Simviation Forum - Boeing 707?

Reply #30 - May 5^th, 2003 at 4:58am

Professor Brensec Offline
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Quote:

ok no offence meant.

Why did NWA use both 707's and DC-8-30's

No prob, mate.

I don't know the answer to your question, though.......
I'll have to leave that for the experts. Grin

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Reply #31 - May 5^th, 2003 at 10:09pm

Felix/FFDS Offline
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When Pan Am put the 707 into service, they had a safety net in having ordered several Comet 4s for Mexicana de Aviación (then controlled by PanAm). If the 707 had flopped, the Comets would have been transferred to PanAm.

The K/V/C-135 was the "original" Boeing Model 717

The first successful jetliner would have been the AVRO Canada "Avroliner".

"The Avro Canada Jetliner was the world's first medium-range jet passenger aircraft. It first flew on August 10, 1949, two weeks after the long-range de Havilland Comet from Britain which was the first jet transport of any kind in the world.

It could exceed 800 kilometers per hour when the best piston engined transports could only do 500 kph. In the medium-range arena, aging DC-3's were still considered adequate.

On demonstration flights it wowed journalists and representatives of various airlines alike. An American newspaper warned the American Aerospace industry that the Canadian Jetliner should "Give the U.S. a healthy kick in its placidity"

It flew beautifully .

Howard Hughes borrowed it for some time and was impressed enough to ask about buying them for TWA. The United States Air Force was interested in procuring 20 Jetliners. Other offers were in the works. A great success seemed certain.

So what did Canada do?.....

C.D. Howe (of the government) sent a letter to the president of Avro, closing down the project completely. The supposed reason was that Avro could then concentrate on building CF-100's for the Korean conflict...but only a very few of these ever found their way overseas. The prototype Jetliner was used on and off for various test bed uses until 1956, at which time it was cut up for scrap. (The nose and cockpit survive, on display at The National Aviation Museum in Ottawa)."

http://www.lancerusswurm.com/avro_jetliner.htm

Felix/FFDS

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Reply #32 - May 6^th, 2003 at 11:17am

Felix/FFDS Offline
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The 707 lives on in the current 737 if not in fact in "spirit" ... the 737 took a 727 basic fuselage which in itself was the 707 upper lobe with a new lower fuselage...

Felix/FFDS

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Reply #33 - Jul 26^th, 2003 at 6:48am

EirePlane Offline
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The 707 was the biggest jet at the time that the WTC was built. The WTC was designed so that it would not collapse if one crashed into it

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Reply #34 - Aug 10^th, 2003 at 6:53am

liran_bar Offline
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Here is some info from the Israeli Air Force website:

http://www.iaf.co.il/iaf/doa_iis.dll/Serve/item/English/1.3.3.5.4.1.html

Quote:

Boeing-707
Hebrew nickname: 'Re'em' (Oryx)

The IAF's largest transport plane. The 707 was developed in the early 1950's as a transport and refueling plane for the US Navy. Its service in the IAF began in the Yom Kippur War, during which it was used for flying armed personnel to Refidim and other airfields in the Sinai. After the war, several planes were purchased from TWA and other airlines, and additional 707s were leased from the Israel Aircraft Industries.
The Boeing-707 is considered to be a highly capable heavy-duty transport. It has four engines, can carry 82 tons of fuel and remain airborne for ten straight hours.
Besides carrying passengers, the Boeing-707s have some additional roles in the IAF. One 707, for example, serves the Israeli Prime Minister and the President on their state visits abroad. From 1983 on, the Boeings began to carry out midair refueling of fighters, thus lengthening the IAF's range. Their ability as refuellers exceeds even that of the Hercules. The Re'em participated in several of the IAF's long range strikes, including the raid on PLO headquarters in Tunis. In 1991 six of the planes took part in Operation Shlomo, for bringing Ethiopian Jews to Israel.

ID
Primary role: refuel and transport
Origin: USA
Dimentions: Wingspan: 43.4 m
Length: 46.61 m
Height: 12.93 m
Wing area: 279.63 sq. m
Capabilities: Max. no. of passengers: 219
Maximum speed: 544 knots
Ceiling: 13,000 m
Range: 9,915 km
Weight: Empty: 64,048 kg
Max. loaded: 151,320 kg
Power Plant: Four Pratt & Whitney JT3D-3 engines with 8,165 kg. thrust each.

