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Wheel contact points... (Read 844 times)
Jun 10th, 2004 at 2:09pm

Fozzer   Offline
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An elderly FS 2004 addict!
Hereford. England. EGBS.

Posts: 24861
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Hi all...!
This has been covered before by Roger, (Rollerball) some time ago.... 8)...!
(He even highlighted the numbers)... 8)...!
I even saved the details on my computer... Grin...!
But, as we all know, the dreaded computer crash wipes all this delightful information from our hard drives... Cry...!
So lets try it again... Wink...!
The detail necessary to alter in the Aircraft.cfg text file to move the contact points of the nose and main wheels.
Example:

[contact_points]
point.0=1,22.000000,0.000000,-6.916667,1600,0,0.57,75,0.267838,2.5,0.685009,0.00
0000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000
point.1=1,-1.083333,-7.25000,-5.916667,1600,1,0.57,0.,0.243469,2.5,0.718429,0.00
0000,0.000000,2.000000,0.000000,0.000000
point.2=1,-1.083333,7.250000,-5.916667,1600,2,0.57,0.,0.243469,2.5,0.718429,0.00
0000,0.000000,3.000000,0.000000,0.000000
point.3=2,0.000000,0.000000,0.083333,1574.803150,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.00
0000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,5.000000,0.000000,0.000000
point.4=2,0.000000,0.000000,0.083333,1574.803150,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.00
0000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,6.000000,0.000000,0.000000
static_pitch=1.994019
static_cg_height=5.907364

(In this example the nose wheel is buried in the ground up the the axle).
Which are all the numbers that require altering to raise/lower the nose and/or main wheels to contact the ground surface...?
And do the numbers need to be increased/decreased to raise/lower the wheels..?
Many thanks... 8)...!

Cheers all...!

Paul....(complicated..innit.. Roll Eyes...)...LOL...!

The actual aircraft can be seen here to illustrate the point...>>>

http://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=screen;action=display;num=...
 

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Reply #1 - Jun 10th, 2004 at 4:11pm

Gnome   Offline
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I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 244
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Hi Paul,
The very first line relates to the nosewheel and the value in front  of 1600 is vertical the position of the wheel in relation to the aircraft datum.  (First value is the position ahead of the aircraft 00 datum, probably the CG but not always, the second one it the lateral position of the wheel.)

Try altering the -6 value to -5 and see how much higher the nosewheel is.  If there is too much of a change then alter the figures after the decimal point.  you will need to reload the aircraft when you switch back to FS before you'll see any changes.
 
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Reply #2 - Jun 10th, 2004 at 4:25pm

ozzy72   Offline
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Pretty scary huh?
Madsville

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Posts: 37122
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[contact_points] section
You can configure and adjust the way aircraft reacts to different kinds of contact, including landing gear contact and articulation, braking, steering, and damage accrued through excessive speed.
You can also configure each contact point independently for each aircraft, and there is no limit to the number of points you can add. The data for configuring the points are placed in the [contact_points] section of the aircraft.cfg. When importing an aircraft that does not contain this set of data, the program will generate the data from the .air file the first time the aircraft is loaded, and then write it to the aircraft.cfg.
It may be useful to first look at the .cfg file of an existing aircraft; you can learn a lot from the many developer comments, which are followed by two slashes (//).
Each contact point contains a series of values that define the characteristics of the point, separated by commas. Each point's data set takes the form “point.n=”, where “n” is the index to the particular point, followed by the data.
Example:
[contact_points]
point.0= 1, -18.0, 0, -3.35, 3200, 0, 0.50,180, 0.25, 2.5, 0.90, 1.0, 4.0, 0, 0, 200
Below is a description of each element of the example contact point data set:

Parameter      Element      Description
1 (1)      Class      Integer defining the type of contact point:  0 = None, 1 = Wheel, 2 = Scrape, 3 = Skid, 4 = Float, 5 = Water Rudder
2 (-18.0)      Longitudinal Position      The longitudinal distance of the point from the defined reference datum (feet).  Positive is forward (out the nose).
3 (0)      Lateral Position      The lateral distance of the point from the defined reference datum (feet).  Positive is starboard (right, as viewed from the top with the airplane pointing “up”).
4 (-3.35)      Vertical Position      The vertical distance of the point from the defined reference datum (feet).  Positive is up.
5 (3200)      Impact Damage Threshold      The speed at which an impact with the ground can cause damage (feet/min).
6 (0)      Brake Map      Defines which brake input drives the brake (wheels only).  0 = None, 1 = Left Brake, 2 = Right Brake.1
7 (0.50)      Wheel Radius      Radius of the wheel (feet). 
8 (180)      Steering Angle      The maximum angle (positive and negative) that a wheel can pivot (degrees).
9 (0.25)      Static Compression      This is the distance a landing gear is compressed when the empty aircraft is at rest on the ground (feet).  This term defines the “strength” of the strut, where a smaller number will increase the “stiffness” of the strut.
10 (2.5)      Ratio of Maximum Compression to Static Compression      Ratio of the max dynamic compression available in the strut to the static value.  Can be useful in coordinating the “compression” of the strut when landing.
11 (0.90)      Damping Ratio      This ratio describes how well the ground reaction oscillations are damped.  A value of 1.0 is considered critically damped, meaning there will be little or no osciallation.  A damping ratio of 0.0 is considered undamped, meaning that the oscillations will continue with a constant magnitude.  Negative values result in an unstable ground handling situation, and values greater than 1.0 might also cause instabilities by being “over” damped.  Typical values range from 0.6 to 0.95.
12 (1.0)      Extension Time      The amount of time it takes the landing gear to fully extend under normal conditions (seconds).  A value of zero indicates a fixed gear.
13 (4.0)      Retraction Time      The amount of time it takes the landing gear to fully retract under normal conditions (seconds).  A value of zero indicates a fixed gear.
14 (0)      Sound Type      This integer value will map a point to a type of sound: 0 = Center Gear, 1 = Auxiliary Gear, 2 = Left Gear, 3 = Right Gear, 4 = Fuselage Scrape, 5 = Left Wing Scrape, 6 = Right Wing Scrape, 7 = Aux1 Scrape, 8 = Aux2 Scrape, 9 = Tail Scrape.
15 (0)      Airspeed Limit      This is the speed at which landing gear extension becomes inhibited (knots).  Not used for scrape points or non-retractable gear.
16 (200)      Damage from Airspeed      The speed above which the landing gear accrues damage (knots).  Not used for scrape points or non-retractable gear.
 

