Simviation Forum - Sound possibilities

Oct 31^st, 2003 at 7:29am

Smoke2much Offline
Colonel
The Unrepentant Heretic
Sittingbourne, Kent,

Posts: 3879

PH_AJH has bought up an interesting possibility.

Check this out.

http://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=fs2002;action=display;num=...

Will

Who switched the lights off? I can't see a thing....... Hold on, my eyes were closed. Oops, my bad...............&&

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #1 - Oct 31^st, 2003 at 4:31pm

PH_AJH Ex Member

well...I was asking if it is possible.
If any of you know the answer....please tell me.

AJ

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #2 - Oct 31^st, 2003 at 10:54pm

JBaymore Offline
Global Moderator
Under the curse of the
hombuilt cockpit!

Gender:
Posts: 10261

Will + PH_AJH,

You are darn right that I am interested in this. I have been thinking about this whole subject myself..... wondering about how Microsoft has the various sound "channels" set up internally..... if they are ever like a multi-track recorder....... and how to get those "tracks" out of the sim to separate line outs.

If you can separate them........ the possible simulation effects would be AWESOME.......... just as you listed. Engines come from the sides...... wheel rumble from the subwoofer from the underside....... panel sounds from the panel........ ATC from the headset....and so on.

With the multi PC setup in my cockpit...... I am already able to "position" various sound sources a bit. The copilot will "say" the callouts from the right seat. Some panel alerts will actually comer from the panel. But splitting up the internal fs2004 sounds would be the icing on the cake.

Let's hope that if WE are thinking about it....... others are too.... and someone will "crack" the nut.

best,

..................john

Intel i7 960 quad 3.2G LGA 1366, Asus P6X58D Premium, 750W Corsair, 6 gig 1600 DDR3, Spinpoint 1TB 7200 HD, Caviar 500G 7200 HD, GTX275 1280M, Logitec Z640, Win7 Pro 64b, CH Products yoke, pedals + throttle quad, simpit

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #3 - Nov 1^st, 2003 at 10:42am

PH_AJH Ex Member

I've been thinking about it.
My question comes from online flying with Vatsim, using the program Roger Wilco for communications. I would like to separate this from engine sounds etc because speech is far better heard through a headphone
I was thinking: my FS2k2 uses wav files for sound, Roger Wilco does not as it's real time speech (or am I wrong here?). Plus: Roger Wilco gives you the possibility to select a sound device for both in- and output.
So I think there are two chances to succes. First one is separating the different file formats, second Roger Wilco's setup options for selecting an output device.....
Would it be possible to let FS use my soundcard (with the speakers connected) and Roger Wilco my still existent onboard sound device with the headphones connected to them??
I'll try and let you know. Separating channels from within FS will be a lot more challenging I guess.

Any ideas, hints, tips or suggestions welcome!

Cheers
AJ

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #4 - Nov 1^st, 2003 at 11:13am

JBaymore Offline
Global Moderator
Under the curse of the
hombuilt cockpit!

Gender:
Posts: 10261

AJ,

There may be another way to do what you want with Roger Wilco. I haven't tried this .... just thinking out loud Wink

.

Using FSUIPC and WideFS you can use multiple PC's on a LAN to communicate with the sim. That is the basis behind "glass cockpits" for homebrew stuff. So there might be a way ( think I read about it somewhere) to put RW on one of the other PC's...... using it's soundcard for the RW sound driving the headset..... and leave the FS sound on the main PC driving speakers via it's sound card.

The second PC likely can be a junker throwaway PII at 500 mhz or so. Those work for a lot of other glass cockpit usages. A new wired LAN network card can be had for about $5 these days...... a 5 port hub for about $20. The FSUIPC / WideFS combo is about $35.

Then there is also the new FSDConnect....... a "freeware" version of FSUIPC...... not sure if they have an equivalent of WideFS yet. But I expect they will eventually.

best,

..................john

Intel i7 960 quad 3.2G LGA 1366, Asus P6X58D Premium, 750W Corsair, 6 gig 1600 DDR3, Spinpoint 1TB 7200 HD, Caviar 500G 7200 HD, GTX275 1280M, Logitec Z640, Win7 Pro 64b, CH Products yoke, pedals + throttle quad, simpit

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #5 - Nov 1^st, 2003 at 12:33pm

PH_AJH Ex Member

Guess what..it works! Grin

In the control panel I activated both my DMX XFire card and the AC97 sound device that comes with my mobo. I expected this to result in a hardware conflict but to my surprise it didn't.
Then I configured Roger Wilco to use AC97 for playback, and the XFire card for recording.
Next I connected my headphone to the mobo sound output, PC speakers and mic to the soundcard.
Fired up FS2002 and Roger Wilco...bingo. All simulator sounds from the speakers, communication from the headset.

Works great. Speech is far better heard without all simulator sounds mixed with them, while all the aircraft sound are well audible but muted - like in the real world.

Thanks for thinking with me.

Cheers
AJ

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #6 - Nov 3^rd, 2003 at 2:36am

Vchat20 Offline
Colonel
Living in my virtual reality
so you don't have to.

Gender:
Posts: 57

i havent really looked into it, but is there a way you can limit what sounds fs2k4 can play. for example, limiting it to just play the engine sounds so that the first computer can have its speakers placed both to the left and back of you and the other to the right and back of you. and then have the other sounds or atleast indications of those sounds to another comuter so that when it receives the signal from the first computer of say a landing gear sound, it will play the landing gear sound in speakers just under the main panel or even under the floorboards. would this be a possibility?

also is it possile to add even more functionality by having certain sounds played out of specificed speakers. so for example the landing gear sound only gets played out of a single speaker instead of both. this decreases the need for extra sound cards. if not, a solution to this could be to edit the existing sounds so they have 2 channels still but one is completely blank and the other has sound.

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #7 - Nov 3^rd, 2003 at 10:46am

JBaymore Offline
Global Moderator
Under the curse of the
hombuilt cockpit!

Gender:
Posts: 10261

Quote:

also is it possile to add even more functionality by having certain sounds played out of specificed speakers. so for example the landing gear sound only gets played out of a single speaker instead of both. this decreases the need for extra sound cards. if not, a solution to this could be to edit the existing sounds so they have 2 channels still but one is completely blank and the other has sound.

Vchat,

I am not sure what you can do about the simulation's sound generation internally. My guess is that it would be hard to "unmix" it..... but I may be WAY wrong.

There are already other possibilities if you get to using multiple PC's in a homebuilt cockpit. Each of the PC's that drive a display could ALSO drive a sound card and play some sound files. Each of these computer's sound outputs could be "located" wherever you place the speakers.

There is a freeware external sound program from Project Magenta that plays various sounds on a separate PC. Do a search for Project Magenta..... and you'll find it. It is called pmSound. (Most PM stuff is payware.) It works great. And it gives you an idea of what the possibilities are.

The issue will be writing the code to make the sound simulation work. If you program in C++ or VBasic..... it is doable.....but a tad time consuming. What you would do is use FSIUIPC and WideFS to get the data about what is happening in the flight out of the sim...... and then have your remote program create sounds based on the variables being read out of the simulator.

For example..... if you looked at the variable that indicates the "state" of the gear position (most stuff you'd ever want is extracted by FSUIPC)...... you could write a program to play a .wav file of the sound of the gear moving if they are in transit, and a .wav of a "thunk" when they fully extend or fully retract. You'd need the sound files...... but those are probably around the net. The coding is actually pretty simple. Then you place that PC's speakers under the floorboards... and the gear noises come from there. Wink

My cockpit will have four PC's running it, plus the main display machine which will be running the simulator itself. So I can have up to four distinct sound sources in the cockpit over and above the sim sounds themselves. So there is a practical limit to the number of sounds that you can "separate". (You might be able to double the "point sources" if you use mono channels of the stereo setups in your programs.)

SO... hope these thoughts are of help in your planning.

best,

.....................john

Intel i7 960 quad 3.2G LGA 1366, Asus P6X58D Premium, 750W Corsair, 6 gig 1600 DDR3, Spinpoint 1TB 7200 HD, Caviar 500G 7200 HD, GTX275 1280M, Logitec Z640, Win7 Pro 64b, CH Products yoke, pedals + throttle quad, simpit

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #8 - Nov 3^rd, 2003 at 10:48am

JBaymore Offline
Global Moderator
Under the curse of the
hombuilt cockpit!

