Search the archive:
Simviation Main Site
|
Site Search
|
Upload Images
Simviation Forum
›
Real World
›
Autos
› F1 GP Monaco: Your predictions
(Moderators: Mitch., Fly2e, ozzy72, beaky, Clipper, JBaymore, Bob70, BigTruck)
‹
Previous Topic
|
Next Topic
›
Pages:
1
F1 GP Monaco: Your predictions (Read 2246 times)
May 19
th
, 2008 at 3:24am
CD.
Ex Member
Monte Carlo this weekend lads, tight and twisting.. it favoured the McLarens last year, can they repeat it this time?
Can we get a perfect 30 for the third race in a row?
Entries close at 1200 BST Saturday
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #1 -
May 19
th
, 2008 at 3:25am
CD.
Ex Member
1: Kovalainen
2: Raikkonen
3: Hamilton
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #2 -
May 19
th
, 2008 at 6:38am
Craig.
Offline
Colonel
Birmingham
Gender:
Posts: 18590
Raikonnen
Hamilton
Kovalainen
Yes thats about as risky as it gets, but I think if anyone can do the monaco usual of putting an average car onto the podium, it'll fred in the Renault.
«
Last Edit: May 22
nd
, 2008 at 5:33am by Craig.
»
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #3 -
May 19
th
, 2008 at 10:21am
cspyro21
Offline
Colonel
MOUSTACHE PENGUIN
SPARTAAA
Posts: 5558
Hamilton
Raikonnen
Kovalainen
^Click Me For Studio V!^
Air Training Corps Cadet Feb 06 - June 08
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #4 -
May 19
th
, 2008 at 11:10am
Celtman
Offline
Colonel
Where has all the Marmalade
gone?
Warrington
Gender:
Posts: 645
Hamilton
Kovalainen
Raikkonen
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #5 -
May 19
th
, 2008 at 11:42am
todayshorse
Offline
Colonel
'Ten Thousand Blister.....'
England
Gender:
Posts: 2806
Hamilton
Kova
Kubica
No ferraris you may ask! I know Kimi was quick in testing 'monaco spec' but they have to have a bad day once this season and the way hamilton drove here last year, i hope this might be that bad day.....(not counting Oz, they just messed that up!)
I do wonder how many safety cars we might have though, and i read over on the aurtosport forums, showers just might be forecast...
Cant wait!
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #6 -
May 19
th
, 2008 at 6:21pm
Craig.
Offline
Colonel
Birmingham
Gender:
Posts: 18590
todayshorse wrote
on May 19
th
, 2008 at 11:42am:
Hamilton
Kova
Kubica
No ferraris you may ask! I know Kimi was quick in testing 'monaco spec' but they have to have a bad day once this season and the way hamilton drove here last year, i hope this might be that bad day.....(not counting Oz, they just messed that up!)
I do wonder how many safety cars we might have though, and i read over on the aurtosport forums, showers just might be forecast...
Cant wait!
the biggest problem with how Hamilton drove last year was the fact that he pushed hard the whole race, hit the walls on numerous occasions and still couldn't match Alonso's pace even when Fred was backing off. This was also the race where tensions started between fred and lewis because despite being told to back off Lewis kept pushing and ignored his teams orders. This is where I lost my interest in him as a driver, the team aswell as everyone else could see he was trying to push too hard and as evidenced by his wall collisions came close to wrecking it several times. They needed to bring both cars home safely and he could have thrown it away for no reason.
This years Mclaren has a longer wheel base and the Ferrari has a shorter wheel base, they are about the same now thus evening the advantage out in that respect. The biggest plus Mclaren has is the heating in the tyres, so they should aim to lock out the front row no matter what. Even if it means they have to pit a few laps earlier. It'll take the ferrari's at least 3 to 4 laps more than the mclarens to get their tyres up to temp, that will give mclaren 4 laps to build up the advantage they need to overcome the lack of fuel. The first stop should be used again to keep track position and keep an eye on the ferrari's. Kimi especially does his work before the second stop to pass the guy he's chasing afterwards. Mclaren should see that and as such have the guy infront of Kimi slow him down enough to allow the guy out front the chance to run off for a fairly easy victory.
