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FSX - AMD Phenom x4 955 BE - Windows 7 64 Bit (Read 1963 times)
Reply #15 - Oct 19th, 2009 at 10:55am

laurits   Offline
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Again...

Due respect to your unfathomable techie knowledge, but the stubbornness and arrogance you show time and time again in this field is getting tiresome, at least for ordinary FSX users like myself and probably thousands of others.

I believe my own eyes, and what they saw was OK, there IS a difference, a remarkable difference, and it's stupid of you to just brush it away like that!

Have a nice flight!


 
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Reply #16 - Oct 19th, 2009 at 11:16am

NickN   Offline
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FSX runs fine... the problem
is you or your system

Posts: 6317
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you're welcome!      Smiley



well, perhaps if you were to have both OS's set up so they are fairly matched in a resonable test setup you may see where your mistake is made in assuming W7 is that much better than XP


If you want to say that out of the box W7 is better optimized than XP, thats a fair statement, and is not always true either as hardware differences will change that result .. but what you said is XP is flat out slower than W7 in a blanket assumption which is wrong, flat out wrong


EDIT: And With XP installing SP2 after Windows installs is a no-no that has been documented to cause PCIe performance issues not to mention SATA problems

« Last Edit: Oct 19th, 2009 at 6:52pm by NickN »  
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Reply #17 - Oct 21st, 2009 at 7:45pm

Flight Ace   Offline
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NickN wrote on Oct 19th, 2009 at 10:30am:
You threw a set of wild card variables into your test that
makes the test beyond worthless for true compare


and I am going to get into it

People have no idea what they are doing and ASSUMPTION with NO TECH EXPERIENCE TO TEST such things is the mother of all rumors.

Micrsoft loves it when people dont know what they are doing, it sells more OS's

Ever stop to think there are registry changes and settings items in W7 that are already set up (MS does learn sometimes) which require the user set the same ones up manually/correctly in XP so the OS's are equally tuned and the test is valid?

and XP would then be EQUAL or better???

No?   



enjoy!



 




Nick,

I have two PCs running FSX. My old PC is running XP while the new is running Vista. My new system is running so well that an improvement in performance from windows 7, if it should happen, would be noticed only on paper since (for example) a difference between 30 to 100 FPS and 35 to 125 FPS visually for my PC would be perceived the same. You did mention registry settings in W7 that are already setup that one would have to do manually for XP in order to compare the two. I would be interested to know what these are so I could apply them to my old PC. Also, wouldn't one expect some performance improvement from Vista to Windows 7 since it has been called by some as an updated or improved Vista. And I have to say, since using Vista in my new build, I have experience zero problems with it.

I will be getting my Windows 7 from Microsoft in the next couple of weeks and will make it a point to document any change in performance.
 

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Reply #18 - Oct 22nd, 2009 at 9:46am

Flight Ace   Offline
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laurits wrote on Oct 19th, 2009 at 8:37am:
I respect your tech experience and knowledge, but in this case you are wrong!

Just made 2 separate installs of FSX on the same HP Pavilion. (AMD Phenom 9650, 9600GT 512 Mb, 4x1 800 DDR2 Ram.)

No.1 with XP 64 bit OS

No.2 with Win7 Ult. 64 bit OS

No tweaks, no defrags.

Same settings on OS and FSX.

Loaded the default Trike at Friday Harbour.

Target Frame Rate: Unlimited

All other settings at the same level for both...

Result:

XP 64: FPS ranging from 32/36 to 48/52

Win 7 64: FPS ranging from 49/54 to 62/68 and an occasional hit in the 70's!

I'm not a tech guy, but I have a pair of extremely wellfunctioning eyes, and in this case there's no doubt:

Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit version, outperforms XP 64!

Maybe on lower- and medium spec PC's there's an advantage in using W7, I don't know, but if that's the case then your experience doesn't say much, because I would guess the last time you used or tested on such a machine was in the last century! No offense intended... Wink

BTW - I'm looking for at tweak to the CFG, so it's possible to see the average FPS. Anynone know this setting?








Laurits,

This is good news. Did you try any other areas like Seattle to compare the OSs? I am looking forward to W7 and am waiting for Microsoft to ship it which will be Oct 22nd or soon after. When I receive it, I intend to document and pass on how it compares with my current Vista 64bit OS. And my expectations are for some improvement. Smiley

 

1.   Chaser MK-1 Full Tower ATX Computer Case
2.   Core i7 3770K 1155 Processor OC to 4.7 GHz
3.   ASUS Maximus V Gene Motherboard
4.   EVGA GTX580 1536MB Video Card
5.   16 GB C8 G.SKILL Low Profile RAM
6.   Noctua NH-D14 CPU Cooler
7.   240 GB OCZ Agility 3 SSD
8.   120 GB OCZ Agility 3 SSD
9.   1 TB Backup Drive
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Reply #19 - Oct 23rd, 2009 at 4:55am

laurits   Offline
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Yes, even at KSEA there are improvements compared to XP 64, but I won't go into this anymore, cause the "Resident Guru" apparently does not like people to think and experience things themselves, WITHOUT having to be a tech geek!