Gender:
Posts: 10261

AJ,

That is a GREAT piece of information! Thanks.

I'll have to try it sometime with two sound cards.

Let us know if as you use the PC you eventually discover some conflicts or problems that weren't evident on the first tests.

best,

.....................john

Intel i7 960 quad 3.2G LGA 1366, Asus P6X58D Premium, 750W Corsair, 6 gig 1600 DDR3, Spinpoint 1TB 7200 HD, Caviar 500G 7200 HD, GTX275 1280M, Logitec Z640, Win7 Pro 64b, CH Products yoke, pedals + throttle quad, simpit

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #9 - Nov 3^rd, 2003 at 10:59am

Vchat20 Offline
Colonel
Living in my virtual reality
so you don't have to.

Gender:
Posts: 57

well, so far ive got 2 pc's to toy with. and maybe even a 3rd. each has its own normal soundcard. and i have one extra lying around here which is also a normal soundcard but it adds an extra to whatever pc i wish. problem is getting the speakers, but I bet I can find some somewhere without a problem.

and if I also remember correctly, m not 100% sure, but fs2k4 just uses normal wave files or atleast editable sound files. so all I need to do is take pretty much all of them (I dont think there are many that require use of 2 channels) and make them either left or right channel only depending on speaker locations. and with having 3 maybe 4 soundcards to play with that means ive got 6-8 channels I can place anywhere.

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #10 - Nov 3^rd, 2003 at 1:08pm

JBaymore Offline
Global Moderator
Under the curse of the
hombuilt cockpit!

Gender:
Posts: 10261

Vchat,

In the sim you can turn various general types of sound up or down with sliders in the "Settings" part..... so that will help with this.

Let's see...... what might be a bit "obvious" with sound and placements?

Left and right sides engine noise plus flaps and spoilers(1 stereo channel)

Ground rumble and gear noises (1/2 stereo channel on floor)

Cockpit wind noise (1 stereo channel high left and right)

Copilot callouts (1/2 stereo channel .... right side)

Ground prioximity warnings (1/2 stereo channel..... located in panel)

General panel sounds (1/2 stereo channel ......located in panel)

ATC communications from sim (1/2 stereo channel..... to headset or to speaker in cabin in logical location)

Other thoughts?

best,

.................john

Intel i7 960 quad 3.2G LGA 1366, Asus P6X58D Premium, 750W Corsair, 6 gig 1600 DDR3, Spinpoint 1TB 7200 HD, Caviar 500G 7200 HD, GTX275 1280M, Logitec Z640, Win7 Pro 64b, CH Products yoke, pedals + throttle quad, simpit

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #11 - Nov 3^rd, 2003 at 1:24pm

Vchat20 Offline
Colonel
Living in my virtual reality
so you don't have to.

Gender:
Posts: 57

cant think of anything else.

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #12 - Nov 3^rd, 2003 at 3:43pm

PH_AJH Ex Member

Hi
I've flown 6 flights with online ATC now, the last two with FS9 as I got it today...no problems at all, in about 8 hours flying.
Vchat: you're talking about 2 soundcards but I have only one. My motherboard comes with an onboard sound device (they all do, don't they?) and thats what I use for playback of Roger Wilco. It didn't cost me a penny and works really good.'
Bye now
AJ

Back to top

IP Logged

Reply #13 - Jan 8^th, 2004 at 7:57pm

PH_AJH Ex Member

Hi there

Quote:

Guess what..it works!

In the control panel I activated both my DMX XFire card and the AC97 sound device that comes with my mobo. I expected this to result in a hardware conflict but to my surprise it didn't.
Then I configured Roger Wilco to use AC97 for playback, and the XFire card for recording.
Next I connected my headphone to the mobo sound output, PC speakers and mic to the soundcard.
Fired up FS2002 and Roger Wilco...bingo. All simulator sounds from the speakers, communication from the headset.

Works great. Speech is far better heard without all simulator sounds mixed with them, while all the aircraft sound are well audible but muted - like in the real world.

Just to let you know: this trick works with AVC and FS9 as well. I've flown countless hours in the last few months and it never failed me.
Cheers
AJ

Back to top

IP Logged

	Search the archive: