It's easy to forget in our media rich world that at the time these wars took place, information was very much controlled by the governments of the country.

The people were, to be blunt, ignorant of the truth and they not only relied on the ruling bodies to tell them what was happening but how they should behave. If there was need of people for war then it was "the duty of all good (insert nationality of choice) to join up and teach the dirty (insert nationality of choice) a bloody good lesson."

It's only in these later years that people are beginning to not only understand other nations and cultures, but to appreciate them. I'd like to think that those few men in power are running out of excuses to get the people to do their bidding, but I think we've a way to go yet.

It's interesting to note that in these modern times, we can talk about how current governments and authorities conspire to hide truths and tell lies, but at the time of these conflicts we wouldn't even have considered such activities were taking place. In fact, anyone voicing any such concerns could be punished for treason or sedition.

its when religion really started to take a back seat in society and people started to see that maybe their leader was not appointed by god thanks to free speakers beeing able to rise up in neutral nations in Europe, in Elizabethan times (1550-1650 roughly i think, been a while since i delved in hisotry) many people in Europe where speaking against monarchs and the pope! many may have lost their lives.

It is by no means a modern thing for people to stand up against governing  bodies, just back then idea's where alot harder to spread, now a days we have TV, Radio, newspapers and the internet all used to voice an opinion.

Technology allowed anarchy and as a results tradition folds and modern day society comes into play.  Only differance now though is that all these do gooders preaching "Human Rights" for murders, rapists and the like have made it impossible for anyone to be punished for anything! because any so called "atrocities" can be broadcast to the entire globe in a matter of minutes!

with the evolution of communication, Ideas are able to spread easier, and more freely, becomes harder for authorities to stamp down on it, unlike 300 years ago when it would take a government agent to sit in on a radical meeting to uncover it and get names, then dead. Today it would take one government agent to hear it, a 10 year court trial for the warrant to search and take hold of evidence, by which time they have got bored of their radical ideas and gone to making software!

H wrote on Jan 29^th, 2008 at 2:10am:


Well, I'm not bashing any religions, just bringing it into a discussion, i don't see any reason why anyone can get offended unless I really started bashing it with no fact.

My first paragraph was meant to simply be an example of a time when other political and religious idea's where being spread but due to communication to a large audience being hard it could be a bit of a mission, and once people start thing "maybe the queen is not of heavenly descent" then that's where other ideology comes into play, but due to the laws of the time spreading anything against monarchs, or popes would usually mean someone :

A. Took a big sharp thing and took a go at your neck with it
B. Turned  you into a human BBQ
C. You sat on a spike in the tower of london

H wrote on Jan 29^th, 2008 at 3:12am:


keeping it in context not realy, i can't remember in my life-time anyone having their head chopped for saying "F**K the QUEEN!"

my great granpa faught in WWI and got mustard gased and survived then after the war he worked in coal mine and died of black lung. then my granpa fought in WWII and killed Nazi SS and liberated a concentration camp. I have Nazi armbands and SS armbands, propraganda cards,bayonets etc. that my grampa got off the Nazi's after he owned them. I also have pictures of the concentration camp that my grampa took and it shows dead stacked jews that pileup about 4ft high and  there are dead bodys in trenches and the trench looks abut 60 meters long and 6ft wide.