify again, according to the article, all he was doing was giving handoff instructions after being told exactly what to say.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #2 -
Mar 3
rd
, 2010 at 2:51pm
expat
Offline
Colonel
Deep behind enemy lines!
Gender:
Posts: 8499
I think that this is going to be blown so sky high that it will be on Mars gathering dust so long that NASA, if they ever get their will in the headlines for coming second. Sorry, but a total none story, but the selling of papers and a nice class action by "traumatised" passengers who found out when they arrived it was their aircraft and saw $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and a life in the sun is what it is about. How about asking the pilots involved what they think/thought and if any thought safety was compromised to file the relevant paperwork and not have a couple of people hung out to dry by a media frenzy....as usual.
A "great day out for your child Bill, but it was ill advised, don't do it again" is all that is required.
Matt (preparing for the critical onslaught)
PETA
People Eating Tasty Animals.
B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #3 -
Mar 3
rd
, 2010 at 4:04pm
machineman9
Offline
Colonel
Nantwich, England
Gender:
Posts: 5255
The only 'bad points' I can see is the 'adios amigo' and the giggling in the background. Besides that, the job got done.
I mean, rules are rules. You shouldn't let your young child drive your car around even though he was being supervised by two people. He shouldn't have been there, but no harm was caused.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #4 -
Mar 4
th
, 2010 at 12:52pm
specter177
Offline
Colonel
Check out the Maverick
Flying Car!
I-TEC - X35
Gender:
Posts: 1406
Normally I would agree, but aviation has taken too many hits recently, and this is just one more. Public confidence is being shaken, and things like this only hurt the aviation industry.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #5 -
Mar 4
th
, 2010 at 4:13pm
DaveSims
Offline
Colonel
Clear Lake, Iowa
Gender:
Posts: 2453
While I do believe this story is getting blown way out of proportion, i think if this guy would have stopped to think about what he was doing, and WHERE he was doing it, he might have made different choices. If this had happened at some backwoods airport control tower, no one would have noticed or cared, but at JFK?
This day in age, with the media as it is, one must always be aware of appearances, and how seemingly innocent actions can be made out to be criminal.
Dave
www.flymcw.com
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #6 -
Mar 4
th
, 2010 at 5:37pm
C
Offline
Colonel
Earth
Posts: 13144
Dangerous? Probably not.
Ill advised? Almost certainly.
Worth a slap on the wrist? Very much so.
There's a time and a place. Tower freq at a busy international probably isn't it.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #7 -
Mar 4
th
, 2010 at 7:48pm
Flying Trucker
Offline
Colonel
An Old Retired Rocking
Chair Flying Geezer
Gender:
Posts: 11425
Good evening all...
Having thought this over a number of times and reminiscing the past and believe me that was the most difficult part I have to agree with the above post.
I think "C" you put it into perspective.
I remember the day when we could allow members of the immediate family and close friends into the cockpit of an aircraft while in flight. I guess those days are gone for many. Sad really.
Did 911 bring that on, no not really, it was something that was going to happen sooner or later however these sort of things have a short life span, believe me, I have been around aviation too long and seen this before. Closing off the cockpit or tower does not stop someone committed to blowing up an airplane, it only serves to aid the terrorist propaganda machine.
If I had a question on this it would be:
Asking the difference between "Stupidity" and "Security".
Cheers..Happy Landings..Doug
Cheers...Happy Landings...Doug
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #8 -
Mar 4
th
, 2010 at 9:24pm
olderndirt
Offline
Colonel
Flying is PFM
Rochester, WA
Gender:
Posts: 3574
Been reading this and wondering if I had anything worth saying. One thought did pass my frontal lobe, this fanaticism some parents have about getting their kids in the limelight. We've all seen pictures of little girls, made up to and beyond the nines, being feverishly promoted by one or both parents as the next Shirley Temple. Maybe some of this parental 'this is my kid, ain't he/she the greatest' syndrome was part of the JFK event. One thing, I'll never understand, is what, besides that first cold one at the end of the shift, was that supervisor thinking about?
THIS IS NOT A PANAM CLIPPER
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #9 -
Mar 5
th
, 2010 at 8:49am
Brett_Henderson
Offline
Colonel
EVERY OUTER MARKER SHOULD
BE AN NDB
Gender:
Posts: 3593
Most of what I heard, were the scripted broadcasts even GA pilots are familiar with..
"cleared for takeoff" .. "contact approach" etc.
All the "controlling" had already been done. Pilots don't even pay special attention to those broadcasts, other than listening for something OTHER than what they KNOW the controller will be saying.
So long as he wasn't issuing clearances.. and interpreting read-backs.. or handling spacing and seperation directions..
WHO CARES !?
And even if it were something other than routine.. a bright kid with two experiened adults looking over his shoulder is probably safer that a tired controller at the end of a long shift.
This is more about the media's need to make news... and a government bureaucracy posturing for an ignorant public's benefit.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #10 -
Mar 5
th
, 2010 at 10:42am
beaky
Offline
Global Moderator
Uhhhh.... yup!
Newark, NJ USA
Gender:
Posts: 14187
Brett_Henderson wrote
on Mar 5
th
, 2010 at 8:49am:
Most of what I heard, were the scripted broadcasts even GA pilots are familiar with..
"cleared for takeoff" .. "contact approach" etc.
All the "controlling" had already been done. Pilots don't even pay special attention to those broadcasts, other than listening for something OTHER than what they KNOW the controller will be saying.
So long as he wasn't issuing clearances.. and interpreting read-backs.. or handling spacing and seperation directions..
