Simviation Forum - Identity crisis

Reply #15 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 11:47am

Steve-O Ex Member

Is it a Seafire II fitted with a tropical filter and clipped wings?

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #16 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 11:56am

ozzy72 Offline
Global Moderator
Pretty scary huh?
Madsville

Gender:
Posts: 37122

Steve-O wins the Clever Clogs award, it is indeed a Seafire II with the clipped wings (incredibly rare!) and the Vokes filter.
Well done that man Wink

Oh and this photo was taken in '44 at a small refit base in France.

Ozzy

There are two types of aeroplane, Spitfires and everything else that wishes it was a Spitfire!

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #17 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 12:03pm

HawkerTempest5 Offline
Colonel
Hawker Tempest MK V
United Kingdom

Gender:
Posts: 3149

When Mark first sent me this photo it was a real mystery! Seafire LF MkIIc with trop filter and invasion stripes. Shame I can't see it's code letters (other than the aircraft letter) and serial numbers as it would make a great subject for a model.

Flying Legends

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #18 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 4:16pm

Woodlouse2002 Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender:
Posts: 12574

But what about the helmet on the dude with his hands up... It certainly isn't british.

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #19 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 4:57pm

HawkerTempest5 Offline
Colonel
Hawker Tempest MK V
United Kingdom

Gender:
Posts: 3149

Quote:

But what about the helmet on the dude with his hands up... It certainly isn't british.

Maybe he's French? The chaps sitting on and holding the wing look like they have British Army helmets on and you can see at least four Spit IX's behind so it's certainly a British facility.
I should point out that this is the only picture of a IIc with a trop filter I've ever seen. And the fact that it's obviously being used in the European theater just deepens the mystery.

« Last Edit: Mar 6^th, 2004 at 6:57pm by HawkerTempest5 »

Flying Legends

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #20 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 5:06pm

ozzy72 Offline
Global Moderator
Pretty scary huh?
Madsville

Gender:
Posts: 37122

Roger I've been pondering this little mystery for a while, do you think it might be one of the ones built and allocated to N. Africa or the Malta campaign that didn't get delivered?
I think the lid on the guy in the foreground of the shot is French. Although my knowledge of French headgear is rather limited......

Mark

There are two types of aeroplane, Spitfires and everything else that wishes it was a Spitfire!

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #21 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 5:12pm

Hagar Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159

The only FAA Squadron equipped with the Seafire IIc on the appropriate date appears to have been 807.
http://www.fleetairarmarchive.net/Squadrons/807.html
Quote:

Aircraft

Fulmar I Sept 1940-April 1941
Fulmar II April 1941-June 1942
Sea Hurricane Nov 1941- Nov 1941
Seafire Ib June 1942 -Sept 1942
SeafireL.IIc June 1942 -Oct 1944
SeafireL.III June 1944 -end of WW2

Quote:

the whole squadron took part in the South of France Operation Dragoon landings in HMS Hunter in August 1944, when the squadron inflicted considerable damage to locomotives and road transport.

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #22 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 5:12pm

Woodlouse2002 Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender:
Posts: 12574

It's not a french lid, i'm quite sure of that. I'm thinking that it might be Italian. There would certainly be more need for a tropical filter in Italy.

Also the fact that this aircraft is a Seafire MkII with filter etc. Surely your going on the type of aircraft it is by the caption to the picture where ever you got it from? Therefore it could very easily be a mistake.

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #23 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 5:19pm

ozzy72 Offline
Global Moderator
Pretty scary huh?
Madsville

Gender:
Posts: 37122

I doubt it, as the info comes from a friend who is an aircraft historian!!!
I think the helmet could be Dutch? Its not the Adrian (French) as that has a large strip front to back over the top... Hmm the helmet is proving more of a challenge than the plane Grin

Hmm your ID makes sense Doug, but I'm trying to get more info out of my friend at the moment... Like Roger said, it could be an interesting project, now do Airfix make a Seafire II kit? 8)

There are two types of aeroplane, Spitfires and everything else that wishes it was a Spitfire!

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #24 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 5:33pm

Hagar Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159

How about a caption for that photo. Here's mine. Wink

Don't shoot guys - I'll come quietly. Cheesy

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #25 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 5:38pm

Woodlouse2002 Offline
Colonel
I like jam.
Cornwall, England

Gender:
Posts: 12574

Quote:

I think the helmet could be Dutch? Its not the Adrian (French) as that has a large strip front to back over the top... Hmm the helmet is proving more of a challenge than the plane Grin

If the infomation Hagar say's is true then that aircraft should be in the south of france. So a long way from Holland. What did the Vichy frech helmets look like? If its not that then i'm sticking with Italian.

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #26 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 5:45pm

ozzy72 Offline
Global Moderator
Pretty scary huh?
Madsville

Gender:
Posts: 37122

The Adrian was used by both sides of the French and had its origins in WWI.
Could be one of the Dutch units that fought alongside the British, or it could be a capitulated Italian.... Hmm I really am flumoxed by this one....

Mark

There are two types of aeroplane, Spitfires and everything else that wishes it was a Spitfire!

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #27 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 5:48pm

Hagar Offline
Colonel
My Spitfire Girl
Costa Geriatrica

Posts: 33159

I missed the most important part that could explain the tropical filter & the helmet. Here it is in full.

Quote:

Squadron detachments were lent to the Desert Air Force in Italy for several weeks in April 1944, then the whole squadron took part in the South of France Operation Dragoon landings in HMS Hunter in August 1944, when the squadron inflicted considerable damage to locomotives and road transport.

Airfix only do the 1/48th scale FR.47. You would have to modify a Spitfire. They do a Mk Vb. http://www.modernmodels.com/airfix001.htm

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group

Need help? Try Grumpy's Lair

My photo gallery

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #28 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 6:09pm

ozzy72 Offline
Global Moderator
Pretty scary huh?
Madsville

Gender:
Posts: 37122

Ah mystery solved as to the kites ID, but the helmet still puzzles....
Oh and I've got the Seafire III model by Airfix thanks Hagar, I'm painting the parts ready for assembly at the moment Wink

Ozzy

There are two types of aeroplane, Spitfires and everything else that wishes it was a Spitfire!

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #29 - Mar 6^th, 2004 at 6:22pm

Silent Exploder Ex Member

Definately not italian.
http://www.italianfront.com/reproheadgrPg2.htm

German helmets looked similar to this one,but only the ones from the eastern side after WW2. Wink

Back to top

IP Logged

	Search the archive: