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Affinity mask and TBM on i7? (Read 4648 times)
Feb 22nd, 2009 at 11:46pm

jwenham   Offline
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The affinity mask may be a see how it works on your system but I have been making close observations with mine. They are as follows:

1) setting it to 7 worked and seemed to be fine in my test except for when I tested with all my addons chugging along. I set the addons to run on core 1 as that is the core left open with a setting of 7. What happend durring the test with all addons on core 1 and FSX on 2, 3, 4 was a hard crash saying my OC failed. When rebooting durring POST it was reading stock the speed 2.93. When going into the BIOS, all my OC settings were in tack. ALT CTRL DELETE and reboot all all was back to normal.

2) setting it to 14 seemed to be best during my test but did notice some stutters when on takeoff roll and taxi and initial climb. These were small stutters but would repeat untill in a calmer area.

3) setting it at 15 activates all 4 cores and produced stutters in busier areas.

4) no affinity mask really seems to do a better job of evening things out while transitioning from heavy to lighter areas. The stutters seem to be reduced as well where they were more prominent. While testing this setting I watched my CPU temps as well as the performace in the task manager. Core 1 was almost always at 100% and the other 3 would hum along according to the graph equally more or less at around 60% or lower. Then when turning or entering a heavier area the last 3 cores would step in more and even things out. Also with this setting I was able to get higher FPS from 2 to 5 more than with the other settings tested.

My conclusion is that if you fly around in a area that doesnt have large swings in performance an affinity mask may improve things for you. If you fly longer flights or fly in areas that have big swings in performance not applying a affinity mask showed more pleasing results for me with more consistant FPS and smoothness while transitioning from area to area.

Take this info however you wish but I really spent alot of time looking at this and the results of each and wanted to pass along my findings.

The setting that really made the biggest improvement for me was setting the TBM to 90. I started at 70 but got alot of stutters with it. When switching to 80 I saw another notch of smoothness to the sim. I then went to 90 to see what would happen and it again added another notch of smoothness. I really noticed it getting better and better when switching settings while using TRACK IR. I then went to 100 and started to see more stutters comming back similar to the 70 setting. So 90 ended up being my sweet spot. I confirmed this setting with another that has the same system as me.

Hopefully this will help some people in finding a good set of tweeks for those on i7 as I spent alot of time investigating them.  To recap my settings are:

FRAME RATE LOCKED at 30
TBM = 90
No affinity mask
BufferPools = 100000000
 

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Reply #1 - Feb 23rd, 2009 at 6:11am

Wingo   Offline
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Thanks for the info. I'll try these settings on my system soon to confirm. did you have HT enabled or disabled?
 

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Reply #2 - Feb 23rd, 2009 at 7:05am

jwenham   Offline
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Wingo wrote on Feb 23rd, 2009 at 6:11am:
Thanks for the info. I'll try these settings on my system soon to confirm. did you have HT enabled or disabled?


Disable HT. Im interested to know how it works for you.
 

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Reply #3 - Feb 23rd, 2009 at 7:36am

Wingo   Offline
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Might be a week or so. I'm STILL waiting for my mobo back from warranty that was sent back over a month ago, but it should be back soon.
 

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Reply #4 - Feb 23rd, 2009 at 10:50am

NickN   Offline
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Disable HT.. I have confirmation from a Aces source FSX makes absolutely no use of HT what so ever. HT enabled in the BIOS for video encoding and other software which may take advantage of it.. otherwise disable the function because all it does is heat up the proc

 
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Reply #5 - Feb 23rd, 2009 at 4:18pm

stevehookem   Offline
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Jim and I were on the phone working through a lot of this last night. Since our systems are essentially the same I can confirm that my best settings are:

FRAME RATE LOCKED at 28
TBM = 90
No affinity mask
BufferPools = 100000000

I have 28 for framerate since this comes closest to dividing into my projector's refresh rate. I don't know if that matters but I'm flying better than I ever have now! Smooth as glass.

I have the level-d 767 flying a real time flight from ATL to IAH now at 34000 feet. Frames aren't moving off 27.9 (28) and the terrain is flowing underneath just like it really looks.

I'm running the MCP-Pro off the GPS and I feel like I should be riding in the back! Nice and smooth.....
 

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Reply #6 - Feb 24th, 2009 at 12:11am

SubZer0   Offline
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Steve, as I posted in your thread in the hardware section, my settings are exactly the same. what did it was the bufferpools at 100000000. textures loading quite nicely as well, which was always a problem before. thanks!
 
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Reply #7 - Feb 24th, 2009 at 8:16am

stevehookem   Offline
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All credit goes to Nick for the great guides and Jim for the bufferpool entry suggestion!

I tried every amount from 35mil to 80mil before going with 100000000.
 

