Simviation Forum - Hurricane weapon damage, or Ju 88 craft damage??

Dec 5^th, 2004 at 9:47pm

kalashnikov01 Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 12

salutations,

I downloaded the 1% Hurricane something iswrong; i have tested numerous times (really, a lot, it is not my aiming) at various ranges and positions, but after releasing thousands of rounds i cant seem to take a JU-88 down? I am referring to the 1% JU 88 here i should add, but the stock one is not much different only it suddenly explodes into pieces!!??

Only when i am left with about 200 rounds the bullet hole riddled raging inferno of smoke and flames comes very slowly descending towards earth, and half of the time it doesnt even set fire!

But no matter what bomber i am shooting, none of them seem to roll over or dive towards earth, they just set fire and very slowly descend? But the Ju88 is just stupendously resistant to my hurricane? And speaking of such, it takes longer than usual to down in other planes aswell.

Anyone else had this problem with the hurricane when shooting bombers?? This surely cant be realistic, i remember CFS1, and it did not have this problem??

why do the bullets go so far above the cross hair in the 1% hurricane??? Something that always anoyed me??

Thankyou.

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #1 - Dec 6^th, 2004 at 1:26am

Mathias Offline
Colonel
Toy Maker
Germany

Gender:
Posts: 558

Have you installed the 1% weapons pack?
This one is required to make the Hurricane guns function properly.
Still the Ju88 may be a bit tough

Mathias&&

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #2 - Dec 6^th, 2004 at 1:38am

kalashnikov01 Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 12

yes, i have done everything, thatnks for reply.

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #3 - Dec 6^th, 2004 at 8:31pm

farmerdave Offline
Colonel
St. Clairsville Red Devils!
St. Clairsville Ohio

Gender:
Posts: 447

I never seemed to have that problem. The Ju88's prety tough, but 20-30 solid hits to the fuselage will usually yield flames. Don't expect it to blow up in midair though,
just let it go down by itself once it drops out of formation. Remember though, the Hurri only has rifle-caliber guns, so don't expect huge explosions and such.

As for the guns being at two high an angle, I never thought that a problem, but you could go into the XDP and reduce the pitch of the guns.

&&&&&&&&&&

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #4 - Dec 6^th, 2004 at 9:02pm

Stormtropper Offline
Colonel
Blueballed...!
Grosse Pointe, MI

Gender:
Posts: 1645

How far are you shooting the JU-88 from? because .303s do nothing but bounce off the skin of any aircraft unless they are shot within 200 ft (something like that) Wink

Jeff

Arizona State University&&Viva la party!

&&&&&&&&

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #5 - Dec 7^th, 2004 at 11:24am

AvHistory Offline
Colonel
Kinder & Gentler
NC, USA

Gender:
Posts: 577

It takes in general 70-90 rounds of .303 to bring down the Ju-88's.

The number of rounds fired has no relevance its strictly the number of hits & where the hits are. If they are not well placed & spread out all over the plane (spray & pray) it will take many more.

In real life the inability of the .303 to successfully deal with German bombers lead the RAF to adopt .50 & 20MM guns to their fighters. Pre-war RAF 'experts' turned down the proposal to use of the BMG-M-2/.50 as unnecessary & thought the greater firing ability of the 8X/.303 would be sufficient.

Its interesting to note that even the original US .30 BMG which has greater firepower then the re-chambered RAF .303 version was abandoned by the US prior to the war in favor of the .50

A 1% P-51 will take down the Ju-88 with less then 20 round hits of .50 usually 10-12.

BEAR - AvHistory

« Last Edit: Dec 7^th, 2004 at 2:04pm by AvHistory »

BEAR&&http://www.avhistory.org&&http://www.medairwar.com

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #6 - Dec 7^th, 2004 at 6:11pm

Woodlouse2002 Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender:
Posts: 12574

If you get close enough even .303 rounds will tear apart an aircraft with relatively few hits. Get to within 250 yards and take out the engines.

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #7 - Dec 8^th, 2004 at 2:19am

kalashnikov01 Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 12

salutations,

thanks for all the replies guys.

BEAR, thanyou for the explanation along with pics, but i have one thing, that plane in your picture, that is a Ju88 A4-T, not the JU88A4 am i mistaken??

I have both of those planes, and i find that the Ju88A4 T feells incredibly realistic in flying and taking damage, engines set fire when i feel they would etc, i think that plane is gr8, however, it is an entirely different story witht the JU88 A4, the Crete one, in sort of desert camo. That thing is so resistant to damage i cant set fire to it i can only leak fuel from it and cause minor structural damage, nothing i did could send it over and down.

Even in the Spitfire i cannot take it down without thousands of rounds drilling into it. I will try again now though.

On another note- in the war, how did Ju88's perform in taking damage compared to HE111 and DO 17z2???

How are accurate damage models contructed?? What values and historical info is their in deciding what downs a plane and how it will react??

Thats all folks....

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #8 - Dec 8^th, 2004 at 3:04pm

AvHistory Offline
Colonel
Kinder & Gentler
NC, USA

Gender:
Posts: 577

Ran a quick test on the 88A4 with similar results.

Had my gunnery been better it would have taken fewer hits to bring it down.

As for the 111 vs. 88 vs. 17 comparison I would have to look up the data but don't have the time to do it right now. During the Battle of Britain the Ju 88 proved that it was the best German bomber but again I don't have damage numbers available to make a specific comparison.

Thing is, as the .50 & 20MM became more common none of these three planes could withstand an attack that was pressed home. My gut feel is the 88 would be the pick of the litter overall as it was used right up to the end of the war.

The AvHistory 1% damage models are developed from cutaway drawings of the planes to determine the location of interior items. Data is collected to determine thickness/hardness of the skin structural members and armor.

On the weapons side we use the USNA Shaw formula to determine the potential lethality of the projectiles.

http://www.avhistory.org/CFS/Standards/WW2AircraftGunsCFS2.html

From this a detailed damage profile is drawn up within the limits of the CFS software & a computers ability to process the data.

Sample CFS2 F6F 1% vs. MS stock

MS stock

AvHistory 1%

AvHistory 1% P-51 front view

BEAR - AvHistory

BEAR&&http://www.avhistory.org&&http://www.medairwar.com

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #9 - Dec 10^th, 2004 at 2:42am

kalashnikov01 Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 12

Thanks BEAR-

something is DEFINATELY wrong with my JU then, i tested it numerous times, 25% accuracy, all shots on left wing/engine, took 500-550 hit rounds until he rolled over left, until those figures, he kept flying straight...

I dont know what teh hell is going on....

I really dont know what damage models to believe now, How can you have such difffernt figures to mine??

I am firing within 200........by the way what measurement are those range figures ingame- feet, meters, yards???

Oh and arnt the gunners in this game wayyy too accurate???? I have my settings on ACE all the time because then the fighters are really fun to dogfight with, but bombers seem to be deadly accurate?? The guns to not create dispersion the enemy gunners can handle their weapons as if the bullets were attached to a rod, their is no spead????

is their a way to fix this??

Again,

Thanks.

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #10 - Dec 10^th, 2004 at 1:14pm

AvHistory Offline
Colonel
Kinder & Gentler
NC, USA

Gender:
Posts: 577

Don't know what to tell you but I can dup these Ju-88A4 kills at will with no problem other then the defensive fire. This set is 115 rounds hit.

I forget, its either meters or yards definitly not feet. That being said I try to shoot from 90-110yards out.

We have some samples out for testing of revisions to the turret & hand held guns including dispersion based on historical stats. It would seem the B-17 ball turret is the most stable firing platform.

I expect we will be updating them with the next air file upgrade which is close to being done.

BEAR - AvHistory

BEAR&&http://www.avhistory.org&&http://www.medairwar.com

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #11 - Dec 10^th, 2004 at 2:11pm

Mathias Offline
Colonel
Toy Maker
Germany

Gender:
Posts: 558

It's yards by default.
Hit U to switch to metric.
This will also switch your HUD displays to metric.

Mathias&&

Back to top

IP Logged

	Search the archive: