Simviation Forum - Oldie Photo

Apr 1^st, 2004 at 12:20am

Tchkinjiu Offline
Colonel
"Toph"
Aberystwyth

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Who can tell me what this is? Roll Eyes

And if the writing can give you a clue, don't look at it... Tongue

"Have compassion for all beings, rich and poor alike; each has their suffering. Some suffer too much, others too little."

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Reply #1 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 12:46am

Rifleman Offline
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" Full size A/C are just
overgrown models ! "
Tropical island in the Pacific

Posts: 6622

Looks like an A-11 or YF-12A to me or possibly a very early model of the SR-71

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Reply #2 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 1:15am

IcedFoxtrotter Offline
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If only I could find a
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It is the wonderfull A-12, the most sweet plane that never was put into production. It could have been the world's sweetest nuke bomber. But nooooooo, instead it was modified and turned into the SR-71. Angry

Dumass USAF. Angry

A.L. Quote: Everytime you go away, it actually kinda makes my day. Everytime you leave you slam the door. You pick your words so carefully, you hate to think you're hurting me. You leave me laughing on the floor......Cause I don't give it up, I don't give a damn what you say about that. You know I don't give it up, I don't give a damn, What you say about that......&&

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Reply #3 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 3:39am

SilverFox441 Offline
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Now What?
Mississauga, Ontario, Canada

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It's actually a YF-12.

Giveaways are the modified (more round) nose shape, bare-metal scheme, large greenhouse area, large central ventral fin and USAF marking (pics flipped horizontally btw). Hard to tell...but I think I can make out the shorter nose chines common to the YF-12 as well.

A-11's didn't carry USAF markings and had a thinner nose (no AI radar).

SR-71's are really dark blue.

The most sweet plane to miss production was the CF-105. The only interceptor in the world that could have brought down an XB-70...but this would have required look-down/shoot-down radar.

Steve (Silver Fox) Daly

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Reply #4 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 9:39am

Rifleman Offline
Colonel
" Full size A/C are just
overgrown models ! "
Tropical island in the Pacific

Posts: 6622

Quote:

It's actually a YF-12.

The most sweet plane to miss production was the CF-105. The only interceptor in the world that could have brought down an XB-70...but this would have required look-down/shoot-down radar.

..........which BTW Steve, the development rate of the Avro team, would surely have been a natural progression since they already had the internal weapons bay idea, which has only really come to the front in the F-117 and the F-22, although this was a feature of the F-106 in the past but not adopted on any other front line "F" models 'til the Wobbly Goblin...........

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Reply #5 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 10:28am

Silent Exploder Ex Member

Quote:

The most sweet plane to miss production was the CF-105.

...along with the TSR2,which was,at its time,the most advanced bomber of the world. The first aircraft that came near its performance and capabilities was the Tornado in the 1980s...

But the British government wanted those F-111s,which were actually never delivered... Roll Eyes

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Reply #6 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 11:03am

Hagar Offline
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My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159

Quote:

...along with the TSR2,which was,at its time,the most advanced bomber of the world. The first aircraft that came near its performance and capabilities was the Tornado in the 1980s...

But the British government wanted those F-111s,which were actually never delivered... Roll Eyes

The TSR.2 was actually under threat in favour of unmanned missiles. This turned out to be a mistake & the F-111 was seen as a cheaper alternative. This depite the development costs & the fact that the TSR.2 was already flying. It's a very similar story to the CF-105 & was the writing on the wall for the British aircraft industry.

It's interesting to speculate on "what might have been" but in truth we shall never know how successful these projects would have turned out. Many promising aircraft have been cancelled for one reason or another throughout the history of aviation. It's quite possible that some were not as good as they might have appeared. I can think of many examples of prototypes that I saw demonstrated at Farnborough in the 1950s-60s that looked promising but disappeared without trace. This was the Golden Age of British aviation & it was exciting to be a small part of it.

The cancellations were mainly due to the policies of the government in power at the time. Most politicians know very little about aviation & I suspect the same is true all over the world.

PS. Quote:

"All modern aircraft have four dimensions: span, length, height and politics. TSR.2 simply got the first three right." - Sir Sydney Camm

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Reply #7 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 11:39am

Hagar Offline
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My Spitfire Girl
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It's interesting to note that Duncan Sandys, the aviation minister whose infamous White Paper ultimately led to the demise of the British aircraft industry, was the son-in-law of Sir Winston Churchill. His policies were no doubt influenced by the fact that in 1943 he was appointed chairman of the Cabinet committee to investigate the threat posed by German rocket weapons. He had a great interest in rockets, having been involved in the deployment of the Z-batteries of anti-aircraft rockets.

