Simviation Forum - Helicopter$

Jan 28^th, 2003 at 8:29pm

OakRaiders Offline
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(HELICOPTER$$) Payware all of them it's putting a hole in my pockett Angry

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Reply #1 - Jan 28^th, 2003 at 8:54pm

BFMF Offline
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Then I suggest downloading some free helos Wink

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Reply #2 - Jan 29^th, 2003 at 9:19pm

robbo1 Offline
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True, and I have noticed some of the same things. However the thing that really bugs me is the quality of the payware. Freeware helos are much better than any payware one that I have found. The only reason that I am using the LZ Hawks, is that they are the only ones around. If just about anyone was to make a better hawk, the LZ would go down the tubes. There are so many problems with LZ helos, there are too many to list, and there have been no attempts to take advantage of the many new advantages of GMAX or FSDS2. Well, they do have opening doors.....
The freeware Dauphin, Hueys, Bell 222, and the aircraft that started it all, the H500 are infinitely better than any payware helicopter that I have ever seen. The only problem is this....

Freeware designers have made no Hawks, and people want good hawks. People have to buy a poor quality model. We're all getting ripped off, because we have no choice.
To prove my point, why was all of the FS2000 freeware removed from all sites? They claim it is because one of their payware products was pirated, and they dont want that to happen again. PLEASE! The fact is this, the LZ products are the same as they were two years ago, with limited modifications. If they made newer and better aircraft, then why take away their older models?
We need better aircraft, so competition will make payware designers take more care in desigining their A/C.

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Reply #3 - Jan 29^th, 2003 at 10:54pm

OakRaiders Offline
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Helicopters are my favorite aircrafts but it's to hard to find new models around ,one of the newest updated helicopters was the Bell407 (PAYWARE-$$) i got that one and it's awsome ,i wish that there where more freeware versions like that you know the Bell's like the Bell 206L longRanger .I'll give you a good one you know the AS350 just look at the fs98 version to fs2002 ones it has a new look like the rest of the 2002 aircrafts why that is i dont know???

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Reply #4 - Jan 30^th, 2003 at 5:47am

OakRaiders Offline
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It's so true!!!!!!!!! Angry

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Reply #5 - Jan 30^th, 2003 at 12:11pm

striker Offline
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I agree about Dwight Booth helicopters. I feel they are not worth the purchase. Far over-rated & he removed his freeware aircraft as a con to make people has to pay $$$ for freeware quality stuff. I would pay a little money if the helo was worth it & not just a rehash of an old freeware release.

But there are new guys out there making great freeware helo's. André Kaufhold, Antti Pankkonen, Alan Devlin among others. Charlie Young's sceneries are just great too! Rey Lopez too is making a good machine for the money & still lets' out freeware too. Booth is just small minded & greedy. I can't imagine he makes many sales as word is out.

What we need to do is encourage these guys all we can.

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Reply #6 - Jan 30^th, 2003 at 10:08pm

OakRaiders Offline
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I dont know why we have to spend money on FS2002
Helicopters it dose not make any sens i learnd that mistake Undecided

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Reply #7 - Jan 31^st, 2003 at 3:25am

Slider Offline
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Who's up for a petition against payware? lol Cry

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Reply #8 - Jan 31^st, 2003 at 6:58pm

Calb Offline
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Sorry Striker but the Lopez payware helicopter is also flawed merchandise -- a fact I pointed out when some sneak previews were posted over at FlightSim.com. But they released it anyway.......go figger.

Cal
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Reply #9 - Jan 31^st, 2003 at 10:33pm

robbo1 Offline
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I have yet to see one Ray Lopez work that is quality FREEWARE, not even close to payware. The 407 is very wrong, just a casual glance can see a big flaw.... the tail boom! It's crooked! Well, at least we are getting a new FREE Blackhawk. Mmmmmm.

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Reply #10 - Feb 1^st, 2003 at 5:46am

Slider Offline
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Alright guys here is the deal. We need to take a stand against payware (The Darkside of FS). We need to let the designers know that we will not be purchasing their aircraft. We NEED to do this people or PAYWARE will soon dominate the FS world.

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Reply #11 - Feb 1^st, 2003 at 11:45am

Jaffa Offline
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Yeah seriously. Why would I pay like half of what the game costs for just a plane or helo? If M$ can make the whole game, all the scenery, the 20 or whatever aircraft and charge 40 bucks, then how can these third party guys charge 20 bucks for just an aircraft???

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Reply #12 - Feb 1^st, 2003 at 6:14pm

Calb Offline
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I think trying to actively fight payware is wasting good FS flight time. Don't worry about it. Just ignore it -- that's the best thing you can possibly do.

Ever notice now many patches are being issued to fix broken designs. They call them "free updates"......gimmee a break. They rushed to release them and screwed up -- even the biggies are doing it now. Money, money, money, money, that's what it's all about.

So why do people have such a voracious appetite for payware? Probably boredom. If there isn't a constant flow of "new", they throw money at it. It becomes an addiction.

Rest assured, FS2002 will NOT become more realistic with any add-on, I don't care what it is.

Cal
hover long and prosper

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Reply #13 - Feb 1^st, 2003 at 6:44pm

OakRaiders Offline
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Quote:

Alright guys here is the deal. We need to take a stand against payware (The Darkside of FS). We need to let the designers know that we will not be purchasing their aircraft. We NEED to do this people or PAYWARE will soon dominate the FS world.