That's just a personal point of view as to how I'm sure the macca guys would like it to work out in an ideal world.
I'd expect them to go harder tyres twice then softs to finish with, the ferrari's will probably go soft option twice then finish on the hard tyres.
Personally if I were the strategy guy at ferrari, I'd split the runs, soft hard then soft to keep up with the pace to begin, get the longer middle phase out the way on the harder tyres so they can push hard at the end of the stint, and then use the softs again to finish so as to keep the presure on if they are still behind that way aim to push possibly Lewis into making a mistake.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #7 -
May 20
th
, 2008 at 2:46am
eno
Offline
Colonel
Why you shouldn't light
your farts!!
Derbyshire UK
Posts: 7802
Kovi
Lewis
Kimi
Tis about time the McLarens had a 1-2.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #8 -
May 20
th
, 2008 at 2:59am
todayshorse
Offline
Colonel
'Ten Thousand Blister.....'
England
Gender:
Posts: 2806
Interesting point of view Craig!
Whatever the wrongs and rights as to what happened at monaco last year, the way Hamilton took that car through the 'swimming pool' complex was simply breathtaking to watch. I like to see someone get hold of the car by the scruff of the neck and give it a damn good thrashing, rather than tootle around.
Yes he stuffed it in practice or qualifying (i cant remember which) but i dont think hes 'overdriving' like some suggest - its just the way he drives. I cant fault the bloke for 'giving it a go' and id fully expect fred to be quicker last year given the circumstances. That Hamilton ran him pretty close was not too bad an acheivement considering it was his first time there in an F1 car..
He drove similar at the last GP, the way he was going into turn one was quite somthing. Light on fuel or whatever, i dont care, it was
great to watch
We were sat on the exit of becketts at the British gp last year, and despite Hamiltons 'go for pole' set up and strategy, it was massively satisfying to see him and him alone come through that section with the back end dancing all over. You could visibly see it, and it was fantastic. Certainly not every lap, i caught it maybe two or three times - and yes, he didnt win, and yes, he went the wrong way on set up, but it was still good to
watch
I cant wait for practice to begin now they have no T/C - it should be spectacular!
I suppose its like prost v mansell - prost never looked spectacular, mansell always (usualy!) looked committed, spectacular and 'giving it some' and i know which i preferred - despite 'le proffessuers' greater sucess.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #9 -
May 20
th
, 2008 at 1:23pm
HawkerTempest5
Offline
Colonel
Hawker Tempest MK V
United Kingdom
Gender:
Posts: 3149
The ITV bunch have been telling us since the season began the Lewis would win Monaco, so if ITV say he'll win, who am I to argue?
Hamilton
Raikonnen
Kovalainen
He'll probably finish out of the points or in the wall now.
Flying Legends
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #10 -
May 21
st
, 2008 at 3:26pm
Mynameisnemo
Ex Member
Hamilton
Raikonnen
Kovalainen
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #11 -
May 22
nd
, 2008 at 5:34am
Craig.
Offline
Colonel
Birmingham
Gender:
Posts: 18590
just changed my alonso pick to Kovi. If this isn't allowed I'll change it back.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #12 -
May 22
nd
, 2008 at 3:07pm
expat
Offline
Colonel
Deep behind enemy lines!
Gender:
Posts: 8499
Hamilton
Kovalainen
Rosberg
My Ferrari Voodoo must start working sometime
Matt
PETA
People Eating Tasty Animals.
B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #13 -
May 22
nd
, 2008 at 3:24pm
CD.
Ex Member
Craig. wrote
on May 22
nd
, 2008 at 5:34am:
just changed my alonso pick to Kovi. If this isn't allowed I'll change it back.
