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Oldie Photo (Read 1377 times)
Apr 1st, 2004 at 12:20am

Tchkinjiu   Offline
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Who can tell me what this is?  Roll Eyes

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And if the writing can give you a clue, don't look at it... Tongue
 

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Reply #1 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 12:46am

Rifleman   Offline
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Looks like an A-11 or YF-12A to me or possibly a very early model of the SR-71
 

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Reply #2 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 1:15am

IcedFoxtrotter   Offline
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It is the wonderfull A-12, the most sweet plane that never was put into production. It could have been the world's sweetest nuke bomber. But nooooooo, instead it was modified and turned into the SR-71.  Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Roll Eyes

Dumass USAF. Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Cry Cry
 

A.L. Quote: Everytime you go away, it actually kinda makes my day. Everytime you leave you slam the door. You pick your words so carefully, you hate to think you're hurting me. You leave me laughing on the floor......Cause I don't give it up, I don't give a damn what you say about that. You know I don't give it up, I don't give a damn, What you say about that......&&
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Reply #3 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 3:39am

SilverFox441   Offline
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It's actually a YF-12.

Giveaways are the modified (more round) nose shape, bare-metal scheme, large greenhouse area, large central ventral fin and USAF marking (pics flipped horizontally btw). Hard to tell...but I think I can make out the shorter nose chines common to the YF-12 as well.

A-11's didn't carry USAF markings and had a thinner nose (no AI radar).

SR-71's are really dark blue. Smiley

The most sweet plane to miss production was the CF-105. The only interceptor in the world that could have brought down an XB-70...but this would have required look-down/shoot-down radar. Smiley
 

Steve (Silver Fox) Daly
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Reply #4 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 9:39am

Rifleman   Offline
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" Full size A/C are just
overgrown models ! "
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Quote:
It's actually a YF-12.

The most sweet plane to miss production was the CF-105. The only interceptor in the world that could have brought down an XB-70...but this would have required look-down/shoot-down radar. Smiley


..........which BTW Steve, the development rate of the Avro team, would surely have been a natural progression since they already had the internal weapons bay idea, which has only really come to the front in the F-117 and the F-22, although this was a feature of the F-106 in the past but not adopted on any other front line "F" models 'til the Wobbly Goblin...........
 

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Reply #5 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 10:28am
Silent Exploder   Ex Member

 
Quote:
The most sweet plane to miss production was the CF-105.


...along with the TSR2,which was,at its time,the most advanced bomber of the world. The first aircraft that came near its performance and capabilities was the Tornado in the 1980s...

But the British government wanted those F-111s,which were actually never delivered...Roll Eyes
 
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Reply #6 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 11:03am

Hagar   Offline
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Quote:
...along with the TSR2,which was,at its time,the most advanced bomber of the world. The first aircraft that came near its performance and capabilities was the Tornado in the 1980s...

But the British government wanted those F-111s,which were actually never delivered...Roll Eyes

The TSR.2 was actually under threat in favour of unmanned missiles. This turned out to be a mistake & the F-111 was seen as a cheaper alternative. This depite the development costs & the fact that the TSR.2 was already flying. It's a very similar story to the CF-105 & was the writing on the wall for the British aircraft industry.

It's interesting to speculate on "what might have been" but in truth we shall never know how successful these projects would have turned out. Many promising aircraft have been cancelled for one reason or another throughout the history of aviation. It's quite possible that some were not as good as they might have appeared. I can think of many examples of prototypes that I saw demonstrated at Farnborough in the 1950s-60s that looked promising but disappeared without trace. This was the Golden Age of British aviation & it was exciting to be a small part of it.

The cancellations were mainly due to the policies of the government in power at the time. Most politicians know very little about aviation & I suspect the same is true all over the world.

PS. Quote:
"All modern aircraft have four dimensions: span, length, height and politics. TSR.2 simply got the first three right." - Sir Sydney Camm
 

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Reply #7 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 11:39am

Hagar   Offline
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It's interesting to note that Duncan Sandys, the aviation minister whose infamous White Paper ultimately led to the demise of the British aircraft industry, was the son-in-law of Sir Winston Churchill. His policies were no doubt influenced by the fact that in 1943 he was appointed chairman of the Cabinet committee to investigate the threat posed by German rocket weapons. He had a great interest in rockets, having been involved in the deployment of the Z-batteries of anti-aircraft rockets.

Read more here. http://www.aemann.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/aircraft/hyper/sandys.html
 

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Reply #8 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 11:57am

SideWinder9   Offline
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Quote:
SR-71's are really dark blue

They are actualy black.They are painted with a special paint that will resist the heat from the speed of the plane. Smiley
 

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Reply #9 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 12:29pm
Silent Exploder   Ex Member

 
Quote:
They are actualy black.They are painted with a special paint .