...
There are two types of aeroplane, Spitfires and everything else that wishes it was a Spitfire!
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Reply #3 - Jun 10th, 2004 at 5:38pm

Fozzer   Offline
Colonel
An elderly FS 2004 addict!
Hereford. England. EGBS.

Posts: 24861
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Hi Ozzy....
I've got a headache now... Cry...!

LOL...LOL...LOL...!

Cheers Mate... Grin...!

Paul.

I think I'll try just tilting my monitor... Roll Eyes...!
...or maybe Gnome's suggestion... Wink...?
...and stick to just doing oil changes on my bike... 8)...!
 

Dell Dimension 5000 BTX Tower. Win7 Home Edition, 32 Bit. Intel Pentium 4, dual 2.8 GHz. 2.5GB RAM, nVidia GF 9500GT 1GB. SATA 500GB + 80GB. Philips 17" LCD Monitor. Micronet ADSL Modem only. Saitek Cyborg Evo Force. FS 2004 + FSX. Briggs and Stratton Petrol Lawn Mower...Motor Bikes. Gas Cooker... and lots of musical instruments!.... ...!
Yamaha MO6,MM6,DX7,DX11,DX21,DX100,MK100,EMT10,PSR400,PSS780,Roland GW-8L v2,TR505,Casio MT-205,Korg CX3v2 dual manual,+ Leslie 760,M-Audio Prokeys88,KeyRig,Cubase,Keyfax4,Guitars,Orchestral,Baroque,Renaissance,Medieval Instruments.
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Reply #4 - Jun 10th, 2004 at 7:13pm

Gnome   Offline
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I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 244
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Everything Ozzy has said is correct.
I was just trying to keep it simple.
...and after three large Gins I am very simple.  :#}
 
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Reply #5 - Jun 11th, 2004 at 7:06am

Hagar   Offline
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My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159
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Whoa. Shocked There's such a thing as too much information Ozzy old chap. The explanation you posted is very useful but far more than Foz needs to know.

I don't who wrote it out but the guides in all Aircraft.cfg files list the entries starting with 0 (zero). For example:
       //0  Class                        
       //1  Longitudinal Position        (feet)
       //2  Lateral Position             (feet)
       //3  Vertical Position            (feet)
This could be a tad confusing for a beginner.

The exact tweak will vary depending on the aircraft. It's not possible to give general advice. It could take seconds or several hours to figure it out. If I get time I'll have a go at the Trislander myself. If I can fix it, which is by no means certain, I'll post the fix here. It would help to know which sim this is for.
 

...

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Reply #6 - Jun 11th, 2004 at 8:44am

microlight   Offline
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It's a bird...
Southern UK

Gender: male
Posts: 2236
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I hutterly agree with the point about too much info! I've just been getting me head around water contact points.

Just to add confusion: when I adjust the vertical position of the wheel contact points, I have to increase the negative number to raise the wheel! So e.g. if -9.5 is the wheel up to its axle in the ground, then -11.5 might well get it out.

Pass the Gordon's, somebody...

Grin
 

...
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Reply #7 - Jun 11th, 2004 at 11:38am

ozzy72   Offline
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Pretty scary huh?
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Sorry chaps, I just love playing with FDs, probably because I can't do any other aspect of aircraft design as I'm about as artistic as a potato Sad
 

...
There are two types of aeroplane, Spitfires and everything else that wishes it was a Spitfire!
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Reply #8 - Jun 11th, 2004 at 11:42am

Hagar   Offline
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My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159
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OK, I've installed the Trislander (to FS2002) had a quick tweak. Please try replacing point.0 under the [contact_points] section with this line.

point.0=1,22.000000,0.000000,-6.916667,1600,0,0.57,75,
0.25,1.5,0.95
,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000

The nosewheel is the correct height above ground & doesn't need changing. Basically, I've reduced the static compression & increased the damping value. The trick is to do this without making it too springy. The nosewheel will partially disappear below the ground under braking. This is quite normal as it's an older FS2000/2 model without animated suspension. Please remember this is only a quick tweak. It's a long time since I've messed around with this stuff  & I make no guarantees. Back up the original Aircraft.cfg before trying it.

PS. I've marked the changed entries blue.
 

...

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Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

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Reply #9 - Jun 12th, 2004 at 5:00am

microlight   Offline
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It's a bird...
Southern UK

Gender: male
Posts: 2236
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Ah - THAT's why the nosewheel disappears under braking sometimes! Thanks, Doug.

Smiley
 

...
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Reply #10 - Jun 14th, 2004 at 6:25pm

ubalmoral   Offline
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I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Posts: 28
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Great info on the contact points. I'm going to see if I can use it to get rid of a problem I have with a Grumman Albatross.
If you set the parking brake and run up the engines a little, not only the nose gear, but the entire nose sinks into the ground.
Forget about LANDING the thing.
Paul Shell
 
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