Change as much as you like until the competition closes
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #14 -
May 23
rd
, 2008 at 11:53am
The Ruptured Duck
Offline
Colonel
Legally sane since yesterday!
Wichita, KS
Gender:
Posts: 2614
Hamilton
Kimi
Kovi
"If you would not be forgotten, as soon as you are dead and rotten, either write things worth reading, or do things worth the writing" -Ben Franklin&&&&"Man must rise above the Earth to the top of the atmosphere and beyond, for only thus will he fully understand the world in which he lives." - Socrates&&&&" Flying is a religion. A religion that asymilates all who get a taste of it." - Me&&&&"Make the most out of yourself, for that is all there is of you"- Ralf Waldo Emerson&&
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #15 -
May 23
rd
, 2008 at 3:39pm
Mictheslik
Offline
Colonel
Me in G-LFSM :D
Bristol, England
Gender:
Posts: 6011
Hamilton
Kimi
Massa
.mic
[center]
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #16 -
May 24
th
, 2008 at 9:31am
todayshorse
Offline
Colonel
'Ten Thousand Blister.....'
England
Gender:
Posts: 2806
well that wasnt expected...! Wonder if the ferraris are running a little lighter than the macs, just to get the pole?
Still, if they are, and the macs can hang on in the first stint, id still expect a mac 1-2, but i guess anything can happen, especially at monaco. If they are similar or indeed heavier, then i fear my prediction is totaly wrong
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #17 -
May 24
th
, 2008 at 11:21am
C
Offline
Colonel
Earth
Posts: 13144
Quote:
Entries close at 1200 BST Saturday
Poo.
Body's still on USA ET (hence most of my recent posts were very early in the UK's morning!)
I would have predicted Hamilton, Heikki and Kubica anyway, if "them there incharge" were being generous!
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #18 -
May 24
th
, 2008 at 3:24pm
Craig.
Offline
Colonel
Birmingham
Gender:
Posts: 18590
todayshorse wrote
on May 24
th
, 2008 at 9:31am:
well that wasnt expected...! Wonder if the ferraris are running a little lighter than the macs, just to get the pole?
Still, if they are, and the macs can hang on in the first stint, id still expect a mac 1-2, but i guess anything can happen, especially at monaco. If they are similar or indeed heavier, then i fear my prediction is totaly wrong
I am thinking Kimi is the same or heavier than the maccas, The Q2 and practice times were simmilar so they cant be too differant. Massa though is the wildcard here. He was off the pace all weekend, if he is within 2 laps of fuel of the Mclarens or even Kimi, then its going to worry Ron and co.
The weather is the big X-factor in the whole situation. If it rains I could see both Kimi and Heikki doing very well, lewis would have to change his style because tail happy wont work round monaco in the rain. If it stays dry, I could see the usual Kimi Massa switch in the pitstops and then a fight between Lewis and Heikki for 3rd with Rosberg just behind waiting for a mistake.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #19 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 4:28am
todayshorse
Offline
Colonel
'Ten Thousand Blister.....'
England
Gender:
Posts: 2806
Hmm if it does indeed rain, Kimi yes, hed probably be there at the end near the front, Massa in the barriers, Hamilton i think could adapt no problem.
Any ideas on the forecast or what its doing right now?
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #20 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 6:17am
Craig.
Offline
Colonel
Birmingham
Gender:
Posts: 18590
at the moment it is a wet race.. But if the clouds and that clear then it'll dry out pretty quickly I think.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #21 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 6:24am
todayshorse
Offline
Colonel
'Ten Thousand Blister.....'
England
Gender:
Posts: 2806
Ive been looking at some rubbish webcams from monaco, some appear to show it is indeed wet, others seem bathed in sunshine! One says its 'local time 22.30' or somthing. What a load of garbage!
And they take forever to load as well......
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #22 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 10:03am
Celtman
Offline
Colonel
Where has all the Marmalade
gone?
