Search the archive:
YaBB - Yet another Bulletin Board
 
   
 
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print
I have some questions concerning buying my next c (Read 429 times)
Aug 24th, 2004 at 8:58am

cbrown6775   Offline
Major

Posts: 4
*****
 
I could ask the "computer guy" at work but why not ask a 1000 computer guys. My questions realy deal with is "X" worth the extra cash i.e. would I notice the difference. Before I start plz plz plz plz don't suggest I build my own. Im a [TOS Violation]. I pay some one to change the oil on my car and I work on the Apache Longbow helicpter, the most advance Attack Helicopter in the world. So now that everyone knows what your dealing with I will continue. Please feel free to answer anyone or all of the questions below. My price limit is$3000.00 ish. Im currenly in germany so I'm ordering online. Also plz explain why if possible.

* indicates what I was leaning towards


1. Who would you order from?
a. Dell
b. Alienware
c. cyberpower* (they will ship next day!)
d. other


2. Which cpu would you buy, will I even know the diff?
a. (800FSB)Intel® P4 EXTREME EDITION CPU 2MB CACHE @ 3.4GHZ w/ HT (+$600.00)
b. (800Mhz FSB)Intel® Pentium® 4 CPU @ 3.4GHZ 512K w/ Hyper Threading *


3. RAM
a. 2 gig ram*
b. 4 gig ram (+$1000.00)


4. Would I see the diff in FPS with a faster hard drive?
a. Western Digital Raptor 36.7GB 10,000RPM Serial ATA 150 8MB Cache WD360GD *
b. 40GB 7200 RPM ATA 100 HARD DRIVE
(size is not important to me....I havn't passed 10 gb ever on my copmuter....I just need enough to hold AAO!)

5. Which video card would you buy?
a. ATI Radeon X800 PRO 256MB DDR3 8x AGP W/ TV-OUT & DVI *
b. nVidia GeForce FX 6800 GT 256MB AGP8X w/TVO&DVI

6. Why is the faster cd rom cheaper?
a. 16X DVD ROM
b. SONY 52X CD-ROM (cheaper by a few bucks)

Thx for the help guys!

PaleRider 37 OUT!

"My wife said its her or FS2004!..........I sure am going to miss her."
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #1 - Aug 24th, 2004 at 9:11am

Dan   Offline
Colonel
Meet Bogart! Thanks CRAIG!
Carmarthenshire, Wales, Uk!

Gender: male
Posts: 2053
*****
 
My answers:

1: Alienware - they look good and are supposedly good. They are american though, and i'm in the UK.

2: (800FSB)Intel® P4 EXTREME EDITION CPU 2MB CACHE @ 3.4GHZ w/ HT (+$600.00) Thats got a huge cache on it, I think a difference would be obvious. Have you cosiderded an AMD64?

3: You can't overdo RAM. Get DDR or (I think its better, not sure) DDR 400.

4: If you have enough RAM and cache, it shouldn't be noticable. They're cheap now, I would buy around 40Gb at least!  Wink

5: Not sure, probably the ATI.

6: 'Cos the other one does DVD's (Films) as well. If you like them, get one, but in 5 years I've never used mine. Get the 52X.

I think all of that stuff is correct,s earch the net for reviews etc......... Good Luck!
Dan G

P.s. Why not build your own? lol......  Grin
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #2 - Aug 24th, 2004 at 10:45am

Iroquois   Offline
Colonel
Happy Halloween
Ontario Canada

Gender: male
Posts: 3244
*****
 
Instead of the Intel, get an AMD rig. They're better for gamming and 3d graphics work while Intels are better at image processing, music editing, and general use. I guess you've got money to burn so get an Athlon64. The Athlon64 3400+ is a bit better than the P4 EE 3.4ghz. There are two socket choices, 754 and 939. Try to get a Socket 939 because AMD is going to phase out the 754 soon.

As for where to get it, I'd pick other. It's usually best to get a small computer shop to assemble a custom one for you or even to buy the parts and build it yourself. I wouldn't suggest the DIY project unless you know what you're doing.

For graphics. I'd pick the Geforce 6800GT. It has some features that the X800 Pro doesn't have.

For Ram, 1gig of PC3200 DDR is plenty.

Your HDD choices are fine although 7200rpm drives are cheaper.

As for optical storage. If you like to watch movies, get a DVD drive. There's is no difference in speed or price between CD-ROM and DVD-Rom drives. Even a low cost DVD+/-RW drive would be a good choice because it's excellent for backup.
 

I only pretend to know what I'm talking about. Heck, that's what lawyers, car mechanics, and IT professionals do everyday. Wink&&The Rig: &&AMD Athlon XP2000+ Palomino, ECS K7S5A 3.1, 1GB PC2700 DDR, Geforce FX5200 128mb, SB Live Platinum, 16xDVD, 16x10x40x CDRW, 40/60gb 7200rpm HDD, 325w Power, Windows XP Home SP1, Directx 9.0c with 66.81 Beta gfx drivers
IP Logged
 
Reply #3 - Aug 24th, 2004 at 10:57am

congo   Offline
Colonel
Make BIOS your Friend
Australia

Gender: male
Posts: 3663
*****
 
1. Consider ordering from a local supplier who will custom build and maintain your machine close by home.

The advantage here is that if something goes wrong, you pop it into his shop for a quick fix and pick it up as soon as its ready, no sending the system away for lengthy repairs.

You need to explain to him EXACTLY what you want and don't except substitutes, if you don't feel right about the dealer... go somewhere else. You need a sympathetic supplier, preferably an enthusiast who knows how to build and set up a performance machine.
Look for an established small supplier who offers personalised service.

2. Seriously consider an AMD 64 bit machine.

3. 1 gig of RAM is sufficient, it's the quality of the RAM that is really important, you'll want RAM that can be set to very fast timings for best performance.

4. A faster hard drive will load information slightly faster, it has very little if anything, to do with FPS.

5. Either of those video cards will offer good performance, however, certain manufacturers make special editions which have faster RAM installed on the card and the GPU and RAM timings are set higher by default. Selection of one of these "special" cards requires research.

6. DVD drives and burn capable drives are slower in general than the simple old CD ROM drive. the speed was limited to 52x when discs began shattering as faster drives were developed.

Ideally, the latest high quality DVD-CD multi-format burner should be purchased along with a fast DVD - CD ROM read only drive. Less painful burning operations are then able to be made Disc to Disc, using the pair of drives.

If you need a specification, just ask. Your main concern should be which chipset you intend on basing your system on. The chipset (mainboard) will determine the potential of the machine.

Good Luck.
 

...Mainboard: Asus P5K-Premium, CPU=Intel E6850 @ x8x450fsb 3.6ghz, RAM: 4gb PC8500 Team Dark, Video: NV8800GT, HDD: 2x1Tb Samsung F3 RAID-0 + 1Tb F3, PSU: Antec 550 Basiq, OS: Win7x64, Display: 24" WS LCD
IP Logged
 
Reply #4 - Aug 24th, 2004 at 1:37pm

Gixer   Offline
Colonel
Lets go fly a kite!!

Posts: 1540
*****
 
Check out my spec  Grin  All i can say is I am extremely happy with it.  Its well fast and plays everything sooooper smoothly.  Did require a bit of setting up though.  The BIOS comes set at a guaranteed stable speed.  Turn on optimized in a few places and tweek my ram timings and my bench scores flew up!

Personally I always build my own systems so have lost touch as to who would make a good rig these days.

If you can stretch to it get a better CPU than what I have one of the new FX53 ones but they aren't gonna be cheap!