This is so true he's right!!!!!!!
Will all aircrafts be payware soon i hope not Cry

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Reply #14 - Feb 2^nd, 2003 at 2:24pm

BFMF Offline
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You guys forget that there are still excellent payware packages out there.

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Reply #15 - Feb 2^nd, 2003 at 9:21pm

robbo1 Offline
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Sure, for fixed wing there are FANTASTIC A/C. But rotary wing payware is somewhat lacking.

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Reply #16 - Feb 3^rd, 2003 at 9:35pm

Slider Offline
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Quote:

You guys forget that there are still excellent payware packages out there.

It's not the quality that i doubt. Its the fact that they're charging $20-40 for ONE aircraft. Maybe if they offered a package of a few different aircraft for that price, of the same quality it might be more appealing to the Customer. There is however some payware out there that is not even close to being worth the $$$. I don't have a problem with those seeing as I wouldn't download them if they were free anyways lol. Grin

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Reply #17 - Feb 3^rd, 2003 at 9:38pm

Iroquois Offline
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Paying for any flight sim addons is crazy when there are so many free ones. Paying for sim aircraft is almost like paying someone to breath their air.

I only pretend to know what I'm talking about. Heck, that's what lawyers, car mechanics, and IT professionals do everyday. Wink

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Reply #18 - Feb 3^rd, 2003 at 9:43pm

OakRaiders Offline
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Quote:

Paying for any flight sim addons is crazy when there are so many free ones. Paying for sim aircraft is almost like paying someone to breath their air.

Amen!
I learnd that the hard way paying for helicopters Undecided

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Reply #19 - Feb 17^th, 2003 at 7:54pm

xgsft Guest

Ok, heres my thoughts on payware. I really don't mind it too much. However I agree that the groups that make the stuff are getting out of hand. More and more pop up each day. It SEEMS every designer is out to make a $, rather than contribute to the hobby. Which is really a shame as this is for people who cant fly in real. I am also appauled at some of the attitudes of the people making payware. Lou, one of Dreemfleet's team, is one of the more arrogant characters i've seen. He is deffinantly in it for the $. I have emailed mircosoft and told them about the greed in the FS community and I hope they take care of the problem. I'm atleast hoping they make it harder for people to do payware. Or if they go the path of Blizzard and say no payware period. For those who wish to send Microsoft your thoughts on the current situation here is the link to comments page : http://register.microsoft.com/mswish/suggestion.asp?SD=GN&LN=en-us&gssnb=1

Have a good one all!

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Reply #20 - Feb 17^th, 2003 at 8:29pm

Slider Offline
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With the threat of hackers, i don't think having your Credit Card number on the net is even safe. At least i won't be surprised when all you guys and gal's go to use you credit card and find some interesting charges on it lol. If it happens...I told ya so Cheesy

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Reply #21 - Feb 17^th, 2003 at 11:01pm

robbo1 Offline
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Some of these addons were revolutionary for their time. A common example is the LZ Blackhawks. When they came out... they were the hottest items on the market. Now, however, they are obselete, being no match for most of the helicopters now being released, but they're still charging as much, and in some cases more, for the same obselete model.
However, I see no need to shoot down payware. The design utility for a payware AC is very expensive. A few hundred $ I believe. To pay that off, some charges must be applied. However, charging even $15 for a single aircraft seems somewhat rediculous, considering there is an unrestricted, worldwide market for your product. Making a living ripping a bunch of kids (undoubtedly the highest % of customers) off is morally wrong. This must stop.

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Reply #22 - Feb 18^th, 2003 at 9:35pm

xgsft Guest

True robbo1, I somewhat agree with no need to shoot down payware. I just think way too many people are taking that path, thats why I have gone against them and wrote MS on the subject. Personally with all the payware comming out plus the high prices, I think they brought this on themselves!

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Reply #23 - Feb 19^th, 2003 at 10:21am

BFMF Offline
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Quote:

I have emailed mircosoft and told them about the greed in the FS community and I hope they take care of the problem. I'm atleast hoping they make it harder for people to do payware. Or if they go the path of Blizzard and say no payware period. For those who wish to send Microsoft your thoughts on the current situation here is the link to comments page : http://register.microsoft.com/mswish/suggestion.asp?SD=GN&LN=en-us&gssnb=1

Have a good one all!

Oh give me a break. If you make it harder, to design an aircraft, the amount of freeware drops. What makes the MS sims the best is that you can design your own aircraft and scenery.

It's a free world. There are plenty of freeware addons out there.

Also, have you ever designed an aircraft? One gentleman designed an aircraft and to do that he had to do extensive research, he even flew around the country to do his project. It took hundreds of hours to build and took quite a bit of money to do. Now I don't see any reason why he shouldn't charge for his aircraft.

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Reply #24 - Feb 19^th, 2003 at 11:49am

Splash Ex Member

Yeah Slider, see the news today, "Intruder accesses 8 million credit card numbers". Wow!!! Excuse me while I go check my credit cards!!!!!! Grin

Splash

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Reply #25 - Feb 19^th, 2003 at 5:31pm

torquestripe Offline
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The bell 47 I downloaded(Bell47_gmax) a few days ago from simviation is GREAT. I worked on helicopters in the Navy for 15 years and when you shut down the engine and move the controls the swashplate inputs are clearly visible and very COOL. Very realistic.
The only down side is the French liveries, but this is easily overcome by the whirley birds tv show skin download. This is the best freeware helo I've seen ever and yes it is a recip engine but you should check this one out.
If you look at the tlux black hawk rotor upon shut down the blades spin the wrong way. (Minor but noticeable)

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