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Reply #8 - Feb 24th, 2009 at 12:29pm

NickN   Offline
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Whats happening with this BP value on the larger memory cards is for some reason it is reducing the latency on the PCIe x16 buss. Its not that the amount reserved is doing anything IN FSX.. it seems to be having a positive effect on the PCIe buss dropping the latency and allowing no lag in communication


Looking further into this however I think it is somthing in combination with how FSX works and the chipset itself. This is being seen on P35, x38, x48 and x58 chipsets and the 1GB Nvidia cards




 
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Reply #9 - Feb 24th, 2009 at 10:32pm

jwenham   Offline
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stevehookem wrote on Feb 24th, 2009 at 8:16am:
All credit goes to Nick for the great guides and Jim for the bufferpool entry suggestion!

I tried every amount from 35mil to 80mil before going with 100000000.


Hey Steve, try setting your scenery complexity to very dense and autogen at very dense as well. I was getting small stutters at larger airports and set my settings to very dense for both and man alive did it smooth out more. I would almost say it is darn near perfect.  Smiley

Here are my current right hand scenery slider and traffic settings:

Scenery Complexity = VERY DENSE
Autogen = VERY DENSE
Airline Traffic = 59 (Ultimate Traffic w/gate activation deactivated)
GA = 59 (Ultimate Traffic)
Cars = 15
Boats = 20

TBM and BufferPools still set at 90 for TBM and 100000000 for BufferPools

Try it out and let me know what you think as it made a world of difference for me.
 

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Reply #10 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 8:23am

stevehookem   Offline
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I'll try it!

It's been very smooth so far though. I thought frame rate drops were normal on the ground at any airport. I know that my frames are always lower as I takeoff even though it still looks smooth. I do see a few quick "bursts" of stutter. Hopefully this is the trick.
 

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Reply #11 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 11:26am

stevehookem   Offline
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When I take scenery complexity down to very dense, I actually get lower frame rates than when it is up all the way. I have SC all the way and autogen=dense. Visually, I cannot see any difference between dense and very dense with autogen but it does affect the stutters.

Very, very happy with this system now! It flies like a real plane!
 

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Reply #12 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 12:34pm

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hey guys. if you don't mind, I'd like for you to run a quick test to see how your systems manage large amounts of autogen trees. the reason I ask is because I do a lot of bush flying and I'm always around large, forested areas. my system at this point begins to stutter a lot and all smoothness disappears. I set the autogen density down to very dense and it still doesn't help, but setting it to dense finally does the job... it's not that big of a problem, but if you don't mind I'd like to see how your systems react to this. I have the same settings as you TBM 90 and BP 100000000 locked at 28.

for the test location, PAKT (Ketchikan Intl') is a good place. just to the West or Southwest of the airport you'll notice hills and a LOT of trees. fly over the area in low altitude and see how your systems react to this. I want to see if it's normal for the stutters to happen even at "very dense" autogen settings or if it's just my system that falls apart at this point Grin

let me know what happens if you do decide to try it... thanks!

Andy
 
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Reply #13 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 1:09pm

stevehookem   Offline
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what plane do you use to fly this?
 

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Reply #14 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 4:08pm

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Baron 58
 
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Reply #15 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 4:45pm

NickN   Offline
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I know that area and I know what the problem is

you are butting heads with a 'butthead' at Aces that designed the tree tiles.

Problem.. .there is no AG marked on those tiles.. instead the lazy sonofa... just told the sim to render the MAX trees on every single tile designed specifically for trees.. that means 4500 freakin trees per tile. If thee are 10 tiles with trees in your scenery radius that means 45 thousand trees with the system caching outside the SR.. before SP1 the system had hundreds of thousands of trees on the footprint. They switch to batch call for SP1/SP2 which helped a lot but the design problem is still there

idiot

All he had to do was make tiles that supported a few clearings and mark the clearings for no trees.. it adds up fast. If you were to remove just 15% of the trees per tile thats almost 7000 objects not being looked at by the CPU and video system on a 100% SR.

Ok, so dont try to go crazy making it work... drop the AG a notch and forget it. Until a complete redesign of the tree system can be made it will be an issue. We do have an idea how to fix this but the main problem is the IDIOT also gave us no way to tell the sim to switch trees to the 'exact' right type for the location the tile is playing if we assign tree locations manually

It will switch but your totally limited to choices that may not look right since the same tiles are used all over the world everywhere!

They made the tree system generic in a utterly lazy way


Sorry.. but this is one duckup I have absolutely no sympathy for and will call this one as I see it


In some places you can fix this with landclass.. if the LC removes the trees above the alpine line as it should you get the smooth perf back

I dont know of any LC that changes the are in question here.
 