I would go for the 6800GT over the ATI X800pro.  GT has more pipes than the pro and nearly all 6800GT's I have read about have overclocked to standard Ultra speeds  Grin  The XFX6800U I got even comes with the 'coolbits' registry tweek so you get an overclocking function appear in your graphics setting  Grin

Congo is right about the HDD thing.  They did a few tests and apart from data transfer and accessing you gain nothing in games from having a megga fast HDD, this is why I didn't bother going to SATA or getting one of those 10,000rpm ones.
 

AMD64 3500+ @ 2200MHz 400FSB&&MSI K8N Neo 2 mobo nForce3 chipset&&1gig Corsair XMS PC3200 timings @ 10.2.2.2 &&XFX 6800 Ultra @ 450/1200&&80gig HDD&&Loadsa fans!!!
IP Logged
 
Reply #5 - Aug 24th, 2004 at 2:11pm

Iroquois   Offline
Colonel
Happy Halloween
Ontario Canada

Gender: male
Posts: 3244
*****
 
The fast HDD are really only good if your running databases or websites. Using it as a server in other words.

Now that I think about it, you may even want to concider a motherboard with a PCI-Express slot instead of AGP. In a few years AGP will be out and PCX will be in.  The Geforce 6800 and 6600 as well as the Radeon X800 all have PCX versions.
 

I only pretend to know what I'm talking about. Heck, that's what lawyers, car mechanics, and IT professionals do everyday. Wink&&The Rig: &&AMD Athlon XP2000+ Palomino, ECS K7S5A 3.1, 1GB PC2700 DDR, Geforce FX5200 128mb, SB Live Platinum, 16xDVD, 16x10x40x CDRW, 40/60gb 7200rpm HDD, 325w Power, Windows XP Home SP1, Directx 9.0c with 66.81 Beta gfx drivers
IP Logged
 
Reply #6 - Aug 24th, 2004 at 5:49pm

cbrown6775   Offline
Major

Posts: 4
*****
 
Thx for all the help guys.  I have made my decision  and now my children will not be going to collage so Daddy can play games.  I did buy a AMD instead.  Can someone tell me how mine compares to a intel...i.e. 3.2, 3.4, 3.6 ghz??????  Thx again guys!


CAS: ALUMINUM X-SuperAlien Server 420W W/ Window & LCD Temperature Display Fan Control
CD: 16X DVD ROM
CPU: (939-pin)
AMD ATHLONT64 FX 53 Processor

HDD: Western Digital Raptor 36.7GB 10,000RPM Serial ATA 150 8MB Cache WD360GD
HDD2: Western Digital Raptor 36.7GB 10,000RPM Serial ATA 150 8MB Cache WD360GD
MOTHERBOARD: (939-pin Socket) ABIT AV8 VIA K8T800 MAINBOARD WITH LAN, USB2.0, IEEE, & AUDIO
MEMORY: 2048 MB (1GBx2) PC3200 400MHz Dual Channel DDR MEMORY
MONITOR: [BLACK] ViewSonic® VP201B 20.1 inch TFT LCD MONITOR
RAID: RAID-0 (DATA STRIPPING)
SOUND: Creative Labs SB Audigy-2 ZS 7.
VIDEO:nVidia GeForce FX 6800 Ultra 256MB AGP8X w/TVO&DVI

How bad did I screw up besides for not building it myself?
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #7 - Aug 24th, 2004 at 6:18pm

Iroquois   Offline
Colonel
Happy Halloween
Ontario Canada

Gender: male
Posts: 3244
*****
 
The FX-53 is equivilant to an Intel P4 3.8ghz.

You've got a very nice set up there. Wish I had that kind of money to burn.  Grin
 

I only pretend to know what I'm talking about. Heck, that's what lawyers, car mechanics, and IT professionals do everyday. Wink&&The Rig: &&AMD Athlon XP2000+ Palomino, ECS K7S5A 3.1, 1GB PC2700 DDR, Geforce FX5200 128mb, SB Live Platinum, 16xDVD, 16x10x40x CDRW, 40/60gb 7200rpm HDD, 325w Power, Windows XP Home SP1, Directx 9.0c with 66.81 Beta gfx drivers
IP Logged
 
Reply #8 - Aug 25th, 2004 at 8:35am

Dan   Offline
Colonel
Meet Bogart! Thanks CRAIG!
Carmarthenshire, Wales, Uk!