...which turns dark blue at Mach 3 because of the heat.  Wink

-edit: Hagar,I took a look at the link you gave me. IMHO,this guy was dead wrong with his theory that missiles were better for an attack on the USSR than aircraft. Nevertheless,this method wouldn't have been that successful,since Russia had a missile defense system around its capital Moskau since the 1960s.
Unfortunaly,I can't find a damned article about it on the web,but I've got an article in a german aviation magazine as proof.
According to this magazine,the Russians succeeded in completely destroying a ballistic missile (including the warhead) on March 4th,1961. (Comparison: The USA were successful in 1984.)

-edit: HA! http://www.wonderland.org.nz/a-35.htm ; Shocked

-edit²: Look yourself for articles about that: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=A-35+missile+defense+...
 
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Reply #10 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 1:42pm

Hagar   Offline
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Quote:
Hagar,I took a look at the link you gave me. IMHO,this guy was dead wrong with his theory that missiles were better for an attack on the USSR than aircraft. Nevertheless,this method wouldn't have been that successful,since Russia had a missile defense system around its capital Moskau since the 1960s.

Very interesting Silent. The British government's missile policy led indirectly to the development of the Hawker P.1127 (later to become the Harrier) as a private venture. http://www.harrier.org.uk/history/history1_2.htm

It's also worth considering what effect the Hawker P.1129 had on the cancellation of the CF-105. Apparently Duncan Sandys has more to answer for than I realised. Roll Eyes
Quote:
It was about this time that again the financiers pulled a lever and made a rather bold recommendation to the UK Government. The House of Commons Select Committee on Estimates issued a report calling for a forced reduction in the number of British Aerospace manufacturers through equally forced amalgamations. The term monopoly motivations should come to mind. Perhaps the term financial controlling interest might also spring to mind. As such it was demanded that Hawker Siddeley Group members withdraw their various submissions and submit a single aircraft. The P.1129 was submitted in January of 1958 and any Avro Arrow submission died with it. There can be little doubt that while being an excellent aircraft design, the P.1129 did not have the flexibility of the CF-105.


Sadly this is all irrelevant now & pure speculation.
 

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Reply #11 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 2:43pm

IcedFoxtrotter   Offline
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I've seen 2 in person, they are BLACK.
 

A.L. Quote: Everytime you go away, it actually kinda makes my day. Everytime you leave you slam the door. You pick your words so carefully, you hate to think you're hurting me. You leave me laughing on the floor......Cause I don't give it up, I don't give a damn what you say about that. You know I don't give it up, I don't give a damn, What you say about that......&&
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Reply #12 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 2:49pm

IcedFoxtrotter   Offline
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...
 

A.L. Quote: Everytime you go away, it actually kinda makes my day. Everytime you leave you slam the door. You pick your words so carefully, you hate to think you're hurting me. You leave me laughing on the floor......Cause I don't give it up, I don't give a damn what you say about that. You know I don't give it up, I don't give a damn, What you say about that......&&
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Reply #13 - Apr 1st, 2004 at 3:30pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
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Dude, that'll be a black and white photo. Roll Eyes


 

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Reply #14 - Apr 2nd, 2004 at 12:06am

Tchkinjiu   Offline
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Wow, these forums have incredibly knowledgeble people in here. I think applause is in order here?  Grin

I am terrible at naming planes, but was searching around until I came across this pic. Here's their name for it...                 YF-12 A-12

So a lot of people were right on this one, but then we got around to the color of it and and to the A-35 Missle Defence System in Germany?...  Grin
 

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Reply #15 - Apr 2nd, 2004 at 2:27am

IcedFoxtrotter   Offline
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Good lord. Do you openly think I am a twit or something? Angry Roll Eyes

I have stood next to two seperate SR-71's, each belonging to seperate services, both of which were painted with, surprise! Black paint. Roll Eyes

I remembered it being called an A-12 somewhere, that is why I called it that. And why I didn't correct my earlier post.
« Last Edit: Apr 2nd, 2004 at 4:01am by IcedFoxtrotter »  

A.L. Quote: Everytime you go away, it actually kinda makes my day. Everytime you leave you slam the door. You pick your words so carefully, you hate to think you're hurting me. You leave me laughing on the floor......Cause I don't give it up, I don't give a damn what you say about that. You know I don't give it up, I don't give a damn, What you say about that......&&
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Reply #16 - Apr 2nd, 2004 at 2:53am
Silent Exploder   Ex Member

 
Quote:
....and to the A-35 Missle Defence System in Germany?...  Grin


GODDAMMIT,DUDE!

For the 10395th time: THAT F*CKIN MISSILE DEFENSE SYSTEM IS IN RUSSIA ,NOT GERMANY!!!

Angry Angry Angry Angry
 
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Reply #17 - Apr 2nd, 2004 at 3:56am

IcedFoxtrotter   Offline
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What...... isn't Gemany a province of Russia? Isn't it the same difference?
 

A.L. Quote: Everytime you go away, it actually kinda makes my day. Everytime you leave you slam the door. You pick your words so carefully, you hate to think you're hurting me. You leave me laughing on the floor......Cause I don't give it up, I don't give a damn what you say about that. You know I don't give it up, I don't give a damn, What you say about that......&&
...
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Reply #18 - Apr 2nd, 2004 at 6:14pm

Tchkinjiu   Offline
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Quote:
GODDAMMIT,DUDE!