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Reply #16 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 5:01pm

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thanks for the explanation Nick. that ticks me off as well now that I understand why it does that around such areas. it makes me want to become some crazy computer engineer/programer to fix all the crap that some of the Aces guys such as this mother flower did. hopefully a solution to this will be found in the future.

Steve, thanks for offering to test your system anyways. we now know what we have to unfortunately deal with Undecided
 
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Reply #17 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 5:13pm

NickN   Offline
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you can try adding just the tree restriction line to the config.. set it for
TERRAIN

TERRAIN_MAX_AUTOGEN_TREES_PER_CELL=3800

I dont like adding that as it does throw off the priority system but give it a shot and see if it helps
 
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Reply #18 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 5:15pm

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wouldn't that throw off the sim priority and potentially cause other problems?
 
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Reply #19 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 5:20pm

NickN   Offline
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SubZer0 wrote on Feb 25th, 2009 at 5:15pm:
wouldn't that throw off the sim priority and potentially cause other problems?



They added that hook to the DLLs becuse they knew what they ducked-up. As I said, I dont like using it and I would never use the building restriction line however if you are one that flys areas like that and need the relief it may be of benefit over the potential problem

I have not really tested what I posted so I dont know if it would work or not.. just doing the AG bandwidth math in my head gave me that number for the line. It may work fine and not be an issue elsewhere

 
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Reply #20 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 5:45pm

jwenham   Offline
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NickN wrote on Feb 25th, 2009 at 4:45pm:
I know that area and I know what the problem is

you are butting heads with a 'butthead' at Aces that designed the tree tiles.

Problem.. .there is no AG marked on those tiles.. instead the lazy sonofa... just told the sim to render the MAX trees on every single tile designed specifically for trees.. that means 4500 freakin trees per tile. If thee are 10 tiles with trees in your scenery radius that means 45 thousand trees with the system caching outside the SR.. before SP1 the system had hundreds of thousands of trees on the footprint. They switch to batch call for SP1/SP2 which helped a lot but the design problem is still there

idiot

All he had to do was make tiles that supported a few clearings and mark the clearings for no trees.. it adds up fast. If you were to remove just 15% of the trees per tile thats almost 7000 objects not being looked at by the CPU and video system on a 100% SR.

Ok, so dont try to go crazy making it work... drop the AG a notch and forget it. Until a complete redesign of the tree system can be made it will be an issue. We do have an idea how to fix this but the main problem is the IDIOT also gave us no way to tell the sim to switch trees to the 'exact' right type for the location the tile is playing if we assign tree locations manually

It will switch but your totally limited to choices that may not look right since the same tiles are used all over the world everywhere!

They made the tree system generic in a utterly lazy way


Sorry.. but this is one duckup I have absolutely no sympathy for and will call this one as I see it


In some places you can fix this with landclass.. if the LC removes the trees above the alpine line as it should you get the smooth perf back

I dont know of any LC that changes the are in question here.


I can confirm that Nick. If you remember I posted about the same issue at KASE (Aspen). Dropping it to Dense did fix it as well as did the tree max tweek which allows us to keep the buildings as is. I did get UTX and have also added Scenery Tech LC. Those add ons did fix the issue in that area without me making any slider or cfg tweeks.

To the OP, I did the run in the Barron and well ... I think we all know the conclusion to that movie. At least there is an easy solution to it and all we have to do is move a slider 1 or two notches. Very dense was not all that bad but dense was best and MAX just plaine sucked!


 

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Reply #21 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 5:51pm

NickN   Offline
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In reality and knowing how much bandwidth the sim reserves for AG trees (20%) the real value for MAX per cell is about 3000 trees with 100% AG slider

Problem is I know that would probably cause more problems in other areas

You guys should test with a lower TBM and BP setting in this area and see what happens as well.. you may have set up for one type of flying but ducked yourself in trees

Try TBM 80, BP 70000000 frame lock 30 and MAX TREES PER CELL at 3300 on 100% AG and see what happens
 
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Reply #22 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 6:21pm

jwenham   Offline
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NickN wrote on Feb 25th, 2009 at 5:51pm:
In reality and knowing how much bandwidth the sim reserves for AG trees (20%) the real value for MAX per cell is about 3000 trees with 100% AG slider

Problem is I know that would probably cause more problems in other areas

You guys should test with a lower TBM and BP setting in this area and see what happens as well.. you may have set up for one type of flying but ducked yourself in trees

Try TBM 80, BP 70000000 frame lock 30 and MAX TREES PER CELL at 3300 on 100% AG and see what happens


OK, I'll let you know what happens.
 

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Reply #23 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 6:45pm

jwenham   Offline
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It was better but still stutter/surges. At times it was very smooth but look in the wrong direction and bump bump bump. Frames were remained high durring the flight.

...

