Simviation Forum - Tragedy in New York

Feb 13^th, 2009 at 1:48am

BigTruck Offline
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There wasn't a river close enough to save this one Cry

http://www.buffalonews.com/home/story/577959.html

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Reply #1 - Feb 13^th, 2009 at 9:37am

Alrot Ex Member
I Love Simviation.

Oh darm!

I( just saw it on TV.) was a turboprop ,and seems was by the weather Cry

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/US/02/13/plane.crash.new.york/index.html?iref=mpstor...

EDIT: was one of this a bombardier q400
http://www.aerospace-technology.com/projects/dash8/images/Q400_1.jpg

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Reply #2 - Feb 13^th, 2009 at 1:32pm

Steve M Offline
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Saw this this morning before work. Tragic, one witness said the engines were sputtering as the plane passed over.

Flying with twins is a lot of fun..

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Reply #3 - Feb 13^th, 2009 at 2:37pm

ozzy72 Offline
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Pretty scary huh?
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A true and awful tragedy. I hope that an answer is swift in coming on this Cry

There are two types of aeroplane, Spitfires and everything else that wishes it was a Spitfire!

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Reply #4 - Feb 13^th, 2009 at 2:49pm

flyboy 28 Offline
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Jacksonville, FL

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There was a report not too long ago that it had been two years without a fatal crash for commercial aviation in the United States. Couldn't keep it up forever, I guess. Undecided

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Reply #5 - Feb 13^th, 2009 at 3:52pm

Steve M Offline
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Cambridge On.

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I heard another clue in this news release. The engines went silent before the crash?

http://news.sympatico.msn.ctv.ca/abc/home/contentposting.aspx?isfa=1&feedname=CT...

Flying with twins is a lot of fun..

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Reply #6 - Feb 13^th, 2009 at 4:03pm

Hagar Offline
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Quote:

one witness said the engines were sputtering as the plane passed over.

Quote:

I heard another clue in this news release. The engines went silent before the crash?

I wouldn't take much notice of eye-witness reports. They're usually unreliable. Media interviewers are very good at asking leading questions & they end up saying things they don't really mean.

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Reply #7 - Feb 13^th, 2009 at 4:08pm

skoker Offline
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Jordan never wore his
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N200WQ a Q400 inbound runway 23 opperated by Colgan.

I stayed up till 3A.M. Watching the TV. Once they let us I am going to see the extent of the damage... Cry

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Reply #8 - Feb 13^th, 2009 at 6:33pm

expat Offline
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It appears that they are looking at ice build up on the aircraft. That is the problem with large turboprop, ATR, Dash and alike. You have to wait for the ice to build up before it can be got rid off. I spannered on ATR 42 and 72's for nearly 5 years, the biggest pain was de-icer (note, not anti ice) boots.

Matt

PETA People Eating Tasty Animals.

B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400

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Reply #9 - Feb 14^th, 2009 at 12:20pm

Fozzer Offline
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An elderly FS 2004 addict!
Hereford. England. EGBS.

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expat wrote on Feb 13^th, 2009 at 6:33pm:

It appears that they are looking at ice build up on the aircraft. That is the problem with large turboprop, ATR, Dash and alike. You have to wait for the ice to build up before it can be got rid off. I spannered on ATR 42 and 72's for nearly 5 years, the biggest pain was de-icer (note, not anti ice) boots.

Matt

...and the latest News from the BBC...

Ice build up....>>>>

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7889764.stm

Paul...G-BPLF.. Cool

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Reply #10 - Feb 15^th, 2009 at 2:27am

tcco94 Offline
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Ive been hearing alot more of airplane crashes then usual.
Its not to good. Embarrassed

Sincerely, Tyler

www.tylerconnell.com
http://www.phoenixva.org/index.php/profile/view/PVA1557

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Reply #11 - Feb 15^th, 2009 at 3:01pm

aussiewannabe Offline
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As I don't want to start a new thread, I'll add this:

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6264553.html

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Reply #12 - Feb 15^th, 2009 at 7:33pm

skoker Offline
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Jordan never wore his
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aussiewannabe wrote on Feb 15^th, 2009 at 3:01pm:

As I don't want to start a new thread, I'll add this:

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6264553.html

I have a friend that works with COEX and he said that the AP on off during landing in bad weather is common practice only when icing is occuring. It's just easier to land that way.

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Reply #13 - Feb 16^th, 2009 at 12:48pm

beaky Offline
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skoker wrote on Feb 15^th, 2009 at 7:33pm:

aussiewannabe wrote on Feb 15^th, 2009 at 3:01pm:

As I don't want to start a new thread, I'll add this:

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6264553.html

I have a friend that works with COEX and he said that the AP on off during landing in bad weather is common practice only when icing is occuring. It's just easier to land that way.

It seems, at his point, like another one of those accidents where the crew just didn't know exactly what was wrong. If the tailplane had ice on it, they wouldn't know until they disconnected the AP, even when configured for landing. With the AP trimming away as they slowed up and dirtied up, they probably lost airflow over the tail before they could even think about turning of the AP. Once the tail stops flying on a plane like that, yu're finished unless you have a lot of altitude, which they didn't.
I'm not sure if they had seen any accumulation elsewhere on the plane... in that case, it may have been wise to start in manual mode much earlier, when they were higher and faster and had more options.

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Reply #14 - Feb 16^th, 2009 at 10:10pm

Al_Fallujah Ex Member

I am not going to take any guesses myself, much too novice a pilot.

I have heard icing, engine sputtering, one NTSB person mentioned a flat spin, because it landed belly down, facing the opposite direction of the flight path.

Another mention was wild attiude changes, including almost inverted flight.

Another article suggested the passengers and crew were up against 2Gs toward the end.

I have added their souls to my prayers.

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