Search the archive:
YaBB - Yet another Bulletin Board
 
   
 
Pages: 1 
Send Topic Print
History Channel special on King Arthur (Read 135 times)
Jun 21st, 2004 at 2:02am

Webb   Ex Member
I Like Flight Simulation!

*
 
The way they have hyped this I though they had discovered the Holy Grail.  2 hours of "let's explore the myth".  I suppose they paid Patrick Stewart a ton of money to narrate it but did  anyone learn anything?
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #1 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 2:31am

Wing Nut   Offline
Colonel
Hoy-Hoy!

Gender: male
Posts: 14173
*****
 
Actually, yes I did.  I had never really understood that period of England's history, or who the Saxons or the Normans were.  I didn't know who William the Conquerer was, though I had heard of him.  Now I do.  I had certainly never heard of Hadrian's Wall, Badon Hill, the massacre at Stonehenge, or many other references that you Brits must take for granted.  All in all, I found it to be fascinating and informative.
 

HP p7-1300w
AMD Athlon II X4 650 Quad-core 3.2 Ghz
23" HP Widescreen monitor/19" Dell monitor
Windows 7 Home Premium
16 Gb DDR3 PC10600 Ram
1 Gb GeForce GTX 550Ti video card
1 TB RAID Drives

If you want to see the most beautiful girl in the world, CLICK HERE!
IP Logged
 
Reply #2 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 3:31am

denishc   Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 1018
*****
 
Quote:
Actually, yes I did.  I had never really understood that period of England's history....Now I do.  All in all, I found it to be fascinating and informative.


 I watched this same program and what the Dred Pirate said in his last post goes for me too.
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #3 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 3:40am

Hagar   Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159
*****
 
Quote:
the massacre at Stonehenge, or many other references that you Brits must take for granted.

Never heard of that one myself. ??? I wouldn't believe all they tell you on the History Channel. http://www.anima.demon.co.uk/stonehenge/

If it follows the usual Hollywood tradition this new King Arthur film will bear very little resemblance to history. Roll Eyes
 

...

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery
IP Logged
 
Reply #4 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 4:26am

denishc   Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 1018
*****
 
 As I understood the narration this was part of Briton lore, that native Brits (Celts) met Saxons to dicuss peace in an unarmed gathering.  The Saxons came to the meeting carring hidden weapons and slew over 400 Briton nobles.  Supposedly this led to the building of Stonehedge, as a monument to the fallen Brits, even thought, in reality, Stonehedge had been built many centuries prior.
 The crux of the program was to show how fact and legend had been mixed to build the lore of King Arthur.  So many historical events, along as folklore, of England were explored.

 Being a dumb Yank, I didn't know that Saxons were not native to the British Isles.  Nor that native Brits fled to the continent as the Saxons took control in England.    
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #5 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 4:42am

Hagar   Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159
*****
 
Quote:
Being a dumb Yank, I didn't know that Saxons were not native to the British Isles.  Nor that native Brits fled to the continent as the Saxons took control in England.    

I think this quote from my link says it all.
Quote:
"Much of what has been written about Stonehenge is derivative, second-rate or plain wrong."


The original Britons were tribal Celtic people & mainly driven out of what is now called England (Angle-land) to Scotland, Wales & Ireland by the Anglo-Saxon invaders from Germany. The British Isles were invaded in turn by the Romans, Saxons, Vikings & finally the Normans in 1066.
 

...

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery
IP Logged
 
Reply #6 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 5:10am

denishc   Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 1018
*****
 
Quote:
....& finally the Normans in 1066.


  Were these "Normans" descendants of Brits driven out by the Saxons?
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #7 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 5:19am

Hagar   Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159
*****
 
Quote:
Were these "Normans" descendants of Brits driven out by the Saxons?

No. I believe the Normans were of Viking ancestry & settled in a small area of France. This was known as the "Duchy of Normandy". The invaders very quickly adopted the religion, customs, and language of the surrounding French population. The duchy was run more like an independent kingdom rather than being part of France. By the 11th century it was one of the most powerful regions of western Europe.
 

...

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery
IP Logged
 
Reply #8 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 5:25am

denishc   Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 1018
*****
 
  Thanks again for the info Hagar.
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #9 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 1:34pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender: male
Posts: 12574
*****
 
Well, even though I didn't watch the documentry i've read enough about King Arthur to believe most of it is true. If you read the transcrips by Geoffry of Monmouth then you will find that King Arthur ruled soon after the romans left and a centuarys before the Angles, saxons and Vikings showed their faces. Arthur is believed to be the tribal chief that took over command of the country when the romans buggered off back to italy and is the one who kept the picts at bay for a few years. However, even though we don't know this for certain as it was the dark ages, I believe its highly possible that Arthur existed. Afterall, the romans were likely to leave one man in charge, of if they didn't one was highly likely to take charge.

Now for those who care, Arthurs last battle, was supposedly fought in Cornwall, near what is now Looe. Looe pool is the body of water where Excalibur was thrown by Sir Galihad after Arthur was mortally wounded in his showdown with Mordred and Arthure himself was supposedly buried either in the land of Lyonesse (the land ruled by Sir Tristen) or on one of the islands of the Scilly isles (there are two islands there that bear his name big arthur and little arthur).
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
IP Logged
 
Reply #10 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 2:00pm

Wing Nut   Offline
Colonel
Hoy-Hoy!

Gender: male
Posts: 14173
*****
 
According to this version, the Normans were Britons driven out of England by the Saxons, but they were driven to Northeastern France (Normandy?).  They then returned to England and used the Arthur legend to rally the remaining Britons in England to push the Saxons out.
 