 

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Reply #24 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 7:00pm

stevehookem   Offline
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Not to change the subject but I just had a horrible flight from JFK to LaGuardia. Frames dropped to 9-12 and constant stuttering. I've been flying in and out of big airports and have never had this poor of performance since getting everything else set-up correctly.

I'm a little bummed.
 

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Reply #25 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 7:07pm

NickN   Offline
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jwenham wrote on Feb 25th, 2009 at 6:45pm:
It was better but still stutter/surges. At times it was very smooth but look in the wrong direction and bump bump bump. Frames were remained high durring the flight.





ok, now bump TBM and BP back up and leave the trees restricted to 3300 and try again


The bottom line is those restriction lines really do mess up the priority system so its really best to just run without the tweaks in the config and just bump the AG slider down to compensate for the aces mess.

 
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Reply #26 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 7:09pm

jwenham   Offline
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AH yes. Possibly one of the hardest areas on the sim. If you want to fly there you will need to massage the sliders till your happy. Might need to take the SC down to Dense.
 

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Reply #27 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 7:10pm

NickN   Offline
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stevehookem wrote on Feb 25th, 2009 at 7:00pm:
Not to change the subject but I just had a horrible flight from JFK to LaGuardia. Frames dropped to 9-12 and constant stuttering. I've been flying in and out of big airports and have never had this poor of performance since getting everything else set-up correctly.

I'm a little bummed.


well... figure out whats going on... did you try working the scenery complexity, AG and AL/GA traffic and/or airport vehicles?.. all of those items are hard hitting in NYC

Cars, especially with UTX are killer. I dont ever let those go above 8 which is where they stay locked everywhere

If you are saying you have taken this same flight and it was smooth then something changed

there is no 1 size fits all with this sim... NYC is a hell of an area.. just becuse you get it working in Seattle does not mean NYC will run the same.
 
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Reply #28 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 7:17pm

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NickN wrote on Feb 25th, 2009 at 7:07pm:
jwenham wrote on Feb 25th, 2009 at 6:45pm:
It was better but still stutter/surges. At times it was very smooth but look in the wrong direction and bump bump bump. Frames were remained high durring the flight.





ok, now bump TBM and BP back up and leave the trees restricted to 3300 and try again


The bottom line is those restriction lines really do mess up the priority system so its really best to just run without the tweaks in the config and just bump the AG slider down to compensate for the aces mess.



No go Nick. I had to set the trees at 2500 to get smooth with the AG @ 100% . Much better results just notching down the slider. Its a cryin shame cuz all them trees sure do look perty. Cry
 

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Reply #29 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 8:29pm

NickN   Offline
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then just leave the tweak out of the config.. we may not be able to attack the tree problem till the first patch for GEX EU but we are going to try

 
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Reply #30 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 9:10pm

jwenham   Offline
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NickN wrote on Feb 25th, 2009 at 8:29pm:
then just leave the tweak out of the config.. we may not be able to attack the tree problem till the first patch for GEX EU but we are going to try




Fair enough, at least we tried.
 

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Reply #31 - Feb 25th, 2009 at 9:30pm

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thank you all very much for the time and help. believe me it's appreciated Smiley

hey, there's not a lot of buildings in bush flying anyways, right?  Wink no big deal
 
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Reply #32 - May 19th, 2009 at 8:10am

Axelb9   Offline
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First of all I would like to say a hello to everybody as this is my first post here. Also my apologies for unearthing this relatively older thread however I have just made one with a very similar problem of mine over at simforums.com. (if anyone cares to read it here it goes: http://www.simforums.com/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=30471

So my questions is: can it be concluded that even on your beefed up overclocked I7 systems with modern graphics cards and 64bit OS it is a dream to have a stutterfree experience over dense forested areas on anything more then dense AG setting?

Because if it is so than I stop dreaming. Too bad I have upgraded my system to achieve this...

Thank you,

Alex

------------------
Core I7-940
OCZ 3Gb DDR3-1600
WD Velociraptor 300 Gb for FSX
Asus P6B Deluxe V2
Nvidia 8800GTS 512 GPU
750W Chieftain PSU
Akasa Nero AK air cooling
 
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Reply #33 - May 19th, 2009 at 3:07pm

NickN   Offline
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Axelb9 wrote on May 19th, 2009 at 8:10am:
First of all I would like to say a hello to everybody as this is my first post here. Also my apologies for unearthing this relatively older thread however I have just made one with a very similar problem of mine over at simforums.com. (if anyone cares to read it here it goes: http://www.simforums.com/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=30471

So my questions is: can it be concluded that even on your beefed up overclocked I7 systems with modern graphics cards and 64bit OS it is a dream to have a stutterfree experience over dense forested areas on anything more then dense AG setting?

Because if it is so than I stop dreaming. Too bad I have upgraded my system to achieve this...





answered at Simforums
 
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