You don't need any complicated, scientific-like set-up between those two OS's to see the difference IMO.

Good luck with the setup, will be interesting to hear more ppl's experiences and comments on this matter.






 
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Reply #20 - Oct 23rd, 2009 at 4:04pm

NickN   Offline
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FSX runs fine... the problem
is you or your system

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laurits wrote on Oct 23rd, 2009 at 4:55am:
Yes, even at KSEA there are improvements compared to XP 64, but I won't go into this anymore, cause the "Resident Guru" apparently does not like people to think and experience things themselves, WITHOUT having to be a tech geek!

You don't need any complicated, scientific-like set-up between those two OS's to see the difference IMO.

Good luck with the setup, will be interesting to hear more ppl's experiences and comments on this matter.









The person to whom you are referring, just like most who have PhD's with 40 years of lead engineering experience in their field, know arrogant, inexperienced, layman Bullchit when they read it
and people who do not know how to install a OS, set it up correctly
and know what to do with patches
  should watch what they say because people like us will catch their inept errors every time and let them know what they did wrong


I dont want people thinking what was posted is true,
because it isn't


There have been people who KNOW what they are doing repeated this test with the correct INSTALL/PATCH process and found exactly what I said is true



http://www.simforums.com/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=31907&PID=183567#183567


Quote:
UPDATE:

I repeated the test with XP 64 bits and the conclussions are the following.

1) If you are changing form nvidia to ATI, format and reinstall OS. I've tried with driver swepper and it is NOT the same.

2) The fps are pretty much the same in every scenario I posted above

3) XP64 shows a better experience. W7 showed stutters ocassionally, especially at low fps. XP64 can handle better this situations: your eye can notice the low frames but there's no stuttering, its more fluid.

OS of choice: XP 64.





PD: Well, it could have been easier, only listen to NickN. After all, nobody's going to win his bet of 50k $ LOL






I can post 20-30 more of those at any time and probably dig up about 10-20 more on top of them



What you posted based on how you set up that test is HORSE MANURE and I wont bother posting any more about it..    



« Last Edit: Oct 23rd, 2009 at 5:06pm by NickN »  
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Reply #21 - Oct 23rd, 2009 at 8:41pm

Flight Ace   Offline
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NickN wrote on Oct 23rd, 2009 at 4:04pm:
laurits wrote on Oct 23rd, 2009 at 4:55am:
Yes, even at KSEA there are improvements compared to XP 64, but I won't go into this anymore, cause the "Resident Guru" apparently does not like people to think and experience things themselves, WITHOUT having to be a tech geek!

You don't need any complicated, scientific-like set-up between those two OS's to see the difference IMO.

Good luck with the setup, will be interesting to hear more ppl's experiences and comments on this matter.









The person to whom you are referring, just like most who have PhD's with 40 years of lead engineering experience in their field, know arrogant, inexperienced, layman Bullchit when they read it
and people who do not know how to install a OS, set it up correctly
and know what to do with patches
  should watch what they say because people like us will catch their inept errors every time and let them know what they did wrong


I dont want people thinking what was posted is true,
because it isn't


There have been people who KNOW what they are doing repeated this test with the correct INSTALL/PATCH process and found exactly what I said is true



http://www.simforums.com/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=31907&PID=183567#183567


Quote:
UPDATE:

I repeated the test with XP 64 bits and the conclussions are the following.

1) If you are changing form nvidia to ATI, format and reinstall OS. I've tried with driver swepper and it is NOT the same.

2) The fps are pretty much the same in every scenario I posted above

3) XP64 shows a better experience. W7 showed stutters ocassionally, especially at low fps. XP64 can handle better this situations: your eye can notice the low frames but there's no stuttering, its more fluid.

OS of choice: XP 64.





PD: Well, it could have been easier, only listen to NickN. After all, nobody's going to win his bet of 50k $ LOL






I can post 20-30 more of those at any time and probably dig up about 10-20 more on top of them



What you posted based on how you set up that test is HORSE MANURE and I wont bother posting any more about it..    




I just got a notice from the Microsoft Store that my W7 has been shipped. I have also reviewed some benchmarking of  XP/Vista with W7, and much to my disappointment it appears that there is very little difference in performance between the three for FSX.

Having said this, I don't believe all this hostility. I for one believe the comparison of XP with W7 on Laurits' PC as there are so many varying factors that affect the end result. He reported just how well each OS responded as has others. And there very well be a difference between lower, middle, and higher end systems, depending on their configuration, reference the effect that W7 has on performance either up or down.