For the 10395th time: THAT F*CKIN MISSILE DEFENSE SYSTEM IS IN RUSSIA ,NOT GERMANY!!!

Angry Angry Angry Angry


I'm sorry if I didn't read it word for word! I had to scan through it all. Man, calm down now...
 

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Reply #19 - Apr 2nd, 2004 at 6:40pm

Crumbso   Offline
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K man you and Iced are getting a bit indignant.

You know what he is saying is that on the ground it is black but when flying at about Mach 3 it gets a little toasty because of the friction created. This heat causes a chemical reaction that turns the paint blue. From what I hear the SR-71 is a different beast in the air to what it is on the ground Wink

As allways Hagar has the info that we need to know.
 
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Reply #20 - Apr 2nd, 2004 at 7:04pm

Hagar   Offline
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OK, calm down guys. Foxtrotter won't be bothering anyone again.

Quote:
As allways Hagar has the info that we need to know.

I'm not infallible & know very little about the SR-71 or modern US aircraft for that matter. I did a quick search & most people seem to agree that the special paint is black but it's not properly cured until the aircraft has flown for a couple of hours. (Some modellers have suggested that it's actually dark blue as SiverFox mentioned.) After curing the shade is slightly different. This is why a freshly painted aircraft in a museum would not be the same shade as an operational one. In the same way any major touch-up jobs would require the complete aircraft to be stripped & repainted.

PS. I was once told there is no such shade as black. Wink
 

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Reply #21 - Apr 2nd, 2004 at 7:21pm

Crumbso   Offline
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Well as I understand it no socks are ever black. They are just very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very dark blue

EDIT: that need not apply to priests socks
 
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Reply #22 - Apr 2nd, 2004 at 7:26pm

Hagar   Offline
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LOL Grin

I also understand that there are so many shades of "black" paint that this is the most difficult colour to match.

Moral: Never buy a black car. Wink
 

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Reply #23 - Apr 3rd, 2004 at 8:30am
Silent Exploder   Ex Member

 
Quote:
I'm sorry if I didn't read it word for word! I had to scan through it all. Man, calm down now...


Sorry,pal. I've overreacted,because I was really peed off by Foxtrotters postings.
Sorry again...
 
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Reply #24 - Apr 3rd, 2004 at 10:39am

Hagar   Offline
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As an example, this is my own little "roller skate". What colour do you think it is?

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Reply #25 - Apr 3rd, 2004 at 12:33pm
Silent Exploder   Ex Member

 
An extremely dark blue,but no black! Grin
 
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Reply #26 - Apr 3rd, 2004 at 12:52pm

Hagar   Offline
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Quote:
An extremely dark blue,but no black! Grin

This has fooled everyone I've asked & illustrates my point. Although it looks black or various shades of blue depending on the light, the colour is officially named Nordic Green. There is actually very little green in the paint at all. It's just possible to see small flecks of green in the metallic finish if you look closely enough in bright sunlight. Roll Eyes
 

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Reply #27 - Apr 4th, 2004 at 3:49pm

Crumbso   Offline
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What kind of car is that man?

I just can't work it out  ???
 
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Reply #28 - Apr 4th, 2004 at 4:04pm

Hagar   Offline
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Mazda 323 GLX Auto. Reliable & economical to run. The 3-door model is quite rare. Looks small but I can get more in there than some estate cars I could mention. Wink

I've had it a few years now but it suits me. If I get another car it will probably be the same make. I always fancied an MX5. Wink
 

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Reply #29 - Apr 4th, 2004 at 5:21pm

Crumbso   Offline
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I think their new MX-8 always looks quite enticing.
 
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Reply #30 - Apr 4th, 2004 at 11:21pm

tsunami_KNUW   Offline
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Quote:
I've seen 2 in person, they are BLACK.


I've seen one in real life too. Wasn't there only three made?
 

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Reply #31 - Apr 12th, 2004 at 12:30am

robbo1   Offline
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Quote:
I've seen one in real life too. Wasn't there only three made?


No.
 
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Reply #32 - Apr 12th, 2004 at 10:35am

Hagar   Offline
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I found this interesting site that should tell you all you want to know about the Blackbird variants. http://www.sr-71.org/

It appears that 50 were built including the A-12, M-21, YF-12A, SR-71A, SR-71B & SR-71C. I was surprised to see that 20 of these were lost with a number of crew fatalities.
 

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Reply #33 - Apr 14th, 2004 at 11:53am

RIC_BARKER   Offline
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OK.  Just to clear this up once and for all!

The Blackbird is, in fact...                               
INDIGO BLUE


The paint code is "FS35402 Indigo Blue"

They are indigo blue on the ground. They are indigo blue in the sky. They are indigo blue when hot. They are indigo blue when cold.

The colour actually comes from tiny Iron beads in the paint used to absorb radio waves (radar). They also have the beneficial property of acting as a heat sink for the airframe. If you ever get to see an SR-71, feel it. It's rough - that's the iron beads.

Ric B.
 
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