WHO CARES !?
And even if it were something other than routine.. a bright kid with two experiened adults looking over his shoulder is probably safer that a tired controller at the end of a long shift.
This is more about the media's need to make news... and a government bureaucracy posturing for an ignorant public's benefit.
I agree, on all points.
It's not much different, in effect, than any controller injecting a little levity on-mic (while of course doing their job properly). They do that, from time to time, and nobody cares, as long as the traffic is flowing safely.
The kid made no decisions, and I would bet my life that he said only what he was told to say (including the "adios amigo"), and when to say it . He probably wasn't even the one pushing the mic key.
He spoke clearly,the pilots loved it, smiles all around, efficiency and safety were not compromised even one iota... no actual harm done.
The only thing that bugs me about it is that this controller must have realized that A) it is definitely "non-standard" and would be frowned upon by his employers and B) that there would be hell to pay for it if the public found out.
So... why do it?? Was it worth it for him? Does he realize the damage he has done to his industry, and flying in general?
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #11 -
Mar 5
th
, 2010 at 11:02am
Brett_Henderson
Offline
Colonel
EVERY OUTER MARKER SHOULD
BE AN NDB
Gender:
Posts: 3593
Quote:
So... why do it?? Was it worth it for him? Does he realize the damage he has done to his industry, and flying in general?
Yeah *sigh*.. I wish he hadn't done it.. but I wish even more, that it could all be taken in context.
I don't want bureacratic robots in a tower, anymore than I'd want them running a police department. I trust his decision to do this, as much as I trust the decision of a police officer to not issue a speeding ticket to everyone going 1mph over the limit.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #12 -
Mar 5
th
, 2010 at 1:01pm
DaveSims
Offline
Colonel
Clear Lake, Iowa
Gender:
Posts: 2453
I remember the good ole days of ATC, back when the BTR approach control would give out the LSU score with the altimeter setting.
That would probably be a career ending mistake these days.
Dave
www.flymcw.com
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #13 -
Mar 5
th
, 2010 at 4:26pm
SaultFresh
Offline
Colonel
Flight Instructor, CYKZ
Woodbridge, Ontario
Gender:
Posts: 134
I personally think this is awesome, haha. I think on that day, a dream could've been sparked, so was it all worth it, yeah, in the sense that seeding hopeful dreams in a young kid is a great experience. Now, I kinda don't think that it should have been done at JFK, but if it had been done at some smaller airport, I think that's great. I mean, my airport here in Canada isn't really busy, even on a busy day, haha. If the Tower controller brought his kid to work and I got to talk to him or her over the radio, that would make my day, and it would probably make the kids day too. Overall, I think that kid is pretty lucky, I never got to sit in a cockpit when I was a kid, and I certainly never got to go in tower either. I also never went to work with my dad, which could possibly be why I decided to do something different career wise, haha. I don't believe any harm was done, it was not out of control, and I think that guy is a pretty cool dad, I hope he doesn't catch too much flak from this.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #14 -
Mar 5
th
, 2010 at 5:56pm
JoBee
Offline
Colonel
Better to give than receive.
Posts: 582
Somewhere some FAA lawyer is gonna say "we have to be careful about setting a precedent. If we slap this guy on the wrist, some other controller is gonna think "I'll take a slap on the wrist so my little Johnny can talk on the radio too""
This guy, and his boss are going to get canned.
In my opinion the tower needs to be as sterile an environment as the cockpit and having these kids in the tower had to be a distraction.
And if you don't think bad things can happen real fast in the ATC world, watch this -
http://www.faa.gov/airports/runway_safety/videos/media/simulation.html
Yeah, these guys are going to get canned, and I think it is justified.
cheers,
Joe
Don't argue with idiots, they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
Back to top
IP Logged
Pages:
1
2
‹
Previous Topic
|
Next Topic
›
« Home
‹ Board
Top of this page
Forum Jump »
Home
» 10 most recent Posts
» 10 most recent Topics
Current Flight Simulator Series
- Flight Simulator X
- FS 2004 - A Century of Flight
- Adding Aircraft Traffic (AI) & Gates
- Flight School
- Flightgear
- MS Flight
Graphic Gallery
- Simviation Screenshots Showcase
- Screenshot Contest
- Edited Screenshots
- Photos & Cameras
- Payware Screenshot Showcase
- Studio V Screenshot Workshop
- Video
- The Cage
Design Forums
- Aircraft & 3D Design
- Scenery & Panel Design
- Aircraft Repainting
- Designer Feedback
General
- General Discussion
- Humour
- Music, Arts & Entertainment
- Sport
Computer Hardware & Software Forum
- Hardware
- Tweaking & Overclocking
- Computer Games & Software
- HomeBuild Cockpits
Addons Most Wanted
- Aircraft Wanted
- Other Add-ons Wanted
Real World
- Real Aviation ««
- Specific Aircraft Types
- Autos
- History
On-line Interactive Flying
- Virtual Airlines Events & Messages
- Multiplayer
Simviation Site
- Simviation News & Info
- Suggestions for these forums
- Site Questions & Feedback
- Site Problems & Broken Links
Combat Flight Simulators
- Combat Flight Simulator 3
- Combat Flight Simulator 2
- Combat Flight Simulator
- CFS Development
- IL-2 Sturmovik
Other Websites
- Your Site
- Other Sites
Payware
- Payware
Old Flight Simulator Series
- FS 2002
- FS 2000
- Flight Simulator 98
Simviation Forum
» Powered by
YaBB 2.5 AE
!
YaBB Forum Software
© 2000-2010. All Rights Reserved.