Simviation Forum - What's with the joy sticks?

Reply #15 - Jan 7^th, 2004 at 8:04pm

Scotch Offline
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Denver, CO

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I flew with a South Paw H-2 Pilot in the Navy and he loved setting in the right seat. He could do everything a right handed pilot could do AND write legable notes on his knee board w/o removing his right hand off the cyclic.

I think there were a couple if WWII fighter's with yokes but the P-38 and I think the Mosquito are the only two that comes to mind. Oh, what about the......um... the one the Russians loved so much.

I'd rather have a yoke but if someone were to turn me lose on a Carbonaero I'm sure I'd adjust.

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Reply #16 - Jan 8^th, 2004 at 3:41am

OTTOL Offline
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Quote:

I've had this argument with left-handers in the past & will most likely do so again. Maybe OTTOL will confirm it but I never heard a pilot complain about the position of the controls on an aircraft. I worked for a flying school for 2 years & the fact that a pupil was left or right handed never occurred to me & I don't remember the subject cropping up.

The joysticks on most WWII RAF fighters had a "spade grip" which could be held comfortably with either hand. This was important on aircraft like the Spitfire where the pilot had to change hands on the stick just after taking off in order to raise the gear.

Unfortunately, I haven't had the good fortune to fly anything new enough to have a joystick. I have flown a Pitts(with the classic center mounted control stick)and the transition took, literally, seconds! Similar issues have occured with yoke equipped aircraft though(dealing more with position of the pilot, not the controlling device). When training for the CFI, the biggest issue focused on, is the transition from left to right seat. After about five to ten hours though, it's back to buisness as usual. The same occured with transitioning BACK to the left seat in a jet after flying as a First Officer for 3 years. Again the transition was quick and painless. I think Loomex's point sums it up best. Most of us fly our computers with a joystick. Most of us are quickly able to adapt to change involving dextrous adaptation. I recently read that 80% or more of our manual flying skill is learned in the first 10-20 hours of flying. Obviously it doesn't take the body very long to learn some new tricks.

.....so I loaded up the plane and moved to Middle-EEEE..........OIL..that is......

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Reply #17 - Jan 8^th, 2004 at 4:26am

Hagar Offline
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My Spitfire Girl
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Unfortunately, I haven't had the good fortune to fly anything new enough to have a joystick. I have flown a Pitts(with the classic center mounted control stick)

The old-fashioned centre-mounted control stick is what I've always thought of as a joystick with regards to an aircraft. This was the origin of the term in the first place. I think that game controllers being commonly called joysticks causes some confusion. I'm almost sure there's a correct technical term for the control input devices used on modern fly-by-wire aircraft but I forget what that is. I've seen some that resemble the sticks on a R/C transmitter more than a gaming joystick.

I taxyed various types of light aircraft every working day for some 2 years & also flew them occasionally. Some had tandem cockpits where the controls were set up the same in both & others had side-by-side seating. Both types had a conventional joystick between the legs. I don't remember a problem with the left-hand seat in side-by-side trainers where the controls are basically reversed - with the throttle in the centre. As I always tell left-handers - they don't make left & right hand drive options for aircraft. You have to get used to what you're given.

If you think about it, the same applies to cars. When I've been in the US driving a car is like being in the left hand seat in an aircraft. It takes only a few minutes to get used to it.

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Reply #18 - Jan 8^th, 2004 at 1:44pm

OTTOL Offline
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The old-fashioned centre-mounted control stick is what I've always thought of as a joystick with regards to an aircraft. This was the origin of the term in the first place. I think that game controllers being commonly called joysticks causes some confusion. I'm almost sure there's a correct technical term for the control input devices used on modern fly-by-wire aircraft but I forget what that is. I've seen some that resemble the sticks on a R/C transmitter more than a gaming joystick.

Did someone say "bonnet"? Once again culture throws a wrench in. I've always considered a "joystick" to be a short little plastic or composite controlling device, but then again years ago I argued with my father that "conventional" meant tricycle gear as opposed to a tail wheel aircraft. Of course I later learned that I was wrong. But that was a matter of age. I grew up in an era when tricycle IS the conventional style. So I think THIS is a matter of Generational as well as geographically influenced syntax. I DO think that SCOTCH was referring to the current definition though(ref. his picture).

.....so I loaded up the plane and moved to Middle-EEEE..........OIL..that is......

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Reply #19 - Jan 8^th, 2004 at 2:06pm

Hagar Offline
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My Spitfire Girl
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Quote:

Did someone say "bonnet"? Once again culture throws a wrench in. I've always considered a "joystick" to be a short little plastic or composite controlling device, but then again years ago I argued with my father that "conventional" meant tricycle gear as opposed to a tail wheel aircraft. Of course I later learned that I was wrong. But that was a matter of age. I grew up in an era when tricycle IS the conventional style. So I think THIS is a matter of Generational as well as geographically influenced syntax. I DO think that SCOTCH was referring to the current definition though(ref. his picture).

Hi OTTOL. I think you're missing my point. OK, I realise I'm a lot older than you & agree that might have something to do with it. Tongue

Aviation terms are pretty much international nowadays so there's no cultural difference as such. You've never known a time when a joystick only referred to the control stick in an aircraft. I can remember when the first light aircraft appeared featuring yokes instead of joysticks. I believe the first one I saw was a Cessna. These were combined with tricycle gear & many experienced pilots didn't like the idea at all. Some still don't. Roll Eyes

I know what Scotch is referring to & these might well be called joysticks now. I had an idea there is a different name but could be wrong. I was just attempting to distinguish beween these & gaming joysticks & make sure we're all talking about the same thing. Wink

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Reply #20 - Jan 8^th, 2004 at 2:11pm

Craig. Offline
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Birmingham

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Hagar, most pilots who fly airbus aircraft call them sidesticks, so you are correct in believing they have a differant name. but i guess its just a personal preferance.
if i am missing some sort of sarcasm on your part, i appologise in advance:)

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Reply #21 - Jan 8^th, 2004 at 2:17pm

Hagar Offline
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My Spitfire Girl
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Quote:

Hagar, most pilots who fly airbus aircraft call them sidesticks, so you are correct in believing they have a differant name. but i guess its just a personal preferance.
if i am missing some sort of sarcasm on your part, i appologise in advance:)

Ah thanks Craig. That is indeed what they're called. Wink

I would hope that I'm never sarcastic. I might take a little pop at people sometimes but only in fun. Tongue

PS. As I understand it, the term joystick originated during WWI.
Quote:

Even the word joystick, which is used more around computers these days, is actually an aircraft term. In early biplanes, the controller wasn't a steering wheel, it was an upright rod in the middle of the cockpit that controlled movement in three dimensions. It came up between the pilot's legs. The reason the they called it a joystick was because it was well, standing erect there right between the pilot's legs and gripped in a very similar way as if you had ahold of your, umm, you know, a joystick!

My point is that if this is correct, it would be wrong to call a sidestick a joystick. Wink

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