Simviation Forum - Download Illegality

Aug 5^th, 2008 at 9:14pm

Mass Offline
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Midlands, UK

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Hey.

Just for the record i dont condone or participate in illegal downloading of any sort, or am suggesting that in any case it should be made legal, but have a query if anyone knows the answer.

I was just wondering, a thought train prompted by another thread, if a company has gone out of business, making it impossible to purchase properly any of their products, would these illegal download methods then become legal? For example the PSS airbusses. Pss have gone out of business so you cannot purchase their products, so would you be allowed to download them any other way? Or would the same EULAs and laws still remain meaning that if you didnt purchase it while they were in business then you missed you chance, basically?

Sorry bit of a rambling question there.

Danny

p.s. i hope this doesnt start any arguments or issues at all! Undecided

&&&&"when the rich wage war its the poor who die"

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Reply #1 - Aug 5^th, 2008 at 9:52pm

Ravang Ex Member

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As far as I know if they created it, it is their property. But if its older payware it may have became freeway, like Simtech Beechcraft Staggerwing thats on this site was payware but now its freeware. But you could see if you could contact someone from the company, maybe they would give you the plane? Undecided

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Reply #2 - Aug 6^th, 2008 at 6:02am

Mass Offline
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Midlands, UK

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Oh its not that i actually want the aircraft, as far as the A320 family goes im happy with the IFDG stuff, and i already owned the A330 and A340 of theirs.

Im just asking through interest really, its a situation that confuses me is all.

Cheers
Danny

&&&&"when the rich wage war its the poor who die"

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Reply #3 - Aug 6^th, 2008 at 11:25am

beaky Offline
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Just a guess, but it may depend on the duration of the copyright, regardless of whether or not the designer still sells it.

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Reply #4 - Aug 6^th, 2008 at 5:36pm

C Offline
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Earth

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I'll use the analogy of MG Rover going bust a few years ago...

...and I didn't see then opening up Upper Heyford airfield and letting everyone have free-for-all on all thousands of cars stored there... Wink

The other issue with PSS in particular, is some of their products are still available in boxed and download (Just Flight) versions. In short, unless they're officially re-released as freeware, you're on dodgy ground.

In fact I've just checked. The PSS A320, 757, 777, Concorde, Vulcan, Dash 8 and A340 are all still available in download and boxed version from Just Flight.

The dodgy ground is very dodgy indeed.

Just Flight - PSS A320 Professional

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Reply #5 - Aug 6^th, 2008 at 6:55pm

Mass Offline
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Midlands, UK

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Oh right i didnt know they were still on sale elsewhere.

I already own what i want from when they were in business, but it was just a query as to what the law would state in such a situation.

&&&&"when the rich wage war its the poor who die"

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Reply #6 - Aug 7^th, 2008 at 1:59am

Vodka Burner Ex Member

You can try searching on publishing websites like Flight1 and simmarket.

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Reply #7 - Aug 11^th, 2008 at 6:42pm

Tom... Offline
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The copyright is still present on the companys products even if they cease to be, this issue was brought up when Fs Nav close down...im sure Fozzer can elaborate a bit..

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Reply #8 - Aug 20^th, 2008 at 10:33am

JBaymore Offline
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Copyright duration extends for the life of that particular legal protection, regardless of the fact whether the company that produced the product exists anymore or not. Likely, if the copyright was done well, there are provisions in the legal definitions of the owner that move the copyright from the company name to the individuals developer's names if the company ceases to exist before the copyright ends.

The decision to release a former copyrighted payware product into the public domain (out of the bounds of copyright) is the copyright holder's perogative alone. If he/she so desire, they would have made that information public and released a "freeware" file set.

It is not for others to decide on this one. Only the copyright holder can make that decision. If they don't want to release it.... that is their perogative. Weird........ but fully legal.

best,

...................john

Intel i7 960 quad 3.2G LGA 1366, Asus P6X58D Premium, 750W Corsair, 6 gig 1600 DDR3, Spinpoint 1TB 7200 HD, Caviar 500G 7200 HD, GTX275 1280M, Logitec Z640, Win7 Pro 64b, CH Products yoke, pedals + throttle quad, simpit

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Reply #9 - Aug 20^th, 2008 at 11:28am

Fozzer Offline
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An elderly FS 2004 addict!
Hereford. England. EGBS.

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Tom... wrote on Aug 11^th, 2008 at 6:42pm:

The copyright is still present on the companys products even if they cease to be, this issue was brought up when Fs Nav close down...im sure Fozzer can elaborate a bit..

From what I can remember, FS Navigator was never released as a "Freeware" version for the life of the program, even after the demise of FS Navigator.
I am one of the lucky ones who purchased it legally before it was withdrawn, and I own my Program and Key in perpetuity....
....saved on my CD, and will be buried with me...so there!... Wink

..

....!

Paul....

...!

Dell Dimension 5000 BTX Tower. Win7 Home Edition, 32 Bit. Intel Pentium 4, dual 2.8 GHz. 2.5GB RAM, nVidia GF 9500GT 1GB. SATA 500GB + 80GB. Philips 17" LCD Monitor. Micronet ADSL Modem only. Saitek Cyborg Evo Force. FS 2004 + FSX. Briggs and Stratton Petrol Lawn Mower...Motor Bikes. Gas Cooker... and lots of musical instruments!.... ...!
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Reply #10 - Aug 26^th, 2008 at 5:16pm

gryshnak Offline
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JBaymore wrote on Aug 20^th, 2008 at 10:33am:

It is not for others to decide on this one. Only the copyright holder can make that decision. If they don't want to release it.... that is their perogative. Weird........ but fully legal.

I believe that's what Tom Wood did with the excellent SimTECH Fokker Dr.1 Triplane plus several others, making them freeware once the company had sadly closed. (Are we okay to mention other site names here? Google for "simt_dr1.zip" and you'll find it).

Edit: the download page includes this note: "There will be no support on this add-on, all copyrights still apply. By Tom Wood/simTECH Flight Design Ltd."

Gryshnak

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Reply #11 - Sep 2^nd, 2008 at 5:53am

JeeS Offline
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beaky wrote on Aug 6^th, 2008 at 11:25am:

Just a guess, but it may depend on the duration of the copyright, regardless of whether or not the designer still sells it.

Yes I also believe this may depend on the duration of copyright .

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Reply #12 - Sep 3^rd, 2008 at 9:33am

JBaymore Offline
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Under the curse of the
hombuilt cockpit!

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The short answer for recent works...... author's lifetime plus a potential additional 70 years.

Everything you might want to know about copyright duration:

http://www.bitlaw.com/copyright/duration.html

best,

....................john

Intel i7 960 quad 3.2G LGA 1366, Asus P6X58D Premium, 750W Corsair, 6 gig 1600 DDR3, Spinpoint 1TB 7200 HD, Caviar 500G 7200 HD, GTX275 1280M, Logitec Z640, Win7 Pro 64b, CH Products yoke, pedals + throttle quad, simpit

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