Warrington
Gender:
Posts: 645
Poor Sutil, Raikkonen destroyed his chances. Great race though!
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #23 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 10:19am
Craig.
Offline
Colonel
Birmingham
Gender:
Posts: 18590
sometimes I guess its better to be lucky than good
well done to Lewis good drive despite the mistake. Poor poor Sutil, Kimi I think found the exact same spot as DC did in quali where he dropped it. If nothing else as a way to say sorry ferrari should give him a test drive at silverstone.
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #24 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 10:32am
Craig.
Offline
Colonel
Birmingham
Gender:
Posts: 18590
Not a good race on the points front, 15 seems to be the top with most of us getting 5 or 10
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #25 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 10:34am
cspyro21
Offline
Colonel
MOUSTACHE PENGUIN
SPARTAAA
Posts: 5558
Indeed, a very eventful race!
Good job to Hamilton, a good solid drive, but also from Sutil...terrible luck for him though!
^Click Me For Studio V!^
Air Training Corps Cadet Feb 06 - June 08
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #26 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 11:08am
todayshorse
Offline
Colonel
'Ten Thousand Blister.....'
England
Gender:
Posts: 2806
Great race, seeing as nearly everyone bar Sutil and Kubica had some sort of 'off' - Alonso was frankly terrible - I hope Hamilton and Mclaren went and gave him a huge 'V' sign on the way back to the garage
Luck or lucky doesnt get you a 40 second lead. Hamilton deserved that win on merit due to his stunning pace in the middle stint, and even after they switched to 'slicks' he was bloody quick.
I always thought Massa was the worse of the two in the wet, i guess not as he seemed quite comfortable at the start!
And as for poor Sutil, i dont really know what to say about that.
But still, great race. Well done Hamilton
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #27 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 12:46pm
expat
Offline
Colonel
Deep behind enemy lines!
Gender:
Posts: 8499
I really feel for Sutil. That was a real kick in the slats. Definitely not one of Kimi's best races, Got the feeling he was driving about with his brain in neutral...
As for Lewis, did he get a puncture and as a result of swiping the wall, or did he get the puncture because he swiped the wall?
All in all, an entertaining race today.
Matt
«
Last Edit: May 25
th
, 2008 at 2:42pm by expat
»
PETA
People Eating Tasty Animals.
B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #28 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 1:04pm
Craig.
Offline
Colonel
Birmingham
Gender:
Posts: 18590
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/67742
What might have been had the race gone the lap distance..
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #29 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 1:06pm
C
Offline
Colonel
Earth
Posts: 13144
expat wrote
on May 25
th
, 2008 at 12:46pm:
I really feel for Sutil. That was a real kick in the slats. Definitely not one of Kimi's best races, Got the feeling he was driving about with his brain in neutral...
I can't decide whether he lost interest when Lewis passed him at the start, or when he heard about the drive through...
...either waym his presence on the track was pretty pointless, and the fact that he then unfortunately collected Sutil added insult to a wasted seat...
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #30 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 2:53pm
expat
Offline
Colonel
Deep behind enemy lines!
Gender:
Posts: 8499
Craig. wrote
on May 25
th
, 2008 at 1:04pm:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/67742
What might have been had the race gone the lap distance..
There did seem to be rather quite a lot of punctures, but I think less than there could have been considering the amount of noses changed and carbon fiber that was spread all over the track as various drivers fell over each other (Fred bringing the show to a short stop in Rascas comes to mind). But as often happens in F1, a bit of luck plays a big part in the out come. Still, the first British driver to Monaco since Graham Hill 39 years ago, and a win is a win.
Matt
PETA
People Eating Tasty Animals.
B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #31 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 2:58pm
CD.
Ex Member
expat wrote
on May 25
th
, 2008 at 2:53pm:
Still, the first British driver to Monaco since Graham Hill 39 years ago, and a win is a win.
Matt
David Coulthard may have something to say about that
Results will be a bit late this week, I've got to do them all again.. I'm on a new laptop and the old spreadsheet was on the old one..
Bear with me..
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #32 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 4:17pm
C
Offline
Colonel
Earth
Posts: 13144
Quote:
expat wrote
on May 25
th
, 2008 at 2:53pm:
Still, the first British driver to Monaco since Graham Hill 39 years ago, and a win is a win.
Matt
David Coulthard may have something to say about that
And Jackie Stewart...
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #33 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 4:26pm
expat
Offline
Colonel
Deep behind enemy lines!
Gender:
Posts: 8499
C wrote
on May 25
th
, 2008 at 4:17pm:
Quote:
expat wrote
on May 25
th
, 2008 at 2:53pm:
Still, the first British driver to Monaco since Graham Hill 39 years ago, and a win is a win.
Matt
David Coulthard may have something to say about that
And Jackie Stewart...
Sorry, first English driver since Graham Hill.
Matt
PETA
People Eating Tasty Animals.
B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #34 -
May 25
th
, 2008 at 4:28pm
Mictheslik
Offline
Colonel
Me in G-LFSM :D
Bristol, England
Gender:
Posts: 6011
Craig. wrote
on May 25
th
, 2008 at 10:32am:
Not a good race on the points front, 15 seems to be the top with most of us getting 5 or 10
*cough*
20
*cough*
Missed this one due to an airshow, but heard the results over the PA system. Nice to hear of Hamilton's success putting him back on top for now
.mic
[center]
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #35 -
May 26
th
, 2008 at 9:44am
machineman9
Offline
Colonel
Nantwich, England
Gender:
Posts: 5255
I watched the race highlights last night (I was routing for Hamilton)
Was a very interesting race- can't have been easy for any of the racers in those conditions.
After the race highlights (at like 1-2am) I went up and told my sister that Hamilton had won. Now she is going to university in September and asked me who Hamilton was
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #36 -
May 26
th
, 2008 at 11:03am
expat
Offline
Colonel
Deep behind enemy lines!
Gender:
Posts: 8499
machineman9 wrote
on May 26
th
, 2008 at 9:44am:
After the race highlights (at like 1-2am) I went up and told my sister that Hamilton had won. Now she is going to university in September and asked me who Hamilton was
My German wife was reading the paper and asked my yesterday if I had ever hear of a German pilot (with a straight a very serious face) called Manfred von Richthofen and then she told me he was better known as The Red Baron, maybe I had heard of that name instead.
Matt
PETA
People Eating Tasty Animals.
B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #37 -
May 27
th
, 2008 at 4:03am
expat
Offline
Colonel
Deep behind enemy lines!
Gender:
Posts: 8499
Got any results for us Rob.............or are you still in a bank holiday traffic jam trying to get home
Matt
PETA
People Eating Tasty Animals.
B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #38 -
May 27
th
, 2008 at 5:42am
todayshorse
Offline
Colonel
'Ten Thousand Blister.....'
England
Gender:
Posts: 2806
I obviously missed the first couple of rounds because i wasnt here at all, so can someone explain the scoring system? I think i got two of the top three in my prediction...and i realise that if you get all three (in the correct order im guessing) you get 30 points....
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #39 -
May 27
th
, 2008 at 5:58am
Mictheslik
Offline
Colonel
Me in G-LFSM :D
Bristol, England
Gender:
Posts: 6011
todayshorse wrote
on May 27
th
, 2008 at 5:42am:
I obviously missed the first couple of rounds because i wasnt here at all, so can someone explain the scoring system? I think i got two of the top three in my prediction...and i realise that if you get all three (in the correct order im guessing) you get 30 points....
5 for a driver in the top 3 but in the wrong position, 10 for the right position, so for this race;
Hamilton 10
Kubica 10 30
Massa 10
Hamilton 10
Massa 5 20
Kubica 5
Sutil 0
Coulthard 0 5
Hamilton 5
I fee really sorry for Sutil having seen the highlights last night....
