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My FS is wayyyy too slow!!!!!!!! (Read 1349 times)
Feb 18th, 2003 at 1:24pm

liran_bar   Offline
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Shalom mates!
My fs has been slow for the last couple of month....
and when I say slow I mean:
It's taking me 1 minute to load fs!
When I swich views I Usually get a huge delay of about 15 secs (sometins my computer collapses)!

please help me I am sick and tired of it!


Liran Bar, Israel
 

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Reply #1 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 1:54pm

fisharno   Offline
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Hello!

I can speak from personal experience, something you have added to your FS is bogging it down.

1) Try using Windows System Tools. Use Disk Clean-up, then Scan Disk, then Defrag.

2) Reboot your machine.

3) Shut down as many of the programs running in the background as you can to free up system resources.

Now, restart FS and see if that helped. If not, you might have to see what you added, before your simulator started running slow.
I know it's frustrating, but you just have to do a little "deductive reasoning" to find the root cause.

Good luck.
 
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Reply #2 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 2:50pm

ozzy72   Offline
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Liran, turn off your anti-virus software whilst running. It knackers things.
Otherwise everything fisharno said was bang on, especially de-fragging! Made a world of difference to my system.

Ozzy
 

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Reply #3 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 2:57pm

Fly2e   Offline
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This kind of has nothing to do with this thread but....
I run that "maintenance wizard" once a week and latley, the disc defrag will not go past 10%. I am watching the system check each cluster and something is happening but it will not pass 10%. It just keeps "restarting".  Anybody got a clue??? ???
 

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Reply #4 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 3:05pm

Cherokee_6   Offline
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Quote:
This kind of has nothing to do with this thread but....
I run that "maintenance wizard" once a week and latley, the disc defrag will not go past 10%. I am watching the system check each cluster and something is happening but it will not pass 10%. It just keeps "restarting".  Anybody got a clue??? ???


I have a suggestion....  C:\FORMAT
 

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Reply #5 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 3:15pm

FSTipster   Offline
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Quote:
This kind of has nothing to do with this thread but....
I run that "maintenance wizard" once a week and latley, the disc defrag will not go past 10%. I am watching the system check each cluster and something is happening but it will not pass 10%. It just keeps "restarting".  Anybody got a clue??? ???


1 of 2 things:


1) You've almost certainly got bad clusters on your hard drive. This is usually caused by improper shutdowns - power cutoff's (for whatever reason) generally inflicting the most damage.

You may recover the entire drive by formatting but if not, the format process will tell  you it's been unable to recover x amount of clusters and format the drive around them so that they aren't accessed (which would cause an immediate system crash/freeze).

2) You've got a severe file indexing corruption. This can occur under the same circumstances but should be fully recovered by a format.

BEFORE you set about formatting, I'd suggest that you run defrag overnight - just let it run. It may take 10-20 hours but it's possible that it might be able to sort whatever problem you have in the process - thereby saving the re-install. All depends what it is.

Good luck.

 

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Reply #6 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 3:30pm

Fly2e   Offline
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Thanks for the response. I have let it run over night , but that has been only about 10 hours. Should I let it defrag closer to 20 hours? That means I can't fly!!! Grin
Anyway, What is the process to format and where is it located in my PC? I do know that I have lost power a few times recently while my system was on.

This sounds ugly: Quote:
You may recover the entire drive by formatting but if not, the format process will tell  you it's been unable to recover x amount of clusters and format the drive around them so that they aren't accessed (which would cause an immediate system crash/freeze).


QUESTIONS :
Is it safe to do the "format" option?
what actually is it doing?
Will I lose data and/or settings?
How long does it take?  
ow do I access/run the Format program?

Thanks, Dave
 

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Reply #7 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 3:57pm

imchief   Offline
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Hey Liran.   Unfortunately, formatting results in a total loss of data.  You would have to reinstall all of your software, including your operating system, all of your drivers, and all of your personal tweaks and addons.  It is an extreme pain but most often does fix problems.  I had to this alot with my first computer. It was a packard bell.  Nice thing about that is it came with a master CD which automatically reinstalled everything.  Most good systems don't have a fix-all CD so you will have to do it manually.  If you still want to atempt this you need to get into dos promt and type c:\format.  I think that is all there is to it.  I haven't done it on my current computer and the PB had an option for formatting on the master CD.  I would give your defrag plenty of time.  I think I probably have some bad clusters aswell since my defrag takes forever to run.  I get that same 10% indication.  I have had to tweak my system sooo much to get it to work with newer games that I don't even want to attemp a format.  My Rig is over 4 years old.    Hope this helps.  I'd ask somebody else about the commands for formatting just to be sure you get the correct command.  CYA
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Reply #8 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 4:09pm

fisharno   Offline
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I'm not sure where I read it, but, the Windows system Scandisk and Defrag will continue to restart if you don't turn off all programs running in the background.

Check the FAQs on Windows.com.

I'm running Windows SE, and used to have the same thing happen. Now, before I do my monthly maintenance, I shut down those programs. Scan Disk takes the longest because I check the "Thorough Scan" and "Automaticlly Fix Errors" buttons.

2 hrs., max, for the whole affair to complete.
 
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Reply #9 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 4:33pm

liran_bar   Offline
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Quote:
Hello!

I can speak from personal experience, something you have added to your FS is bogging it down.

1) Try using Windows System Tools. Use Disk Clean-up, then Scan Disk, then Defrag.

2) Reboot your machine.

3) Shut down as many of the programs running in the background as you can to free up system resources.

Now, restart FS and see if that helped. If not, you might have to see what you added, before your simulator started running slow.
I know it's frustrating, but you just have to do a little "deductive reasoning" to find the root cause.

Good luck.



Hey again fisharno!
I have tried every thing you have mentioned and still no good....
unfortunately I don't remember what addon caused this problem therefore I will appreciate it if you let me know what addon caused your problem

thanx

Liran Bar, Israel
 

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Reply #10 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 5:04pm

fisharno   Offline
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Wow! That was a while back. I was running FS2000 at the time. But, if memory serves, I think it was either a bad scenery or panel file install.

Ever since then I have been EXTREMELY careful as to what I add to FS, and how it's done. I try not to use different utilities to install, or tweak FS. I also try to stay away from add-ons that are really large files.

If the problem persists, try to back up all of your add-on files, (scenery, panels, aircraft and utilities), on a removable disk, and remove them from your hard drive. Remove Flight Simulator using the uninstall utility on the FS disk. Then, re-install FS, and start from scratch. You can be more careful, by choosing what you know for sure won't cause problems, and discard what is questionable.

Super-Duper pain in the rear end, but, sometimes things just aren't easy.

Hope this helps.
 
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Reply #11 - Feb 18th, 2003 at 5:10pm

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Fly2e - see your private message box. Smiley
 

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Reply #12 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 12:37am

liran_bar   Offline
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I got it!
thank you (all of you)!
apparently the cause of the problem was my saved flight.... I just found out that I had over 120 saved flights.....!!!!!



Liran Bar, Israel
 

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Reply #13 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 1:11am
Andrew Parkinson   Guest

 
You know if you format, you should partition that damn drive so that FS is in the other partition. This is the way I have mine set up, and the best part? If you want to format C: again for any reason, you can, because FS 2002 doesn't install any dll's in your system folder, which is under C:. There's a set back to this though. If you want to install a program that runs with 2002, it won't find 2002 because of the registry getting wiped out, but you can reinstall fs. I have 5 partitions. If I want to reinstall FS, I just take whatever files I already have set up and move them to another partition. When FS is reinstalled, I move the folders back, overwrite, and voila, I have my flight sim back to the way it was before reinstalling!
 
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Reply #14 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 2:28am

BFMF   Offline
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120 saved flights! Shocked

Out of curiosity, how could you not know you had so many?
 
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Reply #15 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 2:42am

ozzy72   Offline
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Possibly because he was creating new ones, rather than choosing old ones regularly. I found a load of old ones the other week, some of which I have no recollection of. Maybe it was one of those beery nights...

Ozzy Tongue
 

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Reply #16 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 7:36am

Anish   Offline
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I dont know about defragmenting, but i do recomend you get the latest DirectX. version 9 (about 10mb) is currently the latest and can be obtained from the M$ website.

As for myself, i got a great boost of frames after upgrading from direct x 8 to 9.
8) 8)

Anish,
Nepal

 
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Reply #17 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 1:11pm

liran_bar   Offline
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Quote:
I dont know about defragmenting, but i do recomend you get the latest DirectX. version 9 (about 10mb) is currently the latest and can be obtained from the M$ website.

As for myself, i got a great boost of frames after upgrading from direct x 8 to 9.
8) 8)

Anish,
Nepal




Thanks Anish! never thought of that!


Liran Bar, Israel Grin
 

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Reply #18 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 2:02pm

liran_bar   Offline
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Quote:
I dont know about defragmenting, but i do recomend you get the latest DirectX. version 9 (about 10mb) is currently the latest and can be obtained from the M$ website.

As for myself, i got a great boost of frames after upgrading from direct x 8 to 9.
8) 8)

Anish,
Nepal



the kid knows what he's talkin' about! My framerate has increased alot!!!!!!!!
 

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Reply #19 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 4:56pm

nurseman   Offline
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HI  ALL  FS  2002  WORKS  BEST WIN  XP  PRO  AND
250   MEMORY  ATLEAST
 
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Reply #20 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 9:22pm
Andrew Parkinson   Guest

 
Hey Nurseman:

It may be possible that it works best on XP, but my understanding of XP is that it's an OS that was built primarily for business purposes-not gaming. This holds true for Windows 2000 as well. I run it on 98 and my frames rates are just honky dory! I'm glad I didn't upgrade to XP because who in their right mind wants, and correct me if I'm wrong over 1/2 gig of patches? Certainly not this guy. XP is bloatware, and Microsoft does it to stroke the back of Intel. Microsoft claims it's because of features people wanted-sure, whatever. Maybe some people believe that, but this guy certainly doesn't! It's so people will go out there and buy Pentium's but most gamers know AMD's outperform Pentiums in gaming-it's in the benchmarks. Pentium, on the other hand, outperforms AMD in business applications. Again, benchmarks prove it. I emailed the marketing guy at Nvidia because on their first page they had the same rhetoric as Microsoft-GeForce 4 optimized for Pentium! I told this guy in my email that I wouldn't put all of my eggs into one basket-that it was just a stupid business practice. I also told him that most gamers know AMD's outperform Pentiums and told him that the benchmarks prove it.  I then asked him what would happen when the rest of the world finally realizes this? Nvidia took this rhetoric off their page! I may not have an MBA, but I know a bunch of crap when I see it.
 
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Reply #21 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 9:37pm

FSTipster   Offline
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With respect, I think you're getting a little confused in terms of the Operating Systems.

Windows 2000 is unquestionably an application (read business) orientated OS. Windows XP, whilst built around the NT kernal, is not.

There are huge amounts of core coding that were completely re-written for XP. It's not just Windows 2000 with patching for home use.

I'd never recommend Win2000 for gaming, whereas XP is just fine. Whether, overall, it's better or worse than Win98 based OS's in terms of gaming performance is arguable. Personally, I've seen no difference and I run a dual boot system with WinXP Pro and Win98SE loaded. The major difference lies in system stability. No blue screens of death in WinXP - period.
 

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Reply #22 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 9:49pm

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Quote:
No blue screens of death in WinXP - period.


Well, I've had a few! Pretty rare, though. XP is still the most stable OS I've used.
 