Gender: male
Posts: 2053
*****
 
I hate you! Its me that needs that kind of PC! Outburst over lol...... V. nice machine mate!
Dan G
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #9 - Aug 25th, 2004 at 10:02am

Iroquois   Offline
Colonel
Happy Halloween
Ontario Canada

Gender: male
Posts: 3244
*****
 
Quote:
I hate you! Its me that needs that kind of PC! Outburst over lol...... V. nice machine mate!
Dan G

What's it my Mom keeps saying. "If you get a decent job and work hard, then you can get all that stuff."    Roll Eyes I'm pretty lazy so hopefully that decent job entails something in the civil service.  Grin
 

I only pretend to know what I'm talking about. Heck, that's what lawyers, car mechanics, and IT professionals do everyday. Wink&&The Rig: &&AMD Athlon XP2000+ Palomino, ECS K7S5A 3.1, 1GB PC2700 DDR, Geforce FX5200 128mb, SB Live Platinum, 16xDVD, 16x10x40x CDRW, 40/60gb 7200rpm HDD, 325w Power, Windows XP Home SP1, Directx 9.0c with 66.81 Beta gfx drivers
IP Logged
 
Reply #10 - Aug 25th, 2004 at 12:39pm

4_Series_Scania   Offline
Colonel
He who laughs last, thinks
slowest.
Stoke on Trent England U.K.

Gender: male
Posts: 3638
*****
 
If you wish to do video editing, then the p4 EE is the one to go for,certainly not from a value for money point of view though!!!

Honestly, 2GB of RAM? do you need all that? If video editing is one task you plan to do, then the 2GB is understandable..... You certainly won't need that much RAM to enjoy FS9 !

I'm a little surprised on such a high spec proposed machine, your going for the "Mid Range" 6800GT - An Ultra would be better and will certainly overclock to even greater speeds.....

Anyway, from my local store www.overclockers.co.uk if you must go AMD 64 then this little lot will do you nicely....

AMD Athlon FX53 (Socket 939) - Retail (CP-089-AM) - £587.44

Gigabyte GA-K8NSNXP-939 nForce3 Ultra (Socket 939) Motherboard (MB-018-GI) - £140.94

Corsair 1GB DDR XMS3200XL Pro TwinX (2x512MB) CAS2 (MY-050-CS) - £234.94

NEC ND3500 16x DVD±RW Dual Layer ReWriter (Black) - OEM (CD-021-**) - £61.81

XFX GeForce 6800 Ultra 256MB DDR3 TV-Out/Dual DVI (AGP) - Retail (GX-016-XF) - £411.19
The fastest 6800U

Western Digital Raptor 74GB 10,000RPM SATA 8MB Cache - OEM (HD-015-WD) x2 - £246.38

Coolermaster Wave Master - Black (No PSU) (CA-047-CM) - £114.56

Coolermaster Wavemaster/Praetorian Side Panel (SPB-T01-EKV) - Green (CA-049-CM) - £23.44

OCZ PowerStream 520w Power Supply (CA-011-OC) - £103.64

Creative Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS 7.1 *** - Retail (SC-017-CL) - £70.44

£2006.78 inc vat

Thats your tower sorted out, you've still got a bit left over for a monitor etc

The codes in brackets are Overclockers stock codes.

Oh, you'll have to build it yourself, or get somebody nice & helpful to do it for you.  Roll Eyes

IMHO, a better system than any of the above manufacturers will supply for a lot more money!  Wink

If you wish to go for more RAM etc, just buy more! - I really doubt you'll need it though.  Undecided

Paul.

