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Computer Building Questions... (Read 192 times)
Aug 3rd, 2004 at 9:25pm
Triple_7   Ex Member

 
Well as most of you know we own a cursed computer that has not worked right sence day 1.  But after some arguing and some calls earlier today there is a very good chance that we will be recieving a full refund of origianal cost as well as the repair costs.  There is already a computer we are going to but but it pretty much has the same graphics and ram already there as compaired to what i have added.  So bettween this older computer and my personal chips off the other i already have half a computer.  So down to the questions...

#1...How easy is it to build and program a computer from scratch.

#2...I already have... 64 MB graphics card, 256 DDR ram chip, new CD-Rom, floppy drive from old computer, spare monitor, any thing external that i could possibly need,  and last but not least... a Windows 98 SE Upgrade disk if it would be needed.  So what else would i need to add to my list to buy and what kind...

To Buy List So Far:

Hardrive... probably 40 gig... 20 gig would be more then enough for me but while looking around seems hard to find one that small.

Case... but dont know what to get or for that matter what all comes with one.

Extra ram chip...probably a 512 DDR for a total of 768 DDR

Any thing else that i need...

Im working on probably no more then $300, $350 at the most.

Also have never acualy built a computer from scratch so have no idea on how you program them for the first time.    Probably looking at trying to put it togather within a couple months if i have the money   
 
 
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Reply #1 - Aug 3rd, 2004 at 9:35pm

4_Series_Scania   Offline
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For a start, for optimal performance, I'd completely forget about '98 - It can't handle over 512mb of RAM and is generally as stable as a house of cards.....

If your GeForce 4 is an "MX" then you'll gain far more by keeping what you've got and get a Geforce FX or 6800 series or the equivalent ATI card in its place.

If you need to ask how easy it is, I'd advise you find somebody who's got at least some basic pc know how to help you. $350 worth of dead kit is no fun, believe me, I've been there.....  Roll Eyes  Grin

Buying your RAM first may well limit your choice of Motherboard & consequently, your CPU (both of which you'll need)

$350 will get you a reasonable box of goodies, but saving an extra $100 or so will be the differance between a fair pc and a pretty good one.


Don't forget a decent PSU & case....
 

Posting drivel here since Jan 31st, 2002. - That long!
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Reply #2 - Aug 4th, 2004 at 12:26am
Triple_7   Ex Member

 
well....

I dont plan on buying extra ram till the computer is up and running.  Like in my list so far.  Already have a 256 MB DDR chip that i got awhile back.   so i at least already have one.     Im going to look around and see if i can find a case with a new mobo already built in.  Ive seen them on different websites ranging from 50 to 500 dollars.

The graphics card is an MX but it will do for now.   I have to use whatever i can to take the cost down.  I can always upgrade as i get money.  Most of the hardware is from upgrading this old 350 mghz IBM.  Its seen better days and i really have no use for it anymore other then a backup.  So might as well use what i can off of it.   My question now is.   Does the diferent mobos limit the processor i can get ???  i plan to try for at least something around 1.5 gig or preferably over 2      depends on what i can afford.  if possible i can always upgrade it later. 

I think i can find someone to help me if i get into to many problems... but i have to wait a couple weeks untill school starts again.  Im going to Vocational school for a computer graphics design and digital photography class.   the teacher is also the teacher for the computer building and programing class.    so if anything i might have one built even cheaper for the same as what i would probably pay more for on my own.   who knows.  ill have to see how it goes.   was just curious as to what i might be getting myself into Roll Eyes
 
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Reply #3 - Aug 4th, 2004 at 9:51am

congo   Offline
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Hi Triple_7,

You seem headed for disaster from what I've read, so here's the low-down.........

You need to take certain steps to avoid disappointment and wasting your money. I know you are on a tight budget, but if you screw this up, you may as well flush the cash down the drain. Don't be tempted to go with what you have and buy components to suit your current hardware. It's a big mistake.

Select your components based on careful research or informed advice, and then see if you have anything on hand that will be compatible with it.


PRIORITY ONE :

Select a suitable chipset ........ ie....this is your mainboard. You have many choices within two main groups, INTEL or AMD compatible. With your budget, AMD compatible is indicated as it is somewhat cheaper.

The mainboard will determine what components (CPU, RAM, HDD's, USB, Firewire, Sound, Video, etc....) will be compatible, the PC's POTENTIAL capabilities, and it's useful lifespan.

The more recent the chipset release, the longer it will be useful in the future, and it will have more features and support more modern hardware.

On your budget, you may as well go with an "nForce2 - Ultra400" chipset. There are bargain boards around with that chipset. Get a quality board like an ASUS or GIGABYTE, they both have excellent manuals.

DON'T GET ONE WITH ONBOARD VIDEO  if you plan on using it for gaming or simulations!

-------------------

PRIORITY TWO :

Decide which CPU to use, ther are 2 relevant choices for that chipset. The cheaper AMD XP+ CPU's use a 333mhz FRONT SIDE BUS SPEED..... (FSB)... The more expensive ones use a 400mhz FSB. The PC will perform faster with the latter, but it's basically a budget choice for you, and you can always upgrade later.

Don't be tempted by the cheap price of the XP2400+ or lower, they run a 266mhz FSB speed, not what you want in a new rig. Barton XP2500+ at 333mhz FSB minimum, preferably XP2800+ or above.

Buy a CPU only if it comes in a sealed package with a factory fan.

The CPU and FSB speed normally determine the RAM specification, but in this case, it would be wise to buy PC3200 (400mhz) DDR SDRAM, in a quality 512mb module. (Kingston Value Ram is a budget brand that works quite well, and even overclocks moderately in my experience). PC3200 is about the same price as the lower spec stuff, so get it anyway.