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Reply #23 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 9:48pm
Andrew Parkinson   Guest

 
Hey Tipster:

No, I don't believe I am getting confused. XP was primarily designed for business use. It's just a difference of opinion, but that is my understanding. You see, when new things come out, I don't blindly go out and purchase it because it's new. Some people do. And there were quite a few things I found about XP and everyone of them mentioned something to the effect of primary use-business. I know the stability is there, I run XP Pro at work, but I certainly wouldn't use it for gaming. As stated earlier, just a diffenence of opinion, but I do have experience with it-quite a bit. Should visit our website: www.kljsolutions.com We build primarily web-based apps. It's not like I don't know what I'm talking about.
 
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Reply #24 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 9:56pm

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Quote:
Well, I've had a few! Pretty rare, though. XP is still the most stable OS I've used.



I can honestly say I haven't had one since I installed it over 6 moths ago. However there's nothing perfect and I'm not suggesting XP is. I've no doubt been lucky, but it is, without a doubt, the most stable issue of Windows to date.
 

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Reply #25 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 10:02pm
Andrew Parkinson   Guest

 
Yep, it is stable, but it is the most securtiy vulnerable OS Microsoft ever put out. Have you ever been to Steve Gibson's website? Go to www.grc.com ; A lot of really interesting articles there, and the man is SMART! It was because of his work that Norton Internet Security and others now have a default block in the firewall for UPNP-Universal Plug N Play. You should download his little app to see if yours is activated. You can disable it with his app and reenable it. The app is like 22 kb. Don't confuse this with Plug N Play folks.
 
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Reply #26 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 10:06pm

FSTipster   Offline
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Quote:
Hey Tipster:

No, I don't believe I am getting confused. XP was primarily designed for business use. It's just a difference of opinion, but that is my understanding. You see, when new things come out, I don't blindly go out and purchase it because it's new. Some people do. And there were quite a few things I found about XP and everyone of them mentioned something to the effect of primary use-business. I know the stability is there, I run XP Pro at work, but I certainly wouldn't use it for gaming. As stated earlier, just a diffenence of opinion, but I do have experience with it-quite a bit. Should visit our website: www.kljsolutions.com We build primarily web-based apps. It's not like I don't know what I'm talking about.


Well, differences of opinion are what make us different people Smiley.

However, I'm still puzzled as to why you wouldn't use it for gaming. Whatever your beliefs about it's primary role as a business OS, I for one can say that it runs games (and not just FS2002) perfectly well. Some of the outdated stuff requires the compatibility feature but that's about it.

When I first got XP, I had dual installations of several games on Win98Se and XP Pro to see how they compared. Performance wise, the only game that ever ran better on Win98 (out of the 3 dozen or so I have) was Need For Speed 5, and that was later resolved by updating my graphics drivers.

Allowing for the fact that hardware and software setups produce differing results for different people, my own experience is that you get the same performance with increased stability. I now only use Win98 purely for DOS.
 

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Reply #27 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 10:32pm

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Hey Parkinson, thats a pretty slick idea you have with the partition. Wish you had mentioned that 3 reformats ago for me! Pain when you have to and load ALL those airplanes back in each time. Btw, is the correct format command " format c:\" ?
 

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Reply #28 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 10:42pm
Andrew Parkinson   Guest

 
Hey Tipster:

I know some of the games really do run fine on XP.
As you mentioned, difference of opinion makes us different people. I don't really have any outdated stuff, except for some of the games that I run. It's probably the main reason why I don't go with XP, but certainly not the only reason. Did you go to Steve Gibson's page and download that app I mentioned? You really should. To my surprise, the UPNP was activated on the XP machine at work. It isn't anymore. It's a serious vulnerability, and you really should go to www.grc.com and download Steve's Unplug N Pray app.

Tipster, I thank you for your suggestions and info about your experience with XP. It's clear to me that you are a man, not a child. For if you were a child, you would be, well, not so gracious-for the younger crowd this isn't meant as a demeaning comment.  It is appreciated and refreshing. Cheers, Tipster, have a good one, and if you do get that app I mentioned, please post here if your UPNP was activated. If you have an updated firewall, in all likelihood, it is deactivated. Best to you, Tipster.
 
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Reply #29 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 11:38pm

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Thanks for your kind remarks Andrew.

Asi it happens, I've already got a similar app together with Leaktest and XPdite. All useful tools in XP. I ran them prior to installing SP1 and 2 and they were required at the time.

I'm not sure if MS has plugged those gaps in the service packs as mine were already closed, but I doubt they did anything about the Plug and Play vulnerability.

I run ZA Pro 3 as a firewall with another one behind it which I've never needed thankfully.

All the best.
 

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Reply #30 - Feb 19th, 2003 at 11:55pm
Andrew Parkinson   Guest

 
I see you have been there. I like the shields up test and the leak test-very useful! Have a good day, Tipster-I'm assuming you live in the U.K.? Whilst is a word you used and it seems to me that the English use this a lot. Either way, English or not, take care Tipster. Your experiences with games on XP were appreciated.
 
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Reply #31 - Feb 21st, 2003 at 12:04am

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Prior to my weekly maintance scedule with the Maintaince Wizard I turn off all background programs
on my PC with the small utility End It All.Takes about
90 minutes or less to defrag my PC.Also use End It All
when I run FS2002.

greenie Grin
 
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Reply #32 - Feb 21st, 2003 at 12:10am

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Quote:
I see you have been there. I like the shields up test and the leak test-very useful! Have a good day, Tipster-I'm assuming you live in the U.K.? Whilst is a word you used and it seems to me that the English use this a lot. Either way, English or not, take care Tipster. Your experiences with games on XP were appreciated.


English I am Smiley, but I reserve the right to claim to be Brazilian if it gets me a free coffee and some nuts!  Wink Grin
 

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Reply #33 - Feb 21st, 2003 at 12:41am

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This might sound obvious, but alot of peolple overlook turning off the screensaver while runnning defrag.  Everetime the screensaver kicks in, it cause the defrag to start over.  This is true for Windoze 98. 

I recalled that in some case, 98 will report 10% framgmation reguardless of how many time you defrag.  It's some kind of bug.  You can locate the article in their knowledgebase at http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=fh;[ln];kbhowto


Another suggestion to save time and aggravation is to use software like Ghost or Drive Image to back up your drive.  I do this everytime before I install anything.

-Crater
 

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Reply #34 - Feb 21st, 2003 at 11:29am

Fly2e   Offline
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Thanks everybody for your suggestions. I actually let the system defrag without any interuptions and it took 21 hours. That was long ! I could see it was "working it out" and it did!. Yeah, I always shut all background programs down and Yes, Cratemaker is right, You do need to shut off the screensaver. (I don't use one). Grin



 

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Reply #35 - Feb 21st, 2003 at 12:44pm

fisharno   Offline
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Hey guys;

I've been following this thread from the beginning. I never thought about partitioning my hard drive. That could have saved me allot of wasted time.

Talking about shutting down background programs.....

Where can I find the "EndItAll" app?

I've been manually terminating the bkgd apps. And, I usually miss one or two, and have to restart the Maintenance Wizzer.

I actually learned a thing or two here.

Thanks, loads.
 
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Reply #36 - Feb 21st, 2003 at 3:02pm

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End It All Version 2 can be downloaded at the PC Magazine Website:http://www.pcmag.com/category2/0,4148,2130,00.asp


I use Version 1 for sims and both Version 1& 2 when I defrag my PC.

greenie
 
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Reply #37 - Feb 21st, 2003 at 3:55pm

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Just a word of warning folks - there's no mention of Windows XP support for EnditAll - either version.

XP, whilst built around the NT Kernal, has some major coding differences to both NT itself and Win2000.

If any of you are using this in XP, I'd be interested to hear the results but if not, I'd do a system restore point before trying it.
 

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Reply #38 - Feb 21st, 2003 at 8:49pm

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Good point Tipster.In the future I will mention my O/S
2000 ME.

greenie Grin
 
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