.mic
[center]
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #40 -
May 27
th
, 2008 at 1:22pm
todayshorse
Offline
Colonel
'Ten Thousand Blister.....'
England
Gender:
Posts: 2806
Okay thanks for that
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #41 -
May 27
th
, 2008 at 1:58pm
CD.
Ex Member
expat wrote
on May 27
th
, 2008 at 4:03am:
Got any results for us Rob.............or are you still in a bank holiday traffic jam trying to get home
Matt
I need to download OpenOffice again Matt, it was on my old laptop which has come back from Fujitsu Siemens with a total reinstall of Windows, and an empty hard drive..
They didn't even ask me if I had anything im mportant on it... and they only changed the keyboard
I'll get on it tonight lads, bear with me;)
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #42 -
May 27
th
, 2008 at 3:00pm
expat
Offline
Colonel
Deep behind enemy lines!
Gender:
Posts: 8499
Quote:
expat wrote
on May 27
th
, 2008 at 4:03am:
Got any results for us Rob.............or are you still in a bank holiday traffic jam trying to get home
Matt
I need to download OpenOffice again Matt, it was on my old laptop which has come back from Fujitsu Siemens with a total reinstall of Windows, and an empty hard drive..
They didn't even ask me if I had anything im mportant on it... and they only changed the keyboard
I'll get on it tonight lads, bear with me;)
A keyboard change that includes a wiped hard drive. Now that must be more that a little annoying
Matt
PETA
People Eating Tasty Animals.
B1 Boeing 737-800 and Dash8 Q-400
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #43 -
May 27
th
, 2008 at 3:37pm
C
Offline
Colonel
Earth
Posts: 13144
Mictheslik wrote
on May 27
th
, 2008 at 5:58am:
I fee really sorry for Sutil having seen the highlights last night....
.mic
That'll teach him for being good enough to mix it in the front 5!
Back to top
IP Logged
Reply #44 -
May 27
th
, 2008 at 4:30pm
CD.
Ex Member
Better late than never..
Mic takes the lead from Duck
Canada next
Back to top
IP Logged
Pages:
1
‹
Previous Topic
|
Next Topic
›
« Home
‹ Board
Top of this page
Forum Jump »
Home
» 10 most recent Posts
» 10 most recent Topics
Current Flight Simulator Series
- Flight Simulator X
- FS 2004 - A Century of Flight
- Adding Aircraft Traffic (AI) & Gates
- Flight School
- Flightgear
- MS Flight
Graphic Gallery
- Simviation Screenshots Showcase
- Screenshot Contest
- Edited Screenshots
- Photos & Cameras
- Payware Screenshot Showcase
- Studio V Screenshot Workshop
- Video
- The Cage
Design Forums
- Aircraft & 3D Design
- Scenery & Panel Design
- Aircraft Repainting
- Designer Feedback
General
- General Discussion
- Humour
- Music, Arts & Entertainment
- Sport
Computer Hardware & Software Forum
- Hardware
- Tweaking & Overclocking
- Computer Games & Software
- HomeBuild Cockpits
Addons Most Wanted
- Aircraft Wanted
- Other Add-ons Wanted
Real World
- Real Aviation
- Specific Aircraft Types
- Autos ««
- History
On-line Interactive Flying
- Virtual Airlines Events & Messages
- Multiplayer
Simviation Site
- Simviation News & Info
- Suggestions for these forums
- Site Questions & Feedback
- Site Problems & Broken Links
Combat Flight Simulators
- Combat Flight Simulator 3
- Combat Flight Simulator 2
- Combat Flight Simulator
- CFS Development
- IL-2 Sturmovik
Other Websites
- Your Site
- Other Sites
Payware
- Payware
Old Flight Simulator Series
- FS 2002
- FS 2000
- Flight Simulator 98
Simviation Forum
» Powered by
YaBB 2.5 AE
!
YaBB Forum Software
© 2000-2010. All Rights Reserved.