When anyone says, and I quote, "there's no doubt Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit version outperforms XP 64" or and again I quote "Because Windows 7 will in no way, shape or form increase the performance of a computer under FSX use", I would be the first to challenge either statement, but in a nice way. There is a difference from just a comparison of how W7 with XP/Vista runs on any one computer and a formal benchmark of the product.
 

1.   Chaser MK-1 Full Tower ATX Computer Case
2.   Core i7 3770K 1155 Processor OC to 4.7 GHz
3.   ASUS Maximus V Gene Motherboard
4.   EVGA GTX580 1536MB Video Card
5.   16 GB C8 G.SKILL Low Profile RAM
6.   Noctua NH-D14 CPU Cooler
7.   240 GB OCZ Agility 3 SSD
8.   120 GB OCZ Agility 3 SSD
9.   1 TB Backup Drive
10. Samsung TOC 26 inch Monitor
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Reply #22 - Oct 24th, 2009 at 5:42am

NickN   Offline
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FSX runs fine... the problem
is you or your system

Posts: 6317
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People can believe what they want to believe



Honestly?,
I could care less




and laurits has been trying my patience in another forum in which he is one step away from being removed....

http://www.simforums.com/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=31916&PID=183722#183722

So as far as I am concerned I have no problem letting him have it...  here too



« Last Edit: Oct 24th, 2009 at 12:39pm by NickN »  
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Reply #23 - Oct 24th, 2009 at 6:28am
NNNG   Ex Member

 
Nick - Should I turn Superfetch OFF in Windows 7?
 
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Reply #24 - Oct 30th, 2009 at 9:39am

laurits   Offline
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Do you really expect him to answer that? Huh

Try it, and see for yourself!

People need to get off the dependency of the Guru, that's the same in real life when some dumb*sses completely give their minds and hard earned dough to types like Anthony Robbins and other loud mouths.. Angry

Here's some W7 tweaks:

http://forums.mydigitallife.info/showthread.php?t=8760

http://www.thewindowsclub.com/ultimate-windows-tweaker-v2-a-tweak-ui-for-windows...

W7 Manager:

http://www.yamicsoft.com/windows7manager/index.html

Enjoy!
 
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Reply #25 - Oct 30th, 2009 at 11:19am

NickN   Offline
Colonel
FSX runs fine... the problem
is you or your system

Posts: 6317
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<sarcasm on>

Yes.. people are all dumb-asses for asking questions


and most of all they are dumb-asses for being cautious of dim-wits who make ridiculous statements such as FSX will never run smooth or without blue screens.

<sarcasm off>




Then there are the dumb-asses that assume they are right without any understanding of what it is they are saying..   in example, there is a private message system on this forum and answering questions is sometimes best left to that system since others can read the answer and assume their system will work the same, sort of like what dim-wits do for PC optimizing since they dont understand what is being listed and what it really does/doesnt do ... and that the advice is good for any/all systems out there.






 
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Reply #26 - Oct 30th, 2009 at 11:22am

laurits   Offline
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NickN wrote on Oct 24th, 2009 at 5:42am:


People can believe what they want to believe



Honestly?,
I could care less




and laurits has been trying my patience in another forum in which he is one step away from being removed....

http://www.simforums.com/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=31916&PID=183722#183722

So as far as I am concerned I have no problem letting him have it...  here too






So no questions and individual thinking alllowed?

Tsk, tsk, this approach reminds me of some totalitarian regimes from both the past and the present!

It's damned effective, and engineers just loooove that method.

 
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Reply #27 - Oct 31st, 2009 at 11:43am

NickN   Offline
Colonel
FSX runs fine... the problem
is you or your system

Posts: 6317
*****
 


Judging by your idiotic comments here and in other forums, I bet you would say what you posted above word-for-word to a 30yr certified AL Pilot as they were trying to explain to you over the radio exactly how to land the plane after your pilot passed out in which you know as much about the aircraft you are flying as you know about computers... absolutely nothing

I'm sure surfin the net on a laptop in the cockpit would net you better instructions so you can be a individual thinker all the way down 'into' the ground



Grin Grin Grin




 
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Reply #28 - Oct 31st, 2009 at 2:44pm

pete   Offline
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issue'
Cloud Cuckoo Land

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Please guys try to remember we have a 'friendliness' policy here.

We do not want to go down the road of food throwing allowed. If you're eating in a restaurant you just want to eat and enjoy. It's exactly the same for visitors here at the SimV forums. 

Thanks  Cool
 

Think Global. It's the world we live in.
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Reply #29 - Nov 1st, 2009 at 6:53pm

NickN   Offline
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FSX runs fine... the problem
is you or your system

Posts: 6317
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No problem Pete    


The conversation as it was is closed as far as I am concerned Smiley


 
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