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Empires! (Read 644 times)
Sep 7th, 2004 at 4:24pm

Crumbso   Offline
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I just read a fascinating book about great empires of the world.

The old french empire and the British empire of old.

But the greatest one is the American empire Wink

Believe me this isn't a political comment of todays affairs it is all about american history.

Before I explain could someone who is lives in the USA to tell me the story of the Alamo?
 
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Reply #1 - Sep 7th, 2004 at 4:43pm

Scorpiоn   Offline
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In a nutshell, the Alamo was an isolated garrison for the Mexican Army during Texas' revolution.  The Texans invaded and took it (Woot!  Go team!).  Despite having just exploited it's weaknesses, which were glaringly inherent in the design, the Texans then decided they would use it as a garrison as well.  Needless to say, they were defeated (see: slaughter) by the Mexican army.  And so the saying went...

Remember the Alamo!

Much of the story is shrouded in legend and folklore tho'. Wink
 

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Reply #2 - Sep 7th, 2004 at 5:29pm

Crumbso   Offline
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Yah cause after study I realised that this was in fact a mexican state [Texas] way before. The US settlers were allowed in to stay in small numbers for trade and other business. Word of this great land reached generals and the populous and the US decided to take it. This was like slapping a bees nest though and the mexicans decided to kick some.

Very interesting story and also the US of A started off as a veeery small settlement. Much of what was owned by Britain and France and Spain at the time if the war of independance never was American territory in the first place much of it was bought of the different countries and quite a deal they got as well (it was about 2 cents every square foot I think for much of the east.)

Washington even said that the USA was an empire (his exact words were an empire of liberty) The USA even owned some off shore islands and a fair amount of south america problem was that no-one wanted to live there as the majority of citizens were immagrants and had spent much time trying to get away from these places so there were uprisings. One prime example this is the Philipenes.

After realisng this a new foreign policy arose one of not taking land per say but one taking the country in philosophy what is ironically called "Forced Liberty" which is one of cumpulsory freedom and regime change. This policy has served america well for the past century. Unfortunately no empire is going to exist without backlash and all eventually die out The French empire is dead the British empire disappeared all that is left are a few common wealth countries. I give the american empire another 100 years or so.

Isn't history interesting?

Oh yeah and don't take offence I don't think empires are bad.
 
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Reply #3 - Sep 7th, 2004 at 11:09pm

Scorpiоn   Offline
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America had very little to do with Texas.  Americans were allowed to settle in Texas for very cheap and on the agreement that they farm the land.  Once they crossed the border (Haha!  Imagine that!  Americans escaping into Mexico!), they were pretty much under Mexican jurisdiction, and on their own, granted the Mexican government was quite lenient for a while.  The Texans started to demand more, and as neither the settlers nor the government would back down, the war ensued, and finally concluded at the Battle of San Jacinto and thanks to Sam Houston. Smiley

Texas, after being it's own independent republic for some time, finally requested for stateship in the U.S.  Since we were our own country, and not just a territory, we were able to negotiate our terms of entry a bit more than other states.  For example, the Texan and American flag may fly at equal stances.  To my knowledge, all other state flags must fly in inferior positions.
 

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Reply #4 - Sep 8th, 2004 at 10:16am

Woodlouse2002   Offline
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So let me get this right? Are you saying that the American Empire is Texas? Tongue ???
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
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Reply #5 - Sep 9th, 2004 at 12:09am

Scorpiоn   Offline
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Not quite.  Wink Just correcting this:
Quote:
Word of this great land reached generals and the populous and the US decided to take it.
 

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Reply #6 - Sep 9th, 2004 at 5:12pm

Crumbso   Offline
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Thanks for correcting there but are you sure it wasn't slightly more hostile than that?
 
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Reply #7 - Sep 9th, 2004 at 5:21pm

Craig.   Offline
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Quote:
I just read a fascinating book about great empires of the world.

The old french empire and the British empire of old.

But the greatest one is the American empire

Without being insulting to our American friends i must disagree. While well established the American empire just doesnt compair to real empires like the greeks, Romans British and so on. America never truely had an international hold like the empires of old. On the other hand, what they have done within their own boundries is certainly turn it into one of the greatest countries of all times, in such a short time the settlers caught up with and soon surpassed the technological advancements of the rest of the world.
 
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Reply #8 - Sep 9th, 2004 at 5:30pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
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Quote:
  in such a short time the settlers caught up with and soon surpassed the technological advancements of the rest of the world.

They took the technology with them. It's different from catching up. And as for surpassing the rest of the world, well, it's pretty much all British and German technology. Tongue
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
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Reply #9 - Sep 9th, 2004 at 5:34pm

Craig.   Offline
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they took as much as they could, they still had to develop it and that wasnt easy when you consider they didnt exactly have the factories and work force like there was in the UK
 
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Reply #10 - Sep 9th, 2004 at 5:41pm

Woodlouse2002   Offline
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The factories were quickly built and the workforce came very quickly with immigration. And again, they didn't develop it. It was european developments that got taken over to America.

Basically, preWWII America didn't surpass many western nations technologically. And they only went ahead after WWII because they'd been given all the British inventions in the war, they'd got hold of a few german scientists and most importantly they could afford to throw the money about.
 

Woodlouse2002 PITA and BAR!!!!!!!!&&&&Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the Act made in the first year of King George the First for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King.&&&&Viva la revolution!
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Reply #11 - Sep 9th, 2004 at 7:15pm

Felix/FFDS   Offline
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No Empire is "pure" if it wants to expand.

Whereas that US may not be a colonial empire - as was the British Empire, Roman etc., it can be considered an economic empire influencing far beyond its borders.  To that extent, you can also consider Japan to be a resurgent (economic) Empire.  Land grabbing empires of old are passé, supplanted by economic empires/interests.

 

Felix/FFDS...
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