P.S. I'm not on any commision from Overclocker's if only I was!!!  Roll Eyes
 

Posting drivel here since Jan 31st, 2002. - That long!
IP Logged
 
Reply #11 - Aug 25th, 2004 at 4:30pm

cbrown6775   Offline
Major

Posts: 4
*****
 


I'm a little surprised on such a high spec proposed machine, your going for the "Mid Range" 6800GT - An Ultra would be better and will certainly overclock to even greater speeds.....



HUH...........Plz explain?
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #12 - Aug 25th, 2004 at 5:42pm

Gixer   Offline
Colonel
Lets go fly a kite!!

Posts: 1540
*****
 
If I knew now what I knew I probably would have got the GT myself.

The Ultras at the moment DO NOT overclock at all well.  My XFX comes at 425/1200 outta the box.  Can get the core to 435 but cant get the memory any higher than the 1200 its at.  So unless this can be sorted in drivers its as good as Im gonna get. 

People have been clocking GT's to 425/1200 (well XFX ones) fine so your saving yourself £100.  I did have a stroke of luck though and ended up getting my XFX half price  Grin 8)

Oh and in his latest spec he has gone for the XFX 6800Ultra  Grin
 

AMD64 3500+ @ 2200MHz 400FSB&&MSI K8N Neo 2 mobo nForce3 chipset&&1gig Corsair XMS PC3200 timings @ 10.2.2.2 &&XFX 6800 Ultra @ 450/1200&&80gig HDD&&Loadsa fans!!!
IP Logged
 
Reply #13 - Aug 25th, 2004 at 6:06pm

4_Series_Scania   Offline
Colonel
He who laughs last, thinks
slowest.
Stoke on Trent England U.K.

Gender: male
Posts: 3638
*****
 
Depends on which Ultra you go for, some don't O/Clock well, I have a friend who's 6800Ultra is overclocked and it certainly betters the overclocked 6800GT based machine I built for another friend a few weeks back....

Sry ,cbrown6775, I'd missed the Ultra in your updated specs......

Ultimately, forget about overclocking it for a good while yet, Doom3 running @ MAX settings on my friends 6800GT tells me theres little point in overclocking these beasties yet, nothing current I've seen seems to demand the extra performance. (And that includes running with 8xAnti alaising & 16 x Anisotropic filtering!)

Either way you look at it though, AMD will always be the enthusiasts first choice simply because of price.
AMD's are the current performers no doubt... But overclocking? I dont think you can clock much better than P4's still.

2.4's doing 3.6Ghz, 3.4's doing 5Ghz+ (ok thats excessive, but some people have done that).

Clocking P4's up to 275mhz FSB is pretty easy to do, and the performance gains on the cheaper chips is still awesome.  8)
But the top intels Vs AMD's arnt exactly bad in a match-up. Of the benchmarks I've come across, theres very frequently only about 10-15Fps between the two brands and even less than that in real world applications, I'd say that i am an enthusiast but if i can use a cpu that performs above average in games and out performs in terms of use for applications I would have to go with Intel.
Suffice to say, I'm not too keen on the prices !!!

As for a business side of view though you can do more work per cpu at once than an AMD and over the last 5-6 years they have been very stable where as AMD were finding there feet, give it another 5 years or so and I'd be very interested to see where AMD are.


Simply put my needs at the moment require me to listen to music have several applications running at once, be connected to my other machines and be able to burn a CD whilst having something spare rather than being able to play UT 03 at 100Fps.  Wink
 

Posting drivel here since Jan 31st, 2002. - That long!
IP Logged
 
Reply #14 - Aug 26th, 2004 at 6:06am

cbrown6775   Offline
Major

Posts: 4
*****
 
My new computer will not be here for at least 4-5 weeks due to back order items.  In the mean time how would I go about over clocking my current hard drive.  Radeon 9200?

p.s. Do I realy need to over clock  anything on my new computer?.....I figured it would be fasy enough for anything....
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print