By the way.... Great Idea!

Liran Bar, Israel

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Reply #35 - Sep 12^th, 2003 at 11:56am

Gary R. Offline
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In reference to question of the B-707 Air Force 1 that particular plane served till 2001 and carried George W. on it's 444th flight as Air Force 1. It was officially retired earlier this summer fom that heavily guarded hanger at Andrews AFB. and was flown to San Bernadino Airport where it will be dissmantled and re=assembled @ the Ronald Reagan Library. Flyin Magazine, Sep.03 Page 34.

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Reply #36 - Sep 12^th, 2003 at 12:02pm

Gary R. Offline
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707 biggest jet when WTC was constructed?? I beg to differ. In 1974 the B747-200 had already been flying for several years. Ever see the movie Airport 1974???

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Reply #37 - Sep 12^th, 2003 at 12:16pm

Gary R. Offline
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Does anyone know if the 707 had a reputation as an easy hand flyer? My FS 707 is easier than any of my 737's. Just drop the slats and drop the flaps and I can grease her on anywhere that has at least 10,000 feet of blacktop. Can't do that with the 737, 767, or 777. With those it seems you have to get low and get slow at least 20nm out. It seems to me that the 747 and 727 would be similarly good hand flyers as well for I can grease them from high and fast just like the 707.

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Reply #38 - Sep 12^th, 2003 at 1:40pm

whraven Offline
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The 707 was extremely well designed as Boeing was taking quite a risk funding the development on speculation. The low landing speed was intentional, so the larger airports wouldn't have to lengthen their runways in order to serve it. In addition, rough field landing capability was included, which the prototype demonstrated. Another indication of the conservative design criteria was that it should be able to complete a flight with only one of its four engines operative.

As for the WTC design, yes, the 747 may have existed when the WTC was opened in '74. However, the design period preceded this by a number of years such that the 707 was, in fact, the largest aircraft at the time the design was completed and construction begun.

A couple of pieces of trivia I picked up:

At one point, two 707's were clipped by small aircraft within a period of about a month. Both completed their flights despite losing a portion of one of the wings. Shortly after, some wag in airline maintenance included a bulletin in the weekly dispatch notes, indicating that 707's could be dispatched with either the right or the left wing missing!

As a PR stunt, the 707 demonstrator was scheduled to fly over boat races in Lake Geneva, Wisconsin, since many airline executives were attending. On climbout, the pilot did an unauthorized 360 degree, slow roll just to show the strength and capability of the aircraft. I don't remember whether he was fired or just repremanded, but it sure impressed the execs!

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Reply #39 - Sep 12^th, 2003 at 3:27pm

Ivan Offline
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wasnt there something with the tail or so that British Airways decided to put on a ventral fin?

Some 707's had RR Conway engines, probably the ones for British Airways

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Reply #40 - Sep 12^th, 2003 at 7:59pm

Gary R. Offline
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Thanks for the facts there Rich. I stand corrected on the WTC/747/707 timeline. That is a remarkable story about the roll over Lake Geneva Wis. and the wing clip. Not suprising though that she is a durable bird. Afterall we are all well familiar with stories of the B-17's hardiness which Boeing seems to build into all their planes. They haven't laid too many eggs as yet. One can imagine how profitable a 707 with modern engines and avionics would be but then again, the 57 and 67 have similar capabilities save or range and are already up-to-date and profitable. I heard a certain celebrity owns a 707 as a private jet. I keep thinking it's John Travolta but I'm not sure. Does anyone know?

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Reply #41 - Sep 13^th, 2003 at 7:20am

Ivan Offline
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i don't know the name but wasn't that aircraft originally from Quantas?

Probably some mideast sheiks have 707's as private jets, or do they prefer something larger (L-1011)?

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Reply #42 - Sep 28^th, 2003 at 11:01pm

Wing Nut Offline
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I think this is a great idea, but wouldn't it be a better idea to make this a sticky every month instead of giving it it's own forum? Then when you change planes all you need do is unsticky it and it will fall down on it's own, while the new one is up for another month.

Also, it would need to be kept from being The Boeing Show. Airbus and other manufacturers would need to get equal time. What about vintage planes? WWII? Military? It will be very complicated unless one person is given authority.

One thing though, if it did have it's own forum, that would be a great index after a few years.

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