Simviation Forum - Odd Question

Reply #15 - Apr 25^th, 2006 at 12:24pm

Airshow_lover Offline
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So long as you understand it looked like you were honestly mad.

It did seem to have that impression didn't it?

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Reply #16 - Apr 26^th, 2006 at 12:57am

beefhole Offline
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It did seem to have that impression didn't it?

Looked like what I would have done had I been mad. No worries.

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Reply #17 - Apr 26^th, 2006 at 7:36am

Chris_F Offline
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If the Blue Angels don't wear G-suits because they want to keep their right hand on their knee then the Thunderbirds wouldn't have this problem since the stick on an F16 is located on the right side console, not between the legs. This would allow them to wear the G-suit without suffering the same penalty.

Perhaps the Blue Angels, when they ditched the G-suit, asked themselves if oxygen masks were really necessary. I'd assume periferal vision on the cockpit is better without the mask anyway. The Thunderbirds, having never ditched the g-suits, wouldn't be inclined to question other normal pieces of equipment like oxygen masks either.

What is the plus side of an oxygen mask? During an airshow pilots don't spend much time at altitude, and even when they do climb I think their max airshow altitude is around 10,000 feet or so. Not really high enough to need an oxygen mask if cockpit pressure fails.

The oxygen mask could come in handy if there is a cockpit fire (to keep the pilot from breathing flames, a common cause of death in such cases) or a high speed ejection.

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Reply #18 - Apr 26^th, 2006 at 12:37pm

C Offline
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What is the plus side of an oxygen mask? During an airshow pilots don't spend much time at altitude, and even when they do climb I think their max airshow altitude is around 10,000 feet or so. Not really high enough to need an oxygen mask if cockpit pressure fails.

The oxygen mask could come in handy if there is a cockpit fire (to keep the pilot from breathing flames, a common cause of death in such cases) or a high speed ejection.

I'm still waiting to see firm evidence they don't fly without them. From experience of a few military cockpits...

a) How do they communicate without them - most aircon and pressurisation systems in mil aircraft are very loud. Even a boom mike would pick up a lot of background noise.

b) In the event of fumes in the cockpit/fire, is the pilot really going to be wanting to mess around trying to locate and don his oxygen mask?

c) In the event of ejection it would be very ill advised not to be wearing a mask of some description to offer protection from wind blast, shards of canopy/metal and burning bit of "stuff" (you are sitting on a large rocket of course). It is standard procedure to wear a mask and at least one visor (UK helmets have a clear and dark visor) almost all the time when sitting in a live seat...

Just speaking from my (limited) experience...

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Reply #19 - Apr 26^th, 2006 at 12:47pm

C Offline
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Oh well, had a look myself, and it appears they do fly with boom mikes! Well I never. Still, I wouldn't fancy being like that if I had to pull the handle though or if the cockpit filled with some nasty smoke of some sort! Wink

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Reply #20 - Apr 26^th, 2006 at 3:50pm

Ecko Offline
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This is one of the clips I saw that proves it, Charlie.

http://www.patricksaviation.com/aviation_videos/70/Blue_Angels_-_Taking_Care_of_...

It's a very cool video, and because they fly without masks you can, and I quote the site; "Find out what the face of Buzz Lightyear would look like after ten seconds in the microwave" Grin

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Reply #21 - May 12^th, 2006 at 12:48am

IcraveAkro Offline
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The Blue Angels do not wear G suits because when flying the pilot rests his right forearm on his right thigh while controlling the stick. The inflation and deflation of a G suit would jepordize the pilots control and feel on the stick. Also the stick has a "false" feel because a spring is added to the stick and it takes 35lbs of pressure to move the stick. The Thunderbirds F-16's controll column as many of you is the the right of the pilot and therefore the pilot can wear a g suit. As for the Blues helmets, they use boom mics where as the Thunderbirds wear oxygen masks. The only reason why this is is because of the g suit system that Thunderbirds use. I hope this answers your questions.

Bill Beseler
American Virtual Airshows

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Reply #22 - May 12^th, 2006 at 3:14pm

ryan2005 Offline
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The regulations for civilians require supplemental oxygen above 12,000 after 30min

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Reply #23 - May 12^th, 2006 at 7:14pm

beefhole Offline
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The Blue Angels do not wear G suits because when flying the pilot rests his right forearm on his right thigh while controlling the stick. The inflation and deflation of a G suit would jepordize the pilots control and feel on the stick. Also the stick has a "false" feel because a spring is added to the stick and it takes 35lbs of pressure to move the stick. The Thunderbirds F-16's controll column as many of you is the the right of the pilot and therefore the pilot can wear a g suit. As for the Blues helmets, they use boom mics where as the Thunderbirds wear oxygen masks. The only reason why this is is because of the g suit system that Thunderbirds use. I hope this answers your questions.

Thanks for your insight Icrave, but that has already been posted Wink

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Reply #24 - May 14^th, 2006 at 12:33pm

expat Offline
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The regulations for civilians require supplemental oxygen above 12,000 after 30min

It is a maximum of 30 minutes, not after 30 minutes. Depending on you physiology, hypoxia can start at as low a 9000 feet and in extreme cases even lower. That is why there is also a minimum crew requirement.

FAR 91.211 Supplemental oxygen.
(a) General. No person may operate a civil aircraft of U.S. registry—

(1) At cabin pressure altitudes above 12,500 feet (MSL) up to and including 14,000 feet (MSL) unless the required minimum flight crew is provided with and uses supplemental oxygen for that part of the flight at those altitudes that is of more than 30 minutes duration.

Matt

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