If you currently have PC2100 or PC2700 RAM, it can be used, but ALL RAM fitted will run at the speed of the slowest module onboard. So if you get the new PC3200 512mb, don't bother fitting a stick of PC2100 (DDR 266) because it will slow your new rig down considerably.

AMD based systems like to run with the CPU, FSB and RAM speeds syncronised. So, if you choose a 333mhz CPU, Choose a RAM speed of 333mhz, (underclock the PC3200 DDR 400 and overclock it's latency timings (it may do it automatically if the BIOS configures the RAM by SPD).

------------

PRIORITY THREE :

Get a decent Power Supply Unit (PSU) of at least 400watts Peak output (if you buy a cheap one, it's nominal output will be much less than peak rating. This is important if you don't want things blowing up!)

The PSU is usually bought as part of the case. You want a 450Watt MIDI ATX Tower Case ideally. Look for a cheapy if you aren't concerned with looks..... (there are good looking cheap cases)

Get a decent Hard Drive, 80 - 120 gigabytes, 80's are cheap, however, get one with a 7200 rpm spin speed and at least ATA100 or ATA133 data speed....... Seagate, Maxtor and Western Digital drives are popular, but the spec is more important. The mainboard comes with a special IDE cable for the HDD, it has more (finer) wires in the ribbon. Don't damage it.

----------------

FREE ADVICE:  (for what it's worth)

READ the CPU and MAINBOARD installation manuals. Become familiar with the procedure before you start.
Give yourself a full day to do the build, don't rush, don't improvise.

Install the CPU once, but before you do, get a magnifier and write down every microscopic CPU ID number into the mainboard manual for later reference. Once you remove the heatsink off of the CPU, it will never cool as well again.

Assemble with the care of a master modeller.
Don't FORCE anything, take great care installing the CPU (make sure you connect the fan wire!), RAM, addon cards, etc.

Use cable ties to clean up the wiring into a neat loom AFTER everthing checks out and is running. Keep the fans clear of obstructions and wiring.

Heat rises, so input air into the bottom of the tower and extract from the top. Use an extra case fan to supply the CPU region with fresh cool air.

----------------

 

...Mainboard: Asus P5K-Premium, CPU=Intel E6850 @ x8x450fsb 3.6ghz, RAM: 4gb PC8500 Team Dark, Video: NV8800GT, HDD: 2x1Tb Samsung F3 RAID-0 + 1Tb F3, PSU: Antec 550 Basiq, OS: Win7x64, Display: 24" WS LCD
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Reply #4 - Aug 4th, 2004 at 10:19am

congo   Offline
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Make BIOS your Friend
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SOFTWARE :  (The Operating System)


Windows XP.... plain and simple. You need to set your BIOS so it boots from CDROM first, then C: drive second.

Unplug the modem cable, you don't want to connect to the net, WINXP will attempt it so dont let it.

Boot up, insert the WINXP CDROM disk. WinXP will then begin the setup, ask you to partition the Hard disk, Format the hard disk and load the operating system onto C: drive.

If you screw it up, start again, any errors, start again.

I strongly suggest making 2 partitions on your hard disk, read up on it. You don't need any software, Windows XP will handle it during setup, just enter the sizes you want when it asks. Use percentage or mb's.

After windows loads, and you have it up and running, it will probably say things like "New Hardware Found.. do you want to install..... blah blah blah...." ...... Well, cancel all that........... and then insert the disk that came with your mainboard, and run the mainboard installation program and reboot. Now you can load the other drivers. (Video, Modem, scanner etc.)

It's a good idea to leave peripherals unplugged until you get things going, this eliminates several possible troublemakers until you have the base system going.

Have Fun!

Congo
 

...Mainboard: Asus P5K-Premium, CPU=Intel E6850 @ x8x450fsb 3.6ghz, RAM: 4gb PC8500 Team Dark, Video: NV8800GT, HDD: 2x1Tb Samsung F3 RAID-0 + 1Tb F3, PSU: Antec 550 Basiq, OS: Win7x64, Display: 24" WS LCD
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Reply #5 - Aug 7th, 2004 at 12:16pm

HeavyMetal   Offline
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You asked how easy it is build and program a computer. I have built 3 in the last couple years.  2 Pentiums and my recent AMD. I never had any previous experience with it. I am not mechanically inclined in any way. In fact, when I put anything together, I always have a pile of "spare parts" left over for some reason.
I honestly never thought I could do it, but with some encouragement from  co-workers I decided to give it a try.  I couldnt believe how easy it really was. Basically, you just plug stuff in.  Everything you buy comes with some sort of instruction. The motherboard comes with a large diagram that shows where everything plugs in. All you reallt need to know is whats required to make it go. ie: motherboard, ram, cdrom, harddrive, video card ect. A visit to the local parts store, and the clerk can help out lots.
Now, I cant even fathom spending 2000 bucks on a up to date system. I can build one for half the cost and completely upgradable without buying a whole new system every 2 ot 3 years. And knowing I put it together with my own hands makes it all worthwhile.

Good luck

Speedbird_1961
 

A life?........Cool...........Where can I download one of those?&&&&The Beast:&&&&ABIT NF7-S Motherboard V2.0 400Mhz FSB&&NVIDEA nForce2 Ultra400 chipset w/MCP-T&&Athlon/XP 3200+ CPU 400mhzFSB&&WindowsXPHome SP2&&Antec TruePower 480W PSU&&Thermaltake Extreme Volcano12 Heatsink&&2X512 Dual Channel DDR400 Corsair Ram&&Maxtor Ultra ATA/133 7200rpm 120gig HDD &&ASUS V9280 Ti4200 GeForce4 128mg DDR RAM&&Sony 20
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