HP p7-1300w
AMD Athlon II X4 650 Quad-core 3.2 Ghz
23" HP Widescreen monitor/19" Dell monitor
Windows 7 Home Premium
16 Gb DDR3 PC10600 Ram
1 Gb GeForce GTX 550Ti video card
1 TB RAID Drives

If you want to see the most beautiful girl in the world, CLICK HERE!
IP Logged
 
Reply #11 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 4:20pm

Hagar   Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159
*****
 
Quote:
According to this version, the Normans were Britons driven out of England by the Saxons, but they were driven to Northeastern France (Normandy?).  They then returned to England and used the Arthur legend to rally the remaining Britons in England to push the Saxons out.

Not being a specialist in this period of history I can only go by what I've been told or read over the years. I think it's generally agreed that the Normans (Northmen) originated in Scandanavia (Vikings). I've always understood that William of Normandy (William the Conqueror) was the bastard son of the Duke of Normandy & of Norman decent.
Quote:
William claimed the throne of England based on a promise given him by the Edward the Confessor, the Anglo-Saxon king. Having been captured by the Normans and then ransomed, Edward, according to Norman propaganda, promised to William the throne of England when he passed away. Needless to say, the throne of England was not granted to William on Edward's death, but instead fell to Harold Godwinson.

http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~dee/MA/NORMANS.HTM

As for King Arthur being a Cornishman take your pick. Depending on who you believe he is claimed by Somerset, Wales, Scotland & even France.
http://www.earlybritishkingdoms.com/arthur/places/index.html
Although there might be some truth in it I think you have to accept that it's all mainly legend & myth. A nice story though. Wink
 

...

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery
IP Logged
 
Reply #12 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 4:41pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender: male
Posts: 12574
*****
 
I wasn't saying that Arthur was a Cornishman. In fact i'd be very suprised if he was. All i'm saying is that he died in cornwall and is most likely buried somewhere in the region.
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
IP Logged
 
Reply #13 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 4:46pm

Hagar   Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159
*****
 
As I said, take your pick. None of this was documented at the time. As you pointed out earlier it was the Dark Ages.

Quote:
Arthur's Burial

Atherstone
Controversial last resting place of one of two King Arthurs according to Blackett & Wilson.

Glastonbury Abbey
Popular Tradition says Arthur was buried at Glastonbury. Or did the monks make it all up?

Mynydd-y-Gaer
Caer Caradoc of legend according to Blackett & Wilson. Discovery point of their famous 'Arthur Stone'.

Quote:
Arthur's Sleeping Place

Alderley Edge
Merlin was the Wizard of Alderley in Cheshire & Arthur sleeps nearby.

Caerleon
One of the many Arthurian traditions from the town says Arthur still sleeps nearby.

Craig-y-Ddinas
Dramatic rock formation in Glamorganshire where Arthur sleeps.

Eildon Hills
Beautiful rolling hills, in the Scottish Borders, hiding King Arthur's secret cave.

Forest of Paimpont
The heart of Breton Arthurianism, where the great man still sleeps in a secret cave.

Ogof Arthur
Mysterious cave off the dramatic Anglesey coast where Arthur lies sleepily hidden.

Ogof Llanciau Eryri
"Cave of the Young Men of Snowdon," where Arthur & his knights repose.

Richmond Castle
Yorkshire cliff-top stronghold below which Potter Thompson discovered the sleeping Arthur!

Sewingshield Crags
Runaway ball of wool finds the sleeping King along Hadrians Wall!
 

...

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery
IP Logged
 
Reply #14 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 5:03pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender: male
Posts: 12574
*****
 
Funny how none of them mention the Scilly's or Lyonesse.
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
IP Logged
 
Reply #15 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 5:18pm

Hagar   Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159
*****
 
It's all there somewhere. I suggest you check out my link. Plenty more like it if you care to do a search. I can't possibly quote all the theories.* My name ain't Merlin. Tongue Wink

*PS. They're only theories. None of it can be proven. That's what makes it a fascinating story. Wink
 

...

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery
IP Logged
 
Reply #16 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 5:48pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender: male
Posts: 12574
*****
 
I know it's facinating. It's also a story I want to get to the bottom of. Because a legend of this caliber just has to have truth to it.
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
IP Logged
 
Reply #17 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 6:07pm

Hagar   Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159
*****
 
Quote:
I know it's facinating. It's also a story I want to get to the bottom of. Because a legend of this caliber just has to have truth to it.

Aye, but there's the rub. Nobody can prove or disprove that a King named Arthur ever existed. The story was handed down by word of mouth over generations. Like all good legends I suspect it's based on different events that happened to different people in different locations over a period of time. Similar to the Viking sagas. It's a good story but nothing more. IMHO Wink

PS. It's quite possible that Arthur is buried on Cissbury Ring a few miles from where I'm sitting. I defy anyone to disprove it. 8)
 

...

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery
IP Logged
 
Reply #18 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 6:11pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender: male
Posts: 12574
*****
 
Maybe so. But likewise there's nothing to say that a man called Arthur never existed. Remember, what isn't there can be just as informative as what is. Grin


It's also possible that Arthur is buried in Lyonesse, a land swallowed up by the sea sometime within the last 1500 years. Likewise, I defy anyone to disprove it. Grin
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
IP Logged
 
Reply #19 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 6:18pm

denishc   Offline
Colonel
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 1018
*****
 
  Every legend has some truth in it.  Sadly since the reign of Arthur may have took place in the Dark Ages no documentation of it exist, only word of mouth and folk lore that were manipulated by others centuries later.
 
IP Logged
 
Reply #20 - Jun 21st, 2004 at 6:45pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender: male
Posts: 12574
*****
 
Right. Exactly my thinking. Smiley
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 
Send Topic Print