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Cloud on Wing (Read 700 times)
Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 2:31am
ChrisM
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Biloela, Australia
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Hi everyone,
I was looking at some photos of some 747's and concords and there seems to be a cloud or spray coming off the wings. What is it???
Thanks...Chris
&&Computer Specs: P4 2.8GHz, 512MB RAM, NVIDIA 6600GT 128MB Graphics Card
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Reply #1 -
Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 3:05am
SilverFox441
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Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
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Condensation in the airflow. Air pressure changes cause water vapour to condense back into droplets, which become visible. Some planes are very prone to the effect, others will rarely exhibit this phenomenon, F/A-18s will frequently show condensation trails from the wingtips, just inboard of the missile rails. A vortex forms in this location that amplifies the normal condensation effect.
Steve
(Silver Fox)
Daly
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Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 6:08am
beaky
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By way of elaboration, I'll add to silver's explanation:
As a fluid (such as air) increases its velocity (as it does when going up and over a lifting surface), its temperature decreases airplane . Air holds more water in vapor form the warmer it is; if that moist air cools, the water is forced to condense into heavier droplets, often to the point where it's visible. This is why carbeurators sometimes collect ice, also: as the air slips into the narrow opening, it speeds up, the water condenses and clings to the rim, and if it gets cold enough in that zone, ice begins to form.
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Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 9:51am
Rifleman
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overgrown models ! "
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Quote:
By way of elaboration, I'll add to silver's explanation:
As a fluid (such as air) increases its velocity (as it does when going up and over a lifting surface), its temperature decreases airplane ..
Ah, ...I get it now, the plane is really stationary and the air moves past the wing ???.......well, that really explains why it takes so long to travel by air.........
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Reply #4 -
Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 12:20pm
SilverFox441
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Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
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Airplanes don't actually move, the Earth moves under them. Planes are just a place where a predictable amount of Earth rotation can be experienced,
After all, we all know that the world revolves around pilots.
Steve
(Silver Fox)
Daly
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Reply #5 -
Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 4:17pm
beaky
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Ooh- a buncha wiseguys, huh?
Not to get into the "Bernoulli vs. Newton" thing, but air certainly goes a bit faster over the top of the wing than anywhere else on an airplane (in normal flight). That's why you don't see this effect on the whole airplane.
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Reply #6 -
Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 5:02pm
ChrisM
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Thanks for clearing that up for me. Two more questions. What are the thin white streams that come from the wingtips or the edge of the flaps ???
example
Also how are contrails formed??
example
Thanks...Chris
&&Computer Specs: P4 2.8GHz, 512MB RAM, NVIDIA 6600GT 128MB Graphics Card
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Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 5:18pm
beaky
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The "thin streams" in that picture look like vortices that are visible because of the same thing as the "wing-clouds", but I've only seen that off wingtips. A vortex like that is formed because the air underneath the wing is "trying to get out from under" and a great deal of it travels out towards the tips as well as straight to the trailing edge. Once it reaches the end, it tends to curl up and inward. It's a lot like a breaking wave in the ocean- and in the case of a very heavy airplane moving slowly (such as during takeoff climb), they can be almost as powerful. Needless to say, after breaking free of the bottom surface of the wing, that airflow is going to speed up for a bit as it releases its energy, which could produce that acceleration-induced cooling I mentioned earlier, as well as a lot of energy. They're usually invisible, but that factor (with high humidity) dust, or passing through smoke or clouds can render them visible. There's a very well-known air-to-air picture of a bizjet skimming clouds and leaving lovely big vortices behind; unfortunately I don't have a link.
Contrails are due to water vapor and possibly other stuff in the exhaust, but the condensation in that case is due to the chilling effect of high-altitude air, as opposed to acceleration. Next time you see a jet laying down contrails, watch them for a while... sometimes they "turn into" clouds. They're the same thing: water vapor condensing (and sometimes freezing) due to a drop in temperature.
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Reply #8 -
Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 5:28pm
beaky
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Quote:
Ah, ...I get it now, the plane is really stationary and the air moves past the wing ???.......well, that really explains why it takes so long to travel by air.........
Ah, I see my typo now; yes, I am in fact a jackass. Or at least, I can't type or cut&paste as well as a jackass...
In honor of the good it often does me to be humiliated, I will not fix it... 8)
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Reply #9 -
Mar 17
th
, 2005 at 10:38pm
Saratoga
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It creates some very beautiful effects doesn't it?
Quote:
After all, we all know that the world revolves around pilots.
Isn't that the truth? Too bad it isn't true.
Pilot for a major US airline certified in the: EMB-120, CRJ, 727, 737, 757, 767, and A-320 and military, T-38, C-130, C-141, and C-5 along with misc. other small airplanes. Any questions, I'm here for you.
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Reply #10 -
Mar 18
th
, 2005 at 1:16am
ChrisM
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Home Airport: YTHG, Thangool
Biloela, Australia
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Thanks Rottydaddy
&&Computer Specs: P4 2.8GHz, 512MB RAM, NVIDIA 6600GT 128MB Graphics Card
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Reply #11 -
Mar 20
th
, 2005 at 11:40am
Jared
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lol, always a good laugh..
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Reply #12 -
Mar 20
th
, 2005 at 11:42am
Saratoga
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Quote:
lol, always a good laugh..
Indeed he is.
Pilot for a major US airline certified in the: EMB-120, CRJ, 727, 737, 757, 767, and A-320 and military, T-38, C-130, C-141, and C-5 along with misc. other small airplanes. Any questions, I'm here for you.
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Reply #13 -
Mar 20
th
, 2005 at 1:53pm
beaky
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Buncha nitpickers, that's what you are.
. But laugh while you can- I've just about run thru the list of possible errors involved here; probably won't repeat any of them. Pretty good learning curve for an analog-bred, three-finger-typin' caveman...
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Reply #14 -
Mar 20
th
, 2005 at 2:11pm
Saratoga
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757/767 Captain Major,
USAF
Dallas-Ft. Worth Intl. (KDFW)
Gender:
Posts: 571
LOL! Typing is a tricky thing, isn't it?
Pilot for a major US airline certified in the: EMB-120, CRJ, 727, 737, 757, 767, and A-320 and military, T-38, C-130, C-141, and C-5 along with misc. other small airplanes. Any questions, I'm here for you.
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