Read more here. http://www.aemann.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/aircraft/hyper/sandys.html

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Reply #8 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 11:57am

SideWinder9 Offline
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Denver,CO

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Quote:

SR-71's are really dark blue

They are actualy black.They are painted with a special paint that will resist the heat from the speed of the plane.

Sim-V member since 2003!

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Reply #9 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 12:29pm

Silent Exploder Ex Member

Quote:

They are actualy black.They are painted with a special paint .

...which turns dark blue at Mach 3 because of the heat. Wink

-edit: Hagar,I took a look at the link you gave me. IMHO,this guy was dead wrong with his theory that missiles were better for an attack on the USSR than aircraft. Nevertheless,this method wouldn't have been that successful,since Russia had a missile defense system around its capital Moskau since the 1960s.
Unfortunaly,I can't find a damned article about it on the web,but I've got an article in a german aviation magazine as proof.
According to this magazine,the Russians succeeded in completely destroying a ballistic missile (including the warhead) on March 4th,1961. (Comparison: The USA were successful in 1984.)

-edit: HA! http://www.wonderland.org.nz/a-35.htm ; Shocked

-edit²: Look yourself for articles about that: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=A-35+missile+defense+...

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Reply #10 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 1:42pm

Hagar Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159

Quote:

Hagar,I took a look at the link you gave me. IMHO,this guy was dead wrong with his theory that missiles were better for an attack on the USSR than aircraft. Nevertheless,this method wouldn't have been that successful,since Russia had a missile defense system around its capital Moskau since the 1960s.

Very interesting Silent. The British government's missile policy led indirectly to the development of the Hawker P.1127 (later to become the Harrier) as a private venture. http://www.harrier.org.uk/history/history1_2.htm

It's also worth considering what effect the Hawker P.1129 had on the cancellation of the CF-105. Apparently Duncan Sandys has more to answer for than I realised. Roll Eyes

Quote:

It was about this time that again the financiers pulled a lever and made a rather bold recommendation to the UK Government. The House of Commons Select Committee on Estimates issued a report calling for a forced reduction in the number of British Aerospace manufacturers through equally forced amalgamations. The term monopoly motivations should come to mind. Perhaps the term financial controlling interest might also spring to mind. As such it was demanded that Hawker Siddeley Group members withdraw their various submissions and submit a single aircraft. The P.1129 was submitted in January of 1958 and any Avro Arrow submission died with it. There can be little doubt that while being an excellent aircraft design, the P.1129 did not have the flexibility of the CF-105.

Sadly this is all irrelevant now & pure speculation.

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Reply #11 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 2:43pm

IcedFoxtrotter Offline
Colonel
If only I could find a
girl as pretty as this....
N.W. American Rockies

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I've seen 2 in person, they are BLACK.

A.L. Quote: Everytime you go away, it actually kinda makes my day. Everytime you leave you slam the door. You pick your words so carefully, you hate to think you're hurting me. You leave me laughing on the floor......Cause I don't give it up, I don't give a damn what you say about that. You know I don't give it up, I don't give a damn, What you say about that......&&

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Reply #12 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 2:49pm

IcedFoxtrotter Offline
Colonel
If only I could find a
girl as pretty as this....
N.W. American Rockies

Gender:
Posts: 612

A.L. Quote: Everytime you go away, it actually kinda makes my day. Everytime you leave you slam the door. You pick your words so carefully, you hate to think you're hurting me. You leave me laughing on the floor......Cause I don't give it up, I don't give a damn what you say about that. You know I don't give it up, I don't give a damn, What you say about that......&&

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Reply #13 - Apr 1^st, 2004 at 3:30pm

Woodlouse2002 Offline
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I like jam.
Cornwall, England

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Dude, that'll be a black and white photo. Roll Eyes

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!

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Reply #14 - Apr 2^nd, 2004 at 12:06am

Tchkinjiu Offline
Colonel
"Toph"
Aberystwyth

Gender:
Posts: 1187

Wow, these forums have incredibly knowledgeble people in here. I think applause is in order here? Grin

I am terrible at naming planes, but was searching around until I came across this pic. Here's their name for it... YF-12 A-12

So a lot of people were right on this one, but then we got around to the color of it and and to the A-35 Missle Defence System in Germany?... Grin

"Have compassion for all beings, rich and poor alike; each has their suffering. Some